Jump to content


Member Since 25 Jan 2012
Offline Last Active Today, 03:17 PM

#4546437 Infernion and Leo Rap

Posted Fedx on 29 November 2015 - 03:49 PM

Posted Image

#4543734 Ele sham at Rank1 3s

Posted zeepeye on 23 November 2015 - 06:15 PM

order is restored, 1 day after they make ele viable spec

#4540158 Scripted PvP

Posted Bigmoran on 17 November 2015 - 02:20 AM

I was originally going to post this article on Skill-capped. After some deliberation, I decided it would be better suited for AJ. I needed something meaningful for my 1000th post on this website. Even if you don't read this entire post, try and think about what you REALLY value in PvP. Consider what makes you happy and what makes you feel rewarded. The future of WoW PvP rests in the ability not to create balance, but instead to make the game into a rewarding and enjoyable experience.

I've mentioned countless times in threads and on social media that WoD PvP feels scripted. My attitude is not uncommon. Plenty of other players have also expressed feelings of redundancy in gameplay. Overall, enjoyment of PvP seems to be at an all time low. While quantification of player satisfaction is often difficult to guage, the drop in sub numbers--down to a point in which Blizzard will no longer report them--suggests that less and less people are enjoying World of Warcraft. The goal of this article is to show how the scripted feeling of PvP and the lack of rewarding gameplay has contributed to the growing sentiment that PvP is not nearly as fun as it used to be.

What IS the Script?

I should first explain what I mean by 'scripted.' In order to do this, consider how a script works. A script is a series of relationships between conditional statements. A conditional statement is a simple if, then relationship. Here is an example of how this 'scripted' PvP paradigm might play out in an arena match:

-If the enemy Mage uses Polymorph, then I will use Counterspell
-If the enemy Mage is Counterspelled on Polymorph, then I will use Polymorph.

While this may not seem damaging at first, consider the fact that nearly all of the important decisions we make during an arena game revolve around this algorithmic way of thinking. For every enemy action, there is an optimal player reaction that is determined by the 'script' of PvP. For every matchup, there is one optimal strategy. This makes winning feel significantly less rewarding and meaningful. The script makes arena wins feel less like an experience full of ingenuity and creativity and more like persistent, monotonous labor. If you know exactly how a game will play out, your experience will ultimately suffer.

As an aside, there is one thing that we often shake our fists at in PvP. Although we tend to hate RNG, it is the only thing that interferes with the normal operations of the script. Consider an arena game where two teams perfectly matched. They have exactly the same gear, play on the same latency, and have the exact same strategy. Assume that either team will try its absolute best to score a kill while preventing deaths of its own teammates. Under these conditions, what would determine the outcome of the match? It would have to be RNG! If one team gets a series of critical strikes or multistrikes at the right time, it will allow the match to deviate from its harmonious scripted balance. I should add that RNG (and specifically critical strikes) actually contribute to our enjoyment of the game. Oftentimes players will suggest removing crits from the game. Doing so would be damaging to our enjoyment of gameplay. While it may seem meaningless, scoring critical strikes is one of the most intrinsically satisfying elements of gameplay. We love seeing the big numbers. We are enamored by our own ability to deal damage that lights up as slightly bigger font on our screen. I am not kidding. Big numbers feel better, and in a game we are wanting to feel good.

Holinka's Pacing Argument

Recently, PvP developer Brian Holinka posted on Twitter that the average length of games during the World Championships was five and a half minutes. Loosely veiled behind this metric is the idea that PvP is improving because the duration of tournament games is getting shorter. It is true that spectators want shorter games. During Cataclysm and especially during Mists of Pandaria, many players argued that tournament matches were exhausting to watch. It was quite common in MoP to see two wizard cleaves battle it out for 10-15 minutes in a series that could potentially last five games. All in all this provided for a very boring viewer experience.
The problem with this argument is that the pacing does not matter if the match itself is painfully predictable. If you carefully watch the final series between SK-Gaming and Skill-Capped, you can see just how repetitive the game is during its 5.5 minute average duration. Every 30 seconds, Skill-Capped's RMD does the following things:

