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Manowar

Member Since 17 Mar 2013
Offline Last Active Today, 03:04 PM
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#4429253 Honorbuddy won't work in arena anymore (y)

Posted Bawn on Today, 01:12 PM

you know you reached the lowest of lows when the people who made the bots tell you its immoral to use the bot the way you're using it


#4429247 Honorbuddy won't work in arena anymore (y)

Posted Lolflay on Today, 01:05 PM

https://www.thebuddy...tlegrounds.html

Tldr is that it'll autoclose itself when you enter arena. Get fucked the few of you who didn't get banned, but used the bot in arena :]

Good stuff, maybe fakecasting will actually do shit versus all those turbos without their autopilot. Reading through that topic has been an absolute joy though - "amg, fuk u bossland, only noobs complained about botting arena", ROFL. Well, get fucked.


#4429085 WoW on MLG again?

Posted Lapeane on Yesterday, 09:58 PM

LOGIC

MoP - Game is okay, PVP is decent and many people play it. (I know it wasn't perfect, but comparing to game they showing us now it was best shit) - NO Tournaments. Like maybe two a year.

WoD - Biggest shit ever, every one quits and no one cares. People only play for money and other wait for their characters to be sold. - GCDTV shows up + other tournaments. Even weekly tournaments all the time for both regions with Holinka's support. WoW on MLG again etc etc.


Srsly? xd


#4428992 A challenge

Posted Jamminlove on Yesterday, 02:02 PM

View PostProdeGaming, on 27 May 2015 - 01:25 PM, said:

Note: The game has to have healing in it, and the alleged Battle Fatigue is   0%< Battle Fatigue >100%.

View PostProdeGaming, on 27 May 2015 - 01:25 PM, said:

is   0%< Battle Fatigue >100%
I want whatever you're smoking.


#4428989 A challenge

Posted Lloix on Yesterday, 01:48 PM

Yoooo should prolly swap out the bong for a vape bud.


#4428896 WoW on MLG again?

Posted Tsx on Yesterday, 03:24 AM

View PostWallirik, on 27 May 2015 - 03:02 AM, said:

Might be a good idea if they actually advertised this, both esl and MLG. Just contact mmo-champion or AJ, or both. Would easily let people know at least :rolleyes:
idd , i don't get why they don't advertise it , atleast put it on front wow page or mmo champion.


#4428893 WoW on MLG again?

Posted Lloix on Yesterday, 03:05 AM

MLG US = 1500 EU?


#4425670 PvP concerns, Dmg/CC/Healing

Posted ProdeGaming on 17 May 2015 - 06:45 PM

Could healing or dmg or CC be overpowered in general? Let's assume that this is clear for most players that they can be.
Posted Image
Let's pick just one, healing and check a few cases/concerns.
What makes healing overpowered?


Easily recognizable op healing could be, similar to the recently buffed Execution Sentence with Avenging Wrath. It's usually not the gameplay what players would like to see, the target getting healed from 10% back up to nearly full HP instantly.

Basically, talking about a heal that heals for a huge % of HP, often deemed op.


So possible question, does a heal need to heal for high % of HP to become op?
Posted Image
This heal heals the warrior for only 2% HP, however, if the mage is doing this kind of dmg, this healing is very overpowered.

So a heal needs to heal for high % of HP to become op. No, it does not. It's enough if it's op relative to dmg.

Posted Image

What else do players not like? Frequent concern is that classes are only good when CDs are up and then feel meh without. Let's stay with holy paladin, during Avenging Wrath, it's amazing but without it's meh.

The healing could look similar as in this example.
Posted Image

Suggestion is often to reduce effectiveness of Avenging Wrath, so it's not so outstanding compared to the healing without it and compensate this nerf by buffing the regular heals.

So basically, what players are asking for is to not make that peak on the graph so high and to bring those no cd 'meh' heals up to make it a constant decent healing.

Essentially to bring the outstanding lines closer to the overall HPS.
Posted Image


This is usually the case also when it comes to dmg classes, warriors would like to do good dmg without Avatar Recklessness too and with regular abilities, not just wait for Execute proc. Ferals usually would like bleed dmg get buffed and stuff like Ferocious Bite and Incarnation burst get nerfed etc.
Practically it's the same example graph, only that it's for dmg and not healing.


