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Z4muZ

Member Since 24 Jul 2011
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 09:28 PM
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#4261177 My Thoughts on MoP PvP and the direction of WoD

Posted Talbadar on 11 November 2014 - 06:21 AM

Hey everyone. With MoP coming to a close soon I'd like to talk about how I feel the expansion has been for PvP as a whole. This means I'll be going over the negatives and positives of as many areas of the game as possible.

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Positives
Class Variety:
Class variety was at an all time high this expansion in all areas of PvP. At any given part of the 3 seasons we can say within reason that about 20 out of the 29 viable PvP specs could do well in arena when played by the right players. This is not to say they could get carried, but that the class had the potential to compete. This was certainly not the case in BC and Wrath. During Cata it became more apparent that Blizzard wanted more classes to be viable and they definitely followed through into MoP with this in mind.

Catch-up system: Not much has to be said here. The fact that you can show up a few weeks late with a character and still compete or better yet go from 0 gear to full gear on an alt at the end of a season is a world of difference from previous expansions. This improved the game so much for me and for many players who have alts that don't usually get geared before the end of a season.

Full PvP gear best in slot: After years and years of dealing with players using trinkets from raids that could increase their damage by 30% or proc extra attacks that hit for 20% of your health bar we finally got what we wanted. Blizzard introduced a system that made full PvP gear best in slot for almost any situation. As an arena enthusiast this made me quite happy.
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Class balance:
It's hard to say this without a lot of negative feedback about certain ones, but class balance as a whole was really good by the end of the first season and onwards. As I mentioned earlier many classes were viable, but most of the time they were still very competitive anyway.

Let's take a look at some of the classes we saw at regionals and blizzcon this year. I am familiar with only the US teams for regionals, but we had a Ret, a Holy Priest, multiple Marksmanship Hunters, a Shadow Priest, a couple Elemental Shamans, a Boomkin, multiple Frost Mages, multiple Resto Shamans, multiple Affliction Warlocks, a Mistweaver Monk, a Subtlety Rogue, and a couple Resto Druids. At Blizzcon we saw a couple Windwalker Monks, a Fire Mage, and an Arms Warrior. That alone covers a lot of classes and specs.

On the live ladders we saw a lot of different specs doing well and I can only count 8 specs that did not reach a rating of 3000 by the end of the final season which are: Disc Priest, Fury Warrior, Frost DK, Arcane Mage, BM Hunter, Demo Warlock, Combat Rogue, and Assassination Rogue. For all I know some of those could have made it.

Successful arena maps: Blizzard finally added new arena maps that didn't need major revamping to become a solid part of the arena map pool. They also revamped Blade's Edge and Dalaran for the better though I sometimes do miss the old Dalaran against melee. They still need to work on some of the map balance, but really you can't hate on what they did during MoP with arena maps. I would like to see them add Ring of Valor back to the map pool. The current one is actually a great map it's just disabled due to bugs.
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Merger of battlegroups:
The removal of set arena teams in combination with having a single player ladder and being able to queue with anyone you want has been HUGE for the game. You no longer have to sit on arena teams until the end of a season worrying about your rating. This has also decreased queue times and allows players to compare everyone at once which people definitely care about seeing.

Resilience, PvP Power, and Dampening scaling : While not everyone can say that they enjoyed having these stats around you have to commend Blizzard for getting the numbers right with every season. They had to manually adjust them with each season to make sure people weren't dying too fast, weren't healing too much, and ensure that games were actually coming to an end in a reasonable amount of time. They definitely could have done better with 2v2, though.

Streaming Influence: You may not like some of the streamers and you may have some that you love, but streaming has definitely made a positive impact on the game. A lot more players are better informed and many feel like they are part of something by being able to communicate with top players and other members of their arena community.
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Holinka BOYS:
This man has done wonders for our community and you should be more than happy if you know what he's been doing while working for Blizzard. He's been in contact with a lot of the top players and constantly looks for feedback to relay to help out. He's also attended the LAN events to talk to players and meet them which I'm certain was not required of him. I've spoken with him quite a few times and the guy's got a good head on his shoulders so we should be happy we have him instead of the whatever the hell came before him.
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Negatives
Reliance on gear:
A common theme for this expansion and Cataclysm was a heavy reliance on gear to be competitive. While everyone thinks PvP gear should be the best in PvP, the reliance on having the best gear available to even come close to competing is frustrating. There have been times where I am missing 3 or 4 items and it feels completely hopeless to try knowing other people just do so much more with those few pieces.

