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Member Since 12 Sep 2008
Offline Last Active Mar 06 2013 07:26 PM

#3857892 PvP Interview with Greg Street & New PvP Game Designer Brian Holinka

Posted Creamo on 06 March 2013 - 01:04 PM

Who better than an irl pvper to balance pvp?

#3857838 PvP Interview with Greg Street & New PvP Game Designer Brian Holinka

Posted Twocat on 06 March 2013 - 09:08 AM


Brian Holinka worked on the multiplayer components of Transformers: Fall of Cybertron, Homefront, and Frontlines: Fuel of War.

Nearly as bad as hiring a marine biologist to balance your game.

#3857833 PvP Interview with Greg Street & New PvP Game Designer Brian Holinka

Posted Zong on 06 March 2013 - 08:55 AM

There's nothing in this interview we haven't heard before, they just recycle the same shit but never really say anything new. (except hopefully nerfing knockbacks on X,Y maps)

burst is still too high/easy and they're oblivious to it.

#3857760 PvP Interview with Greg Street & New PvP Game Designer Brian Holinka

Posted Donald on 06 March 2013 - 05:56 AM

i'm so jaded to these "pvp interviews." it's like a politician with memorized answers and talking points.

what's the point!?

#3854096 Rambojohny caught red handed

Posted hearthadinlol on 27 February 2013 - 10:06 AM

wintrading is where I draw the line, now thats just fucked up

#3551975 Why not 1v1 arena?

Posted Shmdjk on 16 November 2011 - 08:43 PM

decent mage would win anything

#3852759 5.2 honor gear non sense

Posted Salutations on 23 February 2013 - 05:12 PM


they are so bad that they only have 10 million subscribers

10M was at the beginning of WoTLK, they lost almost 2M subscribers during Cata and it continues with MoP.
Just check arena participation.

Populated BG.
Wotlk : 45/40 glad slot
Cata : 30/35 glad slot
MoP : 15/20 glad slot

Shit BG :
Wotlk : 25 glad slot
Cata : 15 glad slot
MoP : 3 glad slot

says everything about how shit this game actually is and why everyone use bot.

#3852621 5.2 honor gear non sense

Posted fant0m8 on 23 February 2013 - 08:27 AM

View PostMattadoro, on 21 February 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

with so many ppl having 7 alts and bots the crappy honor gear can be a deterrent to the fotm swappers each tiny patch and thats one aspect i kind of enjoy.  how many people do you know that  have talked about playing 4 different classes each week based on ptr notes and keep changing their mind.

with the gap in gear closing prepare to face the same people swapping to counter comps all day

i feel like the only reason we see so many kfcs and shadow warr teams lately is because every joe has an alt warrior or shadow and it never used to be like that.

those alts having less gear was the only glimmer of hope during tfb stacks so be very careful what you wish for

unless your that guy that plays w/e dominates each small hotfix

then enjoy!

Why should people not switch classes to win? We're not RPing here. It's a competitive game and if you make arbitrary rules for yourself ("I'm not going to switch to this stronger class in PVP because it's not honorable", etc) then you're just being a scrub.

#3852025 5.2 honor gear non sense

Posted Hackattack3 on 21 February 2013 - 04:30 PM

View PostBidj, on 19 February 2013 - 09:29 AM, said:

The Patch 5.2 Malevolent gear may have more PvP power and Resilience, but Patch 5.1 Malevolent gear has higher Item levels and as such stats. To have more clarity on this you can read the below comparisons:

5.1 Malevolent Gear has a higher ilevel than 5.2 Malevolent Gear.
5.2 Malevolent Gear has more PvP Power/Resilience than 5.1 Malevolent Gear.
5.1 Malevolent Gear
483 ilevel (491 with 2/2 upgrades)
~30 ilevels of PvP Power and Resilience
5.2 Malevolent Gear
476 ilevel
~36 ilevels of PvP Power and Resilience

In the end, the effective Ilvl of patch 5.2 and 5.1 Malevolent gear puts them at about equal. The reason for lowering the item level and increasing the PvP stats for the 5.2 version of Malevolent gear is because we want players to run 5.0 LFR, this means that the Ilvl of honor gear needs to be lower than the entry requirement of 483. The result of this was lowering the Ilvl (stats) of the gear, but increasing it's PvP power and resilience to compensate. That difference in power you feel is going to be extremely prominent, is actually quite minor.