-Uses either Bash or Cheapshot on SK's Warrior
-Cyclones SK's Warrior
-Kidney Shots SK's Shaman (the kill target)
-Deep Freezes SK's Druid
-Polymorphs SK's Druid

While there is some degree of variance to how this setup is executed, the fact remains that every 30 seconds the RMD is doing exactly the same thing. So in a five minute game, you can expect the same exact thing to happen over and over and over until SK-Gaming makes a mistake or Skill-Capped falls to the attrition of dampening. And by all means, I'm not blaming either team for playing the way they do. For the most part there is no flexibility with either team's strat. I had the opportunity to talk to Healingstat (Skill-Capped's Druid) and I asked him why they never tried to kill SK's Warrior despite him sitting in Battle Stance for the majority of the game, sometimes without a PvP trinket. His reply was that they had played thousands of games against each other and that the 30-second setup strat on the Shaman is the only strat the consistently works. In other words, deviating from the script of going Shaman is utterly futile. There is no point in playing creatively because it does not win games. (I should add that I also heard that Boetar raged at Joefernandes for intervening a Blind because he "didn't know what to trinket." If there is anything that grossly reinforces the script, this is certainly it.)

Bring Back Reward

Of all the things that threaten WoW's ability to remain the most successful MMO of all time, its the fact that the game itself feels unrewarding. While I feel like the script has definitely contributed to this, there are numerous other examples in which gameplay itself does not feel like a rewarding experience. One instance of this is the conversion of many abilities into passive perks and set bonuses. Nature's Grasp was removed from the game and instead turned into a set bonus connected with use of Barkskin and Ironbark. Cold Blood was also pruned and converted into the four piece set bonus for Assassination Rogues. The real damage of pruning is that it left many of its removed abilities into mechanics attached to other spells. Two abilities became one. Two globals became one. Passives are not fun in virtue of being passive. You do not actually perform them--they just happen. Mages don't look at their Flameglow reducing damage and say, "Man, this is awesome!"

Another gross example of unrewarding gameplay is the conversion of many hardcasted damaging spells into instant cast burst abilities. Ice Nova is an ability that not only removes 50% of your root control, but also tunnel visions gameplay into managing two charges of a boring spell. Casted spells always feel better than instant casts. Hard casting involves risk and should result in high payoff. While I do think the class has some deep seeded balance and design problems, Destruction Warlocks are a perfect example of well-balanced risk/reward. Chaos Bolt is a long cast time that deals large damage. When it successfully lands, the Warlock feels like they have done something that required diligent effort. Compare this with the feeling of using two Ice Novas. There is little to no risk (outside of breaking CC). The ability is pressed and the damage is dealt. End of story.

The Hybrid Problem

While this has been an important point of discussion for ages, something needs to be done to address the strength and role of hybrid DPS in matchups. Hybrid healing was gutted for Balance Druids, Shadow Priests, and Elemental Shamans but still remains a problem for Feral Druids, Enhancement Shamans, and Retribution Paladins (perhaps WW Monks to an extend as well). These physical DPS classes are able to provide instant cast heals to themselves and their partners and are able to maintain high damage AND healing throughput over the course of a 3v3 match. There is no good reason that an Enhancement Shaman should be able to do 20k DPS in a game while also doing 10k HPS.

Some Nostalgia

Although he is one of the most controversial posters on this site, Bilian's PvP video continues to be one of my favorite PvP videos of all time. The RMP clips remind me of a time where gameplay was creative and each player made unique contributions to scoring kills.

#4541658 How to counter turbo?

Posted Melbyz on 20 November 2015 - 01:52 AM

View PostFedx, on 20 November 2015 - 12:53 AM, said:

if turbo has a "good" druid its pretty hard ye. For example: pojke, klba, boetar, miley, asgarath, båten, chas, even US druids like dannycarry, melby can respec resto, froffsy druid, battletaure... the list goes on. Sadly you are not there

haha trust me,melby resto is so unsafe, I would rather heal as balance xDeeee

#4541640 How to counter turbo?