Too much CC / Too many defensives: This topic has been heavily covered by so many people so I'll be brief to not bore you. The arms race went way too far this expansion. Instead of Warrior Charges Mage-->Mage Frost Novas it's now: Charge-->Blink-->Heroic Leap-->Nova-->Intervene-->Pet Nova-->Reflect-->etc,etc. Everyone just had way too many things to deal with each other and way too many simple reactions when taking damage or wanting to deal damage.
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Dampening in arena:
As both a tournament spectator and competitor I strongly believe that Dampening is a horrible concept for arena. This allowed for many things to happen. First of all teams could design their composition fully around winning because of Dampening and play around it. I don't think this was as relevant to ladders as it was at the actual tournaments. Both my team (ele, lock, druid) and the team that won this year (boomkin, lock, shaman) could easily attribute their success to its existence. It made for really boring starts to happen in a game where most of the action should be happening seconds into the match.

This also allowed Blizzard to balance the classes around dampening and not having to worry about if players could actually get a kill early on. Instead of fixing the issue they just took a shortcut around it by forcing games to end. I think having some type of ultimatum for games ending is fine, but the game should be balanced around players scoring kills before something like that is even necessary. On top of that it should be fair for both sides which sadly dampening is not. "The Crowd Chose You" is obviously not a good option either.
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Caster dominance at higher levels:
This has happened at the end of a lot of expansions for WoW now and I think it would take a long discussion to figure out why this is the case, but as you all have seen the past 4 years have been more of a Wizzcon than anything else. Melee make things exciting and even against two casters it creates a much more dynamic matchup to both play and watch.
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Reluctance to make small changes:
I've heard Blizzard's thoughts on this time and time again, but I still feel as if we're getting robbed out of a better experience. They don't want to make a lot of small changes because they don't think it will make a big enough impact and will only deter players from participating if the classes keep getting changed. When I look at a game like LoL that makes constant slight balance changes weekly I can only frown knowing it would be great for WoW PvP to follow suit. Changes like this one below make the game drastically different and makes some classes stay dead for very long while others get to overpowered states for entire seasons without change.
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Lack of tournaments:
No regionals in 2013, a few tournaments hosted online (that were, as usual, attacked by DDoS), and just a few LANs? We didn't do much these past couple years. Tournaments create life in PvP. It gives events for people to look forward to and it gives drama for players to talk about. I heard something about MLG thinking about picking up WoW again for WoD, but rumors are rumors.

Healer Variety: Specifically in arena only 3 out of 6 specs (Mistweaver Monk, Resto Shaman, Resto Druid) were viable at the end of the expansion. I'd say we didn't do a good job of ensuring viability among them especially with Discipline being horrible for almost the entire expansion. One could argue that each spec was good at some point during the expansion, but that's simply not good enough especially after coming out of Shamanclysm.
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Moving forward into WoD
Ability Bloat:
There are so many things I am looking forward to in WoD and one of them is the removal of a ton of abilities and cooldowns that were just making the game worse. A lot of people won't agree initially, but let me explain why it's a good thing. There are tons of abilities for you to use to outplay your opponents and you want to be able to use them all and it makes the skill cap really high... sure that's great, but there are plenty of great games out there that use very few abilities to do things well. As long as there are mini games to play then there is plenty of room for player interactions to make a difference and for players to have fun. Mini games are things like: positioning battles, the interrupt game, forcing/saving trinkets and cooldowns, and battling for objectives. There's so much more to PvP than just having a bunch of crap to press.

Interrupt and CC changes: The number one change coming into WoD is one that's been needed for so god damn long. The removal of Improved Counterspell (the strongest CC in the game besides Fear) and Improved Spell Lock. There are other Silences and small CCs being removed, but this really does add to the fun for both the Mage/Locks and other players. You feel like you get more out of a spell when you use it well and previously all we see is blanket Counterspells and there's not much interaction required. The more interactions between players the more room there is to outplay. Don't forget the nerfs to Fear duration, CC cooldown, and the removal of PoM Sheep, NS Cyclone, and other forms of instant full CC.

Focus on PvP: From what I gather there's been a focus on making PvP fun for this expansion and with Holinka on board I'm having positive thoughts on PvP as a whole. I would love to see 2v2 make a comeback as a fun bracket that you can queue with your friends where games actually end quickly instead of the current stalemates that happen. With less abilities cluttering the game the mini games should become more and more relevant instead of the previous cooldown war. You have to expect that the expansion will start out with some bumps. Maybe damage overall will be too low, healing will be too high, or Mages will one shot people with Ice Nova, but we will get there guys!

Hope you enjoyed. Feel free to post your thoughts on both the positives and negatives of MoP as well as what you're expecting moving forward.


#4254715 The Dream

Posted Ipsissimus on 06 November 2014 - 09:48 PM

View PostDizzeeyo, on 06 November 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

1% less dps on average with the undead racial then the best racial for each mage spec, its really not something to be massively concerned about :)

I'm not concerned, I've raided as an Undead Mage from Tier 7 onwards. AFAIK this is the closest it has been to the other Races.