Posted like 4 or 5 days ago.

The difference will be near to non existent ; if you lose your games against opponents with only 8 more ilvl, you probably deserve it. And while still being at a little disadvantage at the beginning of the season, you will be able to compete at 2k2+/2k4+ without a problem and the gap in gear will narrow very quickly as the season pass.


The problem was the huge gap between dreadful --> mal.  Mal 0/2 ----> Mal 2/2 was minor.  We've never lost a 3s game and been like "ohh shit we need to upgrade more" but we have definitely said "need to get out of some of those blues".  When you are talking close to 20 ilevel diff between pieces of gear that's HUGE.  

I am completely fine with SLIGHTLY rewarding players that play more than me, as long as I can overcome that disadvantage with better play.  Having a dreadful -> mal advantage should not exist.  As someone said this is an MMO.

Healers should be bitching and dps is FINE.  Most dps classes are stacking pvp power anyway when you are in full mal (casters pushing near 20k sp).  Pvp power for healers sucks and they still need int/spirit for output.

Buff healers 5.2 mal gear.

#3851612 Tone down burst JK BLIZZARD!

Posted Feliclandelo on 20 February 2013 - 01:23 PM

I think you're taking it a little bit out of context here. I mean, most of the damage buffs are for specs that are rarely ever seen in PvP.  You have assasination, elemental (which frankly could use a buff), marksmanship, demonology (shadowbolts) and balance.

Some might argue, sure, there are balance druids out there, but as soon as resto becomes viable most of them will dissapear, also wrath and starfire are pretty hard to cast since most people train the druid, and wrath does already low damage and starfire is just too long of a cast.

The only noticible buffs that might be considered a bit strange are probably shadow priests gaining a +5% dmg increase and to some extent DK's getting a 30% increase on dots.

I really think you should actually reflect over the changes and check them out first, before you start creating a childish topic about it.

#3852672 and you thought stampede was bad

Posted Another on 23 February 2013 - 12:26 PM

blood plague ticks for 10k with full procs on ptr, and it's getting nerfed by 15%. would be nice if people would stop posting random shit here, 99% of topics are useless

#3849109 Balance is not the biggest problem, systems are

Posted Crawthz on 14 February 2013 - 06:39 PM

Increase arena activity by implementing titles from 1500-2400. RBG activity has gone way up and it's rewarding. Think about the PvE player who joins RBG's and gets title for every 2nd game he wins? I think he finds it way more satisfying than arenas.

Add arena titles from earning rating every season which are wiped off at the end of season, ranging from 1500-2400
Add season specific Arena Master titles - Malevolent Arena Master for example, wipe it off at end of season
Keep the Challenger, Rival, Duelist and Gladiator as they are

Currently PvE takes so much of your gametime if you want to play it that there is no time for doing arenas except for the cap. And even if you cap, you will still face full geared players with RBG t2 and you feel shit and quit. Adding reward system to incite low level players while keeping the high-end achievements and titles the same would certainly drive some PvE players more into arena and would increase activity all together.

I know most of you will say "fuck titles, who cares?" Well, there are people who actually do care(PvE players), like the players who quit this season because there's nothing to gain, nothing to aim for because you get roflstomped by the players who only do PvP. Getting rewarded even by a title every 100 or 200 rating in arenas would, in my opinion, increase the whole arena activity.

#3849080 Balance is not the biggest problem, systems are

Posted Hackattack3 on 14 February 2013 - 05:51 PM

View PostRegent, on 14 February 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

At 2.1k queues just don't pop. 30 minute queues for 2 points. The problem stems from people just giving up on arena.

I agree with this.

Arenas have been slowly losing popularity with the "tweener" players who hoover 1500-2.2k mmr.  I personally do not believe that arenas will regain popularity unless RBGs are removed from the game.  It's just a much easier alternative to getting gear, titles, achievements.