So the suggestion is that dmg and healing should get closer to the overall HPS and DPS.


What this means is that it could be said about the suggested classes that
Posted Image

By this, the HPS and DPS of classes give a much better estimate of the classes actual strength.

Is that good? Surely it is, HPS and DPS is most likely relatively easy to balance. For example Hybrids can be much more balanced, because the HPS they gain from abilities can much more easily be evaluated and weighed as a performance gain. Basically when it comes to putting a class together, it can be evaluated much better how much the worth of a Shield Wall or a Gouge is. In fact when it comes to PvP, as soon as CC comes into play, the strength of CC is way easier calculated, as the loss your class' performance suffers is much more constant. While with very spiky dmg and healing, the effect of CC is much less certain and very varying.
So not only does it make the game more enjoyable, but also makes balancing way more convenient and easier, ultimately making the balance better. Because essentially, the closer dmg and healing gets to HPS and DPS, the more precisely they help decode any ability to see its worth, for example to solve the issue of 'this dmg class has this much healing, how much CC or defensive cd should I give the other dmg class to compete with that healing?'.

So now it's just a matter of for example healer HPS within their class roles being balanced, same for DPS.
Posted Image


Once done, since it's at the beginning of the thread that healing can be op compared to just dmg alone, now HPS and DPS should get compared to each other.


What comparison even? Well it should be balanced for 3v3, so HPS should be about 2x as high as DPS.
Posted Image

The lower ratio HPS has, the less CC healing needs, since DPS needs less aid to overcome healing.

Jump back to the live game, what is this ratio there? From an around 6.1 calculation, this ratio is about 3:1. That's 150% of the desired HPS. Since it should be around 2:1 to have just a decent amount of CC, 3:1 ratio requires much more CC to exist than originally wanted, especially against healers.

So it needs a fix before the player gameplay desires could happen.
Posted Image

Assuming healers' HPS within their class roles are close equal 1:1 ratio, they shouldn't be individually changed to achieve the above. Instead, all of them should get the same reduction, so they keep their equal HPS.

A reduction that reduces all their healing by the same amount is Battle Fatigue, which however is a ruled out change by the players. So since the required change is ruled out, what players are asking for, more constant and less spiky dmg, less CC cannot be achieved, essentially impossibility.


Since the wishes cannot be achieved, but a fix to this ratio is desired and also since CC is already often bordering eternity, the only possible change to fix the issue is to not bring HPS down but bring DPS up. It is what's happening 6.2, for it's the only feasible change left to overcome the excess of healing as long as an equal effect as Battle Fatigue is off the table.

Should it be? No.


Posted Image


Saladfork said:

Battle fatigue got so much hate because it is a lazy way to "fix" things. It treats healers as if they are all equal and furthers the homogenization even more. Sure it is easier for Blizzard to balance and easier for the player base to absorb, but it leads to discrepancies (usually shamans end up on top since their utility is so great, and their burst healing has always been strong).

I understand what you're saying, though. But I don't think battle fatigue is the *best* solution (it is a "solution"). I would rather have them provide nerfs to healing individually (on a class-by-class basis). And in a perfect world, I'd have them address mana (since mana really isn't an issue until late late dampening), and finally fine tune burst damage to match with the healing nerfs. Obviously these changes would have to be PvP specific (since the current state of healing is entirely due to PvE), and that may be a big road block in going forward since that is against Holinka's philosophy.
In a sense, Battle Fatigue or an equal effect is not -a- solution, it's -the only- way, looking at it as it cannot be skipped, is a required change, a tool to achieve something.

To make it maybe a bit more spectacular, could use a similar example to the current issue.