Posted Fedx on 20 November 2015 - 01:13 AM

View PostMiixzy, on 20 November 2015 - 01:11 AM, said:

oh did I touch a soft spot because I said your braindead comp shouldn't struggle against turbo if you press your buttons, sry that I got you upset mr wodwalkerguy who I wouldn't even care to insult cos i've literally never heard of you till someone told me you wintraded to get your shiny s16 red helm
ye im a wod player and ye i obviously wintraded for r1 everyone knows that!!!

but ye i suspect being a mop lsd druid is better than wod monk

#4541610 How to counter turbo?

Posted Freshqtz on 20 November 2015 - 12:45 AM

Rumor has it that turbo can actually lose to turbo.

#4537038 Frostfirebolt Removed discussion

Posted ROKMODE on 10 November 2015 - 01:39 AM

View PostDizzeeyo, on 10 November 2015 - 01:26 AM, said:

ret paladins have a talent that gives them Tyraels throw your sword - teleport to your sword ability from hots

their class changes blog went up 20 mins ago

just what this game needed

I can't wait for World of Warcraft: Dragonball Legion edition

fighting double jumping flying demon hunters being intercepted by teleporting ret paladins being pulled across the map by a lifegripping priest running at permanent mount speed... only to be knocked off the map by a sneaky druid coming down from the skies via arena-usable flight form

#4536912 Frostfirebolt Removed discussion

Posted Dizzeeyo on 09 November 2015 - 08:58 PM

View PostMotorbatt, on 09 November 2015 - 08:18 PM, said:



we’ve focused more on fixing one particular outlier in their Spellbook: Frostfire Bolt. After removing the fire portion of the spell, it began to feel like just another Frostbolt, and we started to wonder how a spell supposedly combining frost and fire wasn’t just producing a puddle of water at the feet of the enemy
can't fault their amazing logic for removing the spell :D

#4540578 Scripted PvP

Posted Shouri on 17 November 2015 - 07:16 PM

I understand why some people don't like wotlk pvp but at the same time I really hate when people use the too bursty argument. Usually when that's a problem there must be something fundamentally wrong with how your team played in regards to healing, interrupting the damage, and kiting or pillaring. I never really felt like too many losses were bull shit and I played suboptimal comps like WLD in s8 to 3200.

#4540569 Scripted PvP

Posted Shouri on 17 November 2015 - 07:09 PM

The biggest problem with "scripted pvp" is that almost all damage outside of setup for most of those comps is pretty meaningless. As what was stated earlier the game doesn't really have many decisions to make anymore and you pretty much know your entire game plan before the game starts. A good example of this is mages really only playing around the deep freeze set-up and then just delaying until it's back up.

Personally I think the biggest problem is lack of pressure, especially outside of cooldowns. This game has mainly turned into trading cooldown for cooldown and I think that's really stale game design. In wrath, and also somewhat in MoP, you could force cooldowns with just good swaps and decision making. Another important point is that pressure causes mistakes. People tend to panic under pressure being unable to think clearly and I find it hard to believe that many players nowadays would be able to go through their flowchart pvp while hovering at dangerously low health pools while knowing they have to do something about it. The main thing stopping pressure is just how tanky and self-sufficient too many classes are with dps class healing/damage reduction being way too high and the numerous amount of defensive cooldowns. It's at the point where swapping is usually bad as they'll have all their cooldowns up and the time wasted on trying to kill them will give your main target time to get all their cooldowns back. There's too much of a commitment in hitting a target.

Another problem is also the lack of casting, way too many classes run around spamming instants. Specifically for healers, things like genesis and riptide/unleash having two charges is pretty bad for the game. Deep freeze into polymorph is acceptable but I think it's over the top when they have frost jaw/ring of frost.

Overall, and probably most importantly, the game is just not really that fun anymore for a lot of people. In terms of class balance this expansion has been pretty decent but other than that I can't say I like this expansion more than the others. The three top comps(in my opinion) RMD, turbo, and god comp are all extremely unfun to play against for many of the reasons stated above.

