Hey so obviously Ice nova has the most damage output by far of the three talents, but Ive noticed that players are starting to try to counter it, which is quite easy to do. For example, using Feint at the start of your Ice nova gcd. Essentially this puts your Ice nova on cooldown and makes you waste all your burst damage, which really sucks. Another thing people do sometimes is run towards their healer when you start casting barrage which will obviously break a poly, and there's nothing u can do about it. So either you don't burst or u only burst when a druid clones the healer.
I think this will become more of a problem as time goes on and people learn more.
What do you guys think, have you experienced this and do you think enough of it will make frostbomb?
Not really, a lot of people watch competitive games like league and csgo because the difference between pro plays and normal plays has a massive difference compared to mmos. So those streams will be popular because they are entertaining while at the same time very educational as far as bettering yourself in the game. But mmos aren't meant to be watch and learn, at least as much as other games, it's more about just playing it yourself.
When I use to play league I could sit and watch a stream for hours and learn a million different things while also being entertained but when I go to watch a wow stream it's just someone sitting waiting for a que for 90% of the time and the other 10% is just watching the same strats and play style of any streamer.
Expanding on the play style subject if you told me to watch dilly stream and Glinkz and tell me to pick whose stream is whose just off the plays alone you couldnt. But if you show me a bjergson stream and scarra stream I could tell you whose is whose in the first 5 mins because of how different you can play the game.
Sorry if what I said makes no sense I'm on my phone
Anything that highlights the differences between player skill levels? Even the RNG one like dispel, sacred cleansing, skillherald, elemental shaman?
Ok, we don't have the same vision of what can be a "difference" between 2 players. Everything that can change a game by rng is not a depth in the gameplay or "skill" whatever you call it. It's just having luck or not.
"Great, his shatter combo missed entirely because i was lucky."
"Damn, the elemental shaman proc'd a lot"
"What, he purge my BoP with one gcd with all these trashs buffs?"
"Ok, go swticWTF PROC MACE"
"Yeah, i don't have to spam mindlessly my cleanse, i got the nova in the first time"
"A good mage would have been more lucky than this bad one."
(I'm not defending WoD too - i have to say this because people in AJ seems to be more simple-minded than the WoW Forums)
There was a time where reading wasn't just for fags.
I still firmly believe that (using BC as the starting point) making hybrids viable as damage dealers, and the introduction of DK's, threw the game too far out of whack to balance.
Traditionally, the meta revolved around having 1 dps whose strength lied in control and utility. With hybrids getting more viable damage levels stemming from Blizzard's changes to make all DPS specs viable in PvE, they had to start balancing other classes around that fact for PvP.
As an example, on paper, if something like a feral or a ret could do as much damage as a warrior, but have offheals, dispels, more cc, and other utility spells, how could something like a warrior compete? For years Blizzard has made attempts like straight increasing damage to mongo levels, to giving them ridiculous amounts of control. Warriors could never fit back into the archetype of 'if he can connect to you and stay healed you'll get raped'. You can't simply tone down the mobility of them because all of the other classes have so much in their kits to stop them that they could essentially be kited forever, with exceptions such as freedom.
Same for DK's. While they're not hybrids, they had way too much in their kit when they were introduced to the game. They could rez partners in arena, heal themselves and partners to full, chain aoe 'fear', have multiple forms of magic immunity, a gap closer in grip, a silence, a kick, how are you supposed to balance other damage dealing classes around all of that? Yea a lot of the most egregious stuff got removed, but other classes got tuned first to try and be brought up to that level.
TLDR Blizzard wanted to keep their PvE game progressive by adding new fun skills and making hybrid damage specs viable. While I'm not saying they shouldn't have done that because it makes sense to evolve the game, but permanently fucked over any chances of balance. Every specs kits are now way too big, and the results show that some classes being just slightly tuned too much fuck everything up royally.
Next expansion focus entirely on bringing classes back to their BC archetypes. Priest were the offensive damage dealing healers, druids were the control-oriented healers, shaman's had defensive utilities, and paladins had offensive utilities. Rogues reigned supreme as the control oriented class for melee and were good against casters for that reason but could get dicked by warriors, and warriors were the number one damage-dealing melee class with poor mobility and control. Hunters were designed as a ranged class and had a kit with balanced utility to reflect that. They didn't do too much damage but still had enough to deal with warriors and rogues.
Start with that as your base and tune numbers from there. Hybrids are the most difficult to balance around as they shouldn't be the 'best' at anything due to their nature. I still personally feel like they don't have a place in arena because they have too much potential to be imbalanced simply because they're not intended to fit into a niche role. Dk's should also be removed from the game as they are too difficult to balance around.
My TLDR is actually longer than the rest of my post. It's early and I'm still feeling pretty groggy. Hopefully some of this makes sense, I'll look at it later to make it more coherent if I feel like. None of these ideas haven't been discussed when Wrath came out. None of this will actually happen. The game will never be balanced and players will continue to rant and make suggestions in an echo chamber out of boredom until they find something better to do. Call me an idiot.
Was there some NDA regarding the PvP summit that happened or did I just miss out on those players' feedback?
Why isn't there some rich Yaspresents type person who can just pay some designer nerd to make a completely new arena based game that is a straight ripoff of WoW and just make sensible balance changes from there. Someone should win the lottery and finance a project to do what Valve's done with DoTA.
last edit: Blizzard should ask themselves: What would make arena better? Answer: More comps, and toning down out-liner comps, one small hotfix at a time.
I actually think this is the exact wrong answer. Balance is not the main problem with arena. There are balance issues, sure, but the problem is that the changes over the years have led to gameplay which is far too scripted to be fun.
More viable comps, more balance, these are red herrings which we as a community have tried to chase for way too long. Arena was great even when only a handful of comps were viable, because the comps really played dramatically differently. Making everyone the exact same and then proclaiming that every comp is viable is a pyrrhic victory.
I seriously cannot understand why so many people this season are obsessing over the title cutoffs and how they are changing from hour to hour. It's impossible to determine exactly what rating will end up being the minimum for glad/r1 so just que up and play the damn game, holy shit.
cata also started the player mentality that if i lose its because the team that i lost to is cheating/broken/overpowered/dumb/blizzard sucks, lets go and complain on forums about them, rather then if i lose, what can i do better to win next time
finally, cata was the expansion when playing to make money overtook playing for fun as the main motivation for playing at the high end
if you think any of that is good then exDee
I agree so much with this. Everytime someone loses because he got kicked on 0,1 he's like "omg this guy interrupt hacks". Or if they land everything really well they also accuse of cheating.
I feel really bad about the legit high rated russian players because every move they do is considered a script by others. I can't deny it's often that the case , but it's impossible that everyone fucking hacks.
Just remember all these nice vids of people pre-kicking stuff and all that. People were so amazed but yet they believe only then it was legit, it can't be done anymore.
Pvp died with mop in terms of skillfull gameplay > comp. Only thing that should be left untouched is DPS rotations , rest of spells and toolkits all classes have should be reverted to Cataclysm
why would u revert to cata?
That would literally just start the terrible process again because everyone would have kicks, dispels, too many instant casts etc. I mean, it was certainly playable and skill based, but mechanically it already got the ball rolling for the growing mess.