So the suggested issues are:
    • Too high burst
    • Too much CC
    • Healers die easily
    • However HPS being higher than DPS
    Posted Image

    Being unable to skip the use of Battle Fatigue or an equal effect is because healers' HPS is already balanced. So if you try to skip it and decrease each healers healing spells 1 by 1, in this case by monstrous percentages, there is gonna be a minimum % you've decreased every spell by. So since all their spells have been decreased by that %, it's the equal effect as Battle Fatigue, even tho the intent was to avoid it, essentially used it regardless.


    Other issue could be that there are some spells that are already weak and need no reduction.
    Posted Image

    So basically Battle Fatigue or an equal effect could potentially be more efficient change to fix the majority of, in this case healing issue.
    At the same time, the majority of the issue can get huge enough so that it's simply no longer feasible to be, cannot be replaced by a series of single spell changes.

    It may as well look very lazy to change so many spells all at at the same time, but in case changing 800 spells 1 by 1 is not feasible, then not using an overall reduction is going to prevent doing anything at all. Because can't go 1 by 1 but can't reduce all either, so cannot do anything.
    But if all spells do get reduced, then it's potentially going to be feasible to fix those that were already balanced, essentially be able to do more than if all spells didn't get reduced.


    These could be issues because Battle Fatigue or an equal effect may very well sound like a universal fix that makes PvP suddenly amazing. But it isn't, it's just a piece of a series of different changes to achieve something, but it cannot be skipped.


    Such series of different changes, following all healing reduction could be
    Posted Image


    #4425085 Has WoW PvP ever been balanced?

    Posted Xonika on 16 May 2015 - 09:19 AM

    View PostAoedin, on 16 May 2015 - 01:27 AM, said:

    Controversial opinion but I believe the "balance" seems pretty decent right now. You can never achieve true balance with all the classes and all specs.
    are you fucking autistic or wit? have you q'ed arena recently?!?!?!?!?!?!


    #4423843 BANNED

    Posted dizzcord on 14 May 2015 - 08:23 AM

    With being banned i started talking to my gf abit



    she seems nice


    #4422139 What's the age of Venruki?

    Posted Diasleramo on 12 May 2015 - 01:50 AM

    Nobody truly knows how old a Mage is. They can grow to be centuries old, their age is irrelevant.


    #4419844 WoW Sub loss.

    Posted Naraga on 07 May 2015 - 09:45 AM

    View PostPouncedd, on 07 May 2015 - 07:56 AM, said:

    They didn't put a CD on Polymorph. Look what happened.
    lol you are truely a retarded MOP hero aren't you? Just saw you disgrace a good thread with this post: http://us.battle.net...739?page=39#767

    I guess this is also a huge issue Blizzard devs are facing. Because they do not have any experience with the game themselves you get a weird situation where they are completely reliant on feedback. However they fail to discern between the different feedbacks given. While they may realize they have to listen to the suggestions of high rated players over those of lowrated players, they probably do not see the difference between a mongoloid MoP hero like Pounced and lets say someone like Lolflay. "They are both high rated multiglads so surely their opinions weigh the same?" Blizzard thinks.

    And as long as enough MoP heroes come up with handicapped suggestions like "Gouge needs to be removed" and "Poly needs a cd" etc and scream loud enough Blizzard might actually follow up on their feedback and ruin the game even further.


    #4420450 pvp trinket cd being reverted back to 1 min in 6.2

    Posted HeyimJack on 08 May 2015 - 01:48 AM

    View PostElorxo, on 08 May 2015 - 01:43 AM, said:

    u never heard of tmorph jack m8
    It's no good if only I can see it.


    #4412787 GCDTV - EU and US Arena Tournaments - FRI / SAT / SUN

    Posted Wallirik on 21 April 2015 - 05:10 AM

    No reason to be negative in a thread like this.
    I think it's really cool you guys are running these weekly tournaments. Would've been cooler if it had started in an earlier season, but still - it's nice.


    #4412781 GCDTV - EU and US Arena Tournaments - FRI / SAT / SUN

    Posted Legends on 21 April 2015 - 05:03 AM

    Why do people post on arena junkies about how shit the game is and bash others for trying to create tournaments for players who still enjoy the game. You would think that if you didn't enjoy the game you would just move on and play another game instead of coming to arena junkies every day and saying how dead the game is.




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