However, Touch of the Grave doesn't scale, unlike (most of) the other racials. The ~2.1K it will proc for at level 100 will amount to absolutely nothing by the end of the expansion, both in PvE and PvP.

The issue isn't so much that Undead sucks for PvE, since it basically always has outside of situational fights. The issue is that Will of the Forsaken got nerfed, yet again. There is really very little reason, bar aesthetics/'rp', for anyone to be playing Undead with how WoD arena is projected to look like. But hey, who knows, maybe Warlocks will be all the rage after a season or two and we'll end up in short arenas where the stupidly long 3 minute cooldown won't matter so much.

But hey, it's not like I'm suddenly going to play triple Human or triple Dwarf RMP just because those are the strongest racials now.
I am Forsaken, etc...


#4254448 Anyone playing MOP AT?

Posted Lolflay on 06 November 2014 - 01:29 PM

You have to be mentally handicapped to enjoy playing MoP.

But w/e, some people just don't know any better, can't do anything else but feel sorry :)


#4254367 Anyone playing MOP AT?

Posted Dills on 06 November 2014 - 09:04 AM

who would ever want to play mop again rofl wtf

edit: oh i see a warlock and a shaman posting in this thread. now that explains it


#4251976 instant karma

Posted Bigmoran on 04 November 2014 - 12:15 AM

so wait...wheres the funny video?


#4241167 only took 10 years...

Posted Call Me Teranaye on 23 October 2014 - 05:35 PM

middle east next pls


#4240438 Kuilox Renamed

Posted snugglebunny on 23 October 2014 - 04:17 AM

View Postbutterskid, on 23 October 2014 - 03:45 AM, said:

hi hotcheetos, grats on that r1 5s even though we all know you also scummed it up..

Edit: Stupid question.. I obviously wouldn't have made this thread.
Don't come in here trying to derail my thread.

Peace

take a yolk


#4237048 i don't know how to feel right now

Posted stalebagel on 20 October 2014 - 01:05 AM

View PostSizurex, on 19 October 2014 - 11:25 PM, said:

it's a shame one of the people i play with doesn't have that luxury and different has a vendetta agianst him???

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#4235665 So I find myself in following situations ( Affliction ) :

Posted Celaurthor on 18 October 2014 - 07:30 AM

View PostWallirik, on 18 October 2014 - 01:15 AM, said:

you are delusional.
the only reason fear didn't break is because the dots you had on did no dmg, because the warlock either didn't have dots on you, or had horrible proc uptime.
if you get sheeped and lava bursted for 300k do you also think sheep doesn't break on damage?
if i had a single agony on someone in s15, fear would break after 2-3 ticks, which is about 3seconds.

now i clearly understand how op fear was in mop (and earlier), but saying it didn't break fast enough in mop just proves you're a moron (like most other people) that doesn't realize that the only reason it's not breaking is because you're not taking any dmg, until those 3x 100k lava bursts hit you.

Something else that contributed to fear not breaking faster was shitty server responsiveness (i'm guessing) which they now made better?
i cannot count the times i have been disorient roared or chastised with 5 dots on and it lasted for 1 or 1.5 seconds (which should instantly break on any dmg as well).

edit: if you played early wotlk you would've known of fear thresholds. it used to be 20% health to break fear :) now that was insanely retarded
You're defensiveness over this is kinda moot dont you think? Calling me a moron over something that is clearly true and was frequently complained about just kinda makes you look like an ass. If I sat 3-4 seconds of a poly and got lava burst procd out of it at least poly was healing me those 3-4 seconds so thats the worst example you can use. The damage threshold on fears with only dots up was very high in mop but like you said if a warrior or ele was pveing the fear sure it would break. But I have sat 4 seconds of a fear with a full row of demon soul dots ticking away on me multiple times. But there is no point in having a discussion with you if you are just going to call me a moron over and over again so I probably won't respond to your reply. GL in WoD.


#4232041 Exumbra/Swull/Lxxi wintrading/ddosing to rank 1

Posted flannelsoff on 14 October 2014 - 06:33 PM

Someone suppress this beast please


#4225225 6x glad 1x R1 dk came back to wow streaming almost 24/7 even for living with...

Posted XtraT on 06 October 2014 - 01:58 AM

what the fuck


#4225642 #RoadToBlizzcon EU and US regionals catch up

Posted zzo on 06 October 2014 - 05:20 PM





i am not good at making videos take this in mind


#4213759 2014 NA Regional Drama Wrap-Up

Posted Silentlol on 21 September 2014 - 03:43 AM

and this is why we cant have nice things.


#4212238 2014 NA Regional Drama Wrap-Up

Posted Regent on 18 September 2014 - 11:54 PM

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Since there has been a lot of drama recently, I figured I would make a TL;DR thread for those of you that have successful real lives and can't sit on ArenaJunkies 24/7.