#4514397 Alessia #2

Posted Ventux on 05 October 2015 - 08:10 AM

alessia 3 on lordaeron???

nice movie

#4512648 what a joke joke joke of a company

Posted Xonika on 03 October 2015 - 01:36 PM

Thanks for the support and I understand people dnt care but for the sake of the people that do, I can explain. I arrive in prague and have 1 of the greatest times of my life meeting the people I met and just having a great day.  That night I check my email and find I got 72 ban only along with my gf gettin a warning on her account altough we've lived together for over a year ive never logged my new acc (1 I set up specifically for qualifiers which was completely clean and passed all 2 pre checks before the qualifiers, about a week ago my dad came over to visit from ireland, staying for 3 days in my room where my pc is, he slept quite early and ofc I was bored with my gf currently being on a nightshift so I logged my acc on her pc) as of recent blizzard has a new system which tracks pc id of some sort instead of the standard ip address ( which is why boosters who use proxies got banned before the qualifer/during the checks eg. Gelubabas team. I showed the email I got to multiple esl admins/rederees and multiple blizz staff who I asked for a contact number because I didnt have time to sort this via ticket, despite my worry every assured me that this happens sometimes and should be fine, not to worry. After practicing for 3hours this morning I was confident we would place atleast top 3 after being very successful in wargames. 5mins before the opening game I arrive with my fresh banana and nice cold water. I get told by some guy im dq and I cant play, I question him and many others and so did every other team(excluding pjke and cavys team who were starting their match. After 20mins and appearntly triple checking with blizzard, im dq and have to leave the premises. I assure you, I and many others did all we could to find out the reason of my "bad standing" account. I asked many blizz staff for a contact number to atleast explain/ask them to check location/ip etc, I was told to ask x guy who sent me to y guy and so on. Lagyna and I left after we figured no1 cares and it was too late to get un-dq considering other games had been played. Its hard to read over and check everything on my shit phone so excuse the grammar and I dnt expect any reply and will ignore most arrogant and idiotic comments coz believe it or not ima go have some fun in this sick weather and beautiful city. Thanks to every1 for the support and the guys ive spent the amazing players ive met in the last days.

#4513068 Alessia #2

Posted Avizura on 03 October 2015 - 04:32 PM


Hey guys,

me & my friend decided to make another movie since people were asking for it.

The movie also features a few skype games as requested.

Make sure to watch til the very end!

Thanks for watching hope you enjoy ;D

Put it on FULL HD!


Urban Contact - aurora

Rameses B - Safe Haven

odesza - How Did i Get Here

Pretty Lights - One Day They'll Know (Odesza Remix)

Philter - Flutterby

Thanks to Ayunix for the help!

#4483719 NA & EU Qualifiers aftermath

Posted Bestpriestjkk on 23 August 2015 - 07:33 PM

View PostFedx, on 23 August 2015 - 07:30 PM, said:

*not counting copa america qualifiers or whatever the name was*

Teams qualified: 8 (EU) + 6 (US) = 14
Teams with a mage on their team = 4 (EU) + 3 (US) = 7
Teams with a warlock on their team = 5 (EU) + 4 (US) = 9

Some teams had both mages and warlocks on their team but we can clearly see that EVERY team from both regions that qualified either had a mage or a warlock on their team.

Random facts:

Every Class in the game managed to qualify except Monks. (Neither ww or mw)
2 Melee cleaves qualified, Toxic Youth (EU) and Luminosity (US) that both could play turbo and/or LSD3. Then you can debate wether or not turbo is a "melee cleave" or dampener comp I guess.

Best series was definitely Mystic's PHS vs Gelubaba's RMD, why? Because there wasn't 300 wizards on both teams.

GL at Regionals to all of these teams and it's gonna be fun to see which teams that make it to #Wizzcon.


Fuck wizards

Ur class shouldnt even be in the game so its fine

#4478603 Balanced EU qualifier team

Posted scuzfail on 17 August 2015 - 06:19 PM

every1 in this thread needs to smoke some weed ... especially dizeeyo .. P.S jimjim is correct healingstat really is the most pale human being on the face of the earth - in a good way! =))))