#3849047 Balance is not the biggest problem, systems are

Posted Braindance on 14 February 2013 - 04:45 PM

No I don't agree with unranked mode - instead they should give more incentives for playing ranked like more titles, or bring back titles in 2s which is by far the most active bracket.

#3849040 Balance is not the biggest problem, systems are

Posted Thaya on 14 February 2013 - 04:33 PM

Foreword: please read the entire post before commenting. I was a little bit too quick to post it, and as a result of adding ideas and thoughts to it, it's now a little hard to follow: I start with an example before explaining the main problem (inductive reasoning). All the important stuff is at the end.

Ever since WotLK ended, I've had the opinion that the problem of WoW PvP is not balance, but the systems. In fact, the things I'm going to talk about have always been in place, I just didn't notice them because I enjoyed random battlegrounds, skirmishes and 2v2 up until Cataclysm. I don't want to make this a nostalgia thread or a rant on bringing back skirmishes, but a few words have to be said about skirmish: reintroducing skirmish arenas, with the way the game has evolved since they were last active, would be a stupid decision. Back in WotLK individual skill was a much bigger factor than it is today - this is both due to developer decisions and players getting much better in these 4 years - arena is all about team synergy now, individual skill doesn't even fascinate anybody anymore. A single player just won't be able to make enough of a difference on his own to make it fun in the slightest, perhaps with the exception of one or two specs, and I'm not even going to talk about the obvious problem of team compositions and how predictable it will be. If they are reintroduced in the original implementation, people will play them for a short while, and then it will just be another dead area of the game.

Let's forget about the other PvP modes for now and focus only on arenas - it is a little game of its own, there's nothing that feels or plays quite like it, and it has a community of its own.

A huge problem with the arena system is that there is only one, ranked, mode. I believe it applies to everybody, or at least the vast majority, that you're not always in the mood to play serious, to play to win. And I believe every arena player has been in a situation where you wanted to try playing with some other people or your friends - just for fun - but couldn't due to being locked to their "serious" team. The real reason people want skirmishes back is because arena players simply don't have anything to do when they're not in the mood to play serious, or when their team mates are offline, or whatever other reasons not to play ranked. Ever noticed how many people buy Arena Pass just to be able to mess around without putting their live ratings in danger? it's always a very short sparkle of interest, because AP isn't really that good of a solution, but it's a good example of what people want.

And so, why not do the obvious thing, the thing that exists in several other super popular games?

Unranked mode.

Give it a a matchmaking system to match equal teams, but no ladder and no statistic tracking at all. No need for teams too, just let any party of 3 queue for it, even cross realm parties. Characters will still have MMR attached to them, and the average of that MMR will be used for the party - imagine it as if a temporary arena team is created. It just won't matter, it won't give rewards, it won't be displayed on the UI, the matchmaking system will extend its search range a lot quicker (aim for 2-3 min queues tops, even at the cost of equal matchups), and there will be no competition based around it. An organized skirmish, that's exactly what it should feel like.

Firstly, this will be a less serious environment to play in for the veterans, a polygon to run new teams or just play for fun, something you can queue any time of the day carelessly, something you don't have to commit to. And secondly, this would be a wonderful thing for new PvP players. It's just like the real thing, but without the pain of losing; I know people who tried arena, sucked due to being new, and never touched it again because they just kept losing. WoW arena has a very steep learning curve at least due to the amount of information you need to memorize and get used to before you really feel like you understand what's going on, being put straight into a competitive environment makes it that much harder; on top of that, gear is a much bigger factor than it's ever been, but let's discuss this another time.

Now, since I've touched the subject of new players... Let's go back to the real world where PvP isn't just arenas. The general consensus on AJ is "who cares about random BGs", but it is so much more important for the game overall than people think. Random BGs is the first place people unfamiliar with PvP go to, not only because of gear, but because it's the only type of PvP you can queue solo for. This is where they get their opinions about the PvP side of the game, and do you honestly think it's a good one if every second active poster here is botting, and some of you even actively support it? If I continue this subject I'll have to repeat myself a lot from an earlier thread about honor and battlegrounds, but key points were: the honor grind must be shortened A LOT, it's totally wrong that getting starter PvP gear takes so long; winning/losing shouldn't be as important as it is (random is random); and botting should be at least risky and more complex to use than it is today.