The North American Regional Qualifiers:
  • Hosted by ESL (the same company that organized the holocaust)
  • 2800 players qualify but only 50 Teams signed up
  • No seeding and random placement meant some popular teams eliminated each other right of the bat
  • Zero interaction with Blizzard, even after the ESL website wasn't working
  • People suspect Blizzard will be asking for some of the money they paid ESL back, since ESL apparently completely forgot that they were supposed to hold this tournament
Vanguards team gets knocked out because of a "no-show":
  • Timestamp does show that Vanguards team was almost 30 minutes late to their match
  • They claim they had no idea the time they were supposed to play
  • Poor organization and almost no help from ESL admin, many people think they didn't deserve the loss
  • Vanguards, being the least confrontational person in existence, made a nice forum post saying how he is slightly angry that he missed out on a chance for $40,000 USD
Jah's team gets knocked out and tries to get back in on a technicality, twice:
  • Claims his first loss was not actually the "real" game and only practice
  • Screenshots show his team agreeing it was the real game
  • Some people claim that after his second loss he tried to contact tournament admin and get it changed
  • Talbadar is "disappointed" in jah
  • Jah, unsurprisingly, calls everyone "retards" and hasn't been seen since
Wizk's team cheats and has other players, not on their roster, play:
  • By far the biggest drama generating event of the tournament
  • Wizk, Jakenotezz, and Random rogue decided to play RPS in tournament
  • Upon tournament brackets coming out, they realize they will have to fight comps that are strong against them
  • Wizk realizes that it would be too obvious to ddos his opponents, he determines he will have to come up with another way to cheat
  • Wizk replaces his rogue and rsham with an rdruid and mage who are not on his team roster and then wins multiple games (it is assumed that the mage was played by, "Piecez," and the druid by, "Rynd")
  • People (obviously) realize what is happening and he gets disqualified for cheating
  • Wizk then cries, makes a 40 minute video about why he didn't cheat, no one believes him
  • Jakenotezz, then makes a post on AJ admitting that they cheated, apologizing, and says he only did it to bang his 18 y/o e-girlfriend when he goes to New York
  • Wizk then claims he is too good for this community
  • Wizk locks in his spot next to Xandyn in the "top 5 scummiest wow players of all time"
  • Randomroguex is mad that no one knows who he is, doesn't understand the concept of why cheating is bad, and is apparently a part of some "elite cheaters club"
Multiple teams Disqualified after the tournament ends based on their geographical location:
  • Apparently it was easier to allow these people to play in the tournament and then disqualify them after they won
  • Raises multiple questions about the outcome of the tournament, since the teams who got DQ'ed knocked people out of the tournament
  • The dominant team of Jeff, Barry, and Twochainz is rumored to be one of the teams DQ'ed
Avangelyne proves he is really weird:
  • Made multiple weird posts about having a girlfriend
  • Multiple awkward tweets involving, but not limited to: old memes, obscure Norwegian cover bands, and History channel TV shows
  • All of this is okay though, because according to him, he "has a lot of friends"
Former 3rd place Blizzcon team, "PvP Live" replaces healer the night before qualifiers:
  • but apparently forget to tell him he is off the team
  • Famous monk, "Dannycarey" is replace by other famous monk, "Verdantstorm"
  • Novoz and Thugonomicz imply that Dannycarey is part of something (Illuminati?)
  • Dannycarrey still hasn't run out of mana
Glinks:
  • Surprisingly, Glinks didn't cheat or try to ddos anyone
  • Nice work, Glinks
World of Warcraft PvP Designer, "Holinka" no where to be found:
  • A week has gone by since his last sighting
  • Police have decided to end the search
  • His family stays hopeful
Arena Junkies:
  • Datacus tries really hard to get some free rep, fails miserably
  • For the first time in over a year, people are capped out on giving rep
  • If you point out any scummy things that friends of the moderators have done, you will be getting an infraction
  • Flavour is still making stupid posts
  • Dillypoo's insults have been getting noticeably better over time, possibly hitting puberty soon?
  • Bigmoran tries to dispel ddos rumors by threatening to ddos anyone who talks about it
  • Thugonomicz believes that Arenajunkies.com is actually "Horse cocks"
  • Bailamos dropped in to insult Jakenotezz for having an e-girlfriend, the irony is palpable
  • More wintrading in EU, no one is surprised
  • The "scummy dozen" continue to rep each-other in an attempt to make it seem like they have some community support
  • Ayra is still black, and still european



#4211224 Apology to everyone

Posted zzo on 18 September 2014 - 06:46 AM

View PostSpamdotz, on 18 September 2014 - 06:40 AM, said:

I'm still confused, who was the Mage they played god comp with?

Still trying to put the piecez together?




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