Another problem with the systems is how weird the matchmaking system is. Why do you sometimes not get a high rated team from your realm that you KNOW is queueing, and instead get 10 min queues into a team 700 rating below you? Why do you sometimes experience the opposite and get the same team 3-5 times in a row when you KNOW there's other teams queueing, and you even have to sit and wait for them to finish their game when they bump into somebody else? Why do battlegroups still exist even though it's been many years since it's possible for cross battlegroup matchups? all battlegroups do now is slow down queues for everybody and give out free rank 1 titles from 5v5 shares. Why does it take years to fix an exploit in the RBG MMR system, an exploit that people made thousands of euro on, and even humiliated Blizzard by making 5000 rated level 1 characters for the purpose of advertising? Why do RBGs have a much, much better effort:reward ratio in a game that's based entirely around character/gear progression? RBG is easier for the individual player and gives everything that arena does plus more (higher cap), that's wrong on so many levels. Imagine how all of this mess looks like to new players.

It is the oldest and ugliest system in the game by far, it's had so many things built on top of it and patched that it's just an archaic abomination.

There's so many great ideas out there. It doesn't even have to be unranked mode - that's just my take on it and an idea I haven't seen discussed before. Think about weekly challenges/tournaments with rewards - regular 100k gold tournaments would be intense. Introduce observing, at least in ghost mode like on a certain private server, but preferably more like the 5.2 Brawl (can keep it tournament-only). Introduce a best-of-3 mode for it, and allow it to be used in wargames.

Think about getting rid of end of season rewards completely. End of season rewards only promote cheating and boosting by now, and their value as an achievement of skill diminished to the point they're almost irrelevant. You could replace them with the aforementioned tournaments, or do other things like temporary per-season achievements that turn into FoS (f.ex. a new Arena Master per season, Flawless Victor, 2.2/2.4/2.7 per season). You know how fun it is for new players to get a RBG achievement every 100 rating they advance? Imagine if Arena had something similar, and you got Gladiator at say 2.5k, Duelist at 2.2, etc. And the seasons are really short so it doesn't get stale - you don't NEED TO introduce a new title and set of gear every single season.

Think about reintroducing 2v2 in some shape or form (f.ex. with a healing debuff, because right now healer/dps vs healer/dps is impossible), with rewards or achievements to it, especially something for the newer and less experienced players - 2v2 is actually one of the greatest and easiest ways to learn other classes as well as a great way to pass time when bored, it solves nearly every problem I mentioned here.

The way PvP works right now doesn't allow new players to enjoy the game. This is my entire point with this post. The biggest and most important reason that arena activity is dying is that old players are quitting, but no new players are picking up WoW PvP because it sucks to play with randoms and tank down to 1k rating on your first session. There is no "entry level" in WoW PvP, you're thrown straight into ranked 3v3 where you get crushed by people fully geared and most likely with years of experience because WoW PvP hasn't really attracted players for years. THIS is what needs fixing, and it's much more important than balance.

I'm not saying that balance is irrelevant, but no matter how good and balanced the game will be, it will never attract new players if the systems stay the way it is. There's a couple of very good changes in the patch - they fixed gear progression, which was the reason S12 had half the active teams compared to S11 (despite being a fresh expansion), and they also listened to our complaints about rating decay - we haven't even fully acknowledged how huge that change will be. Ultimately I'm making this thread in hopes to motivate them to work the PvP systems more, I imagine it's an easier task than balancing and is more useful at the same time.

Most of these won't even require too much developer work hours, and they won't affect PvE or other parts of the game. You can stick with temporary title rewards or gold and it'll be just fine for us, don't waste your precious developer time on tabards/mounts/pets. We just need a bit of your programmers work hours. Please make PvP fun again.