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Posted Okayenhance on 08 July 2013 - 02:25 PM
A few reasons I feel being a melee is simply not beneficial to the game anymore.
1. Casters rarely take more damage from us than they deal to us.
Casters (and hunters) historically outside of soul-link warlocks were considered in deep shit if a melee was sitting on them. Why? Because armor actually meant something in previous expansions (WOTLK and below). So you actually had a sort of cat-n-mouse type thing going on, warrior charges mage, mage blinks, warrior intercepts mage, mage frostnovas, warrior gets dispelled etc etc. Now I feel that outside of cooldowns the warrior is the one that's consistently running away, what gives?
2. Mana means nothing.
One of the allures of being a melee was a seemingly endless supply of damage which meant if you could pressure up a team long enough as a melee your lack of crowd control would eventually OOM the enemy healer AND dps and put you ahead leading to an eventual victory. Now there were some problems with this design (I'm looking at you viper sting/mana drain..ಠ_ಠ) but overall it was a solid reason to have a melee and a warlock for that matter. Nowadays I see games of my own and top streamers going on for 5+ minutes while the enemy teams healer is completely tapped and outside of sitting on a spriest who has spent way too much mana spamming flash heal all caster DPS specs don't give a flip about mana. It might as well not exist.
3. Dispel has a cooldown. "Welcome to CC-ville. Enjoy your stay! - Wizards"
This isn't a new change, no doubt, but is one I find to be a large problem for melee oriented teams not just cleaves but melee/caster/healer. What is the point in dispelling a poly off me when the mage is already instinctively casting another or his teammate is casting fear? Why do these things not have cooldowns? While I understand having your dots spam dispelled by tard shamans in cata was annoying what is the point of bringing a melee over a caster when we are not only far easier to crowd control (as in, only enhancements have the actual tools to stop the spam CC) but have to actually reach our targets just to do less damage than the wizards are doing to our entire team?
Funnily enough most melees are defensively weaker than their caster counterparts, despite having to run into the enemy team who is pillaring if they want to score a kill or even get pressure (thanks gate!). How can this be? Well I feel it goes back to how gear was in WOTLK and TBC. Melee, especially plate wearers, had higher armor higher dodge and generally much higher health than their wizard hat wearing counterparts. What they didn't have is absorption shields and the ability to kite or cast self heals repeatedly. This is one of the several reasons why feral druids are so incredible right now compared to other melee, if they want to get out they can powershift slows and snares and run away while their bleeds still do pretty nice damage.
So the reason why I posted this isn't a pity party but rather my concern for the viability of melee in the upcoming patch. With melee effectively requiring a hunter to put them on their shoulders in most cases i'm sure to many the upcoming domination by wizards may not be too shocking. All in all here's hoping for the return of melee/caster/heals.
Am I entirely wrong? Tell me what you think.
Posted Persephones on 23 May 2013 - 09:08 PM
Posted Azaelz on 28 March 2013 - 11:44 PM
Hey guys, been a while since posting here but I had an idea I think a lot of people will enjoy and after talking to Conradical and him agreeing to get in on it I decided to go ahead and give it a shot!
The basic idea is that you show up in stream chat with your 3v3 team ready, and when we're picking a game you post your rating and setup in chat and then we'll select two teams around the same rating and cast your games with the regular tournament UI. It'll be done on US servers for the first week - maybe we'll try EU servers as well assuming we can get accounts and it's popular enough so as long as you're on US servers and willing to add us on battle tag you're eligible to play! We'll be queuing up using 5v5 wargames so that Conrad and I can join the game and then you'll simply kill us off and the game will proceed like normal as it does in all the online tournaments.
It's going to be on twitch.tv/egazael this coming Saturday at 2 PM EST so please help spread the word and show up! We'll be able to make it better and better and take viewer ideas etc for this if it goes well - also hopefully going to be able to get some relatively high level games for the end of the night - and perhaps have the most popular team of the day fight against a famous team or something like that!
Thanks and let me know what you think!
Posted Nadagast on 14 March 2013 - 03:12 AM
A single cleaving Nether Tempest hits for about 85% of the damage of a full stack of Warlock DoTs.
NT Avg Hit: 3469 http://i.imgur.com/C72nwAF.png
NT Avg Cleave Hit: 1819 http://i.imgur.com/u8TgZ0P.png
Corruption: 3431 http://i.imgur.com/85x1Tgd.png
Agony: 4119 http://i.imgur.com/r2dpHpS.png
UA: 5439 http://i.imgur.com/1PymEr7.png
Average total NT DPS: 3469+1819 = 5288
Average Warlock DoT DPS: (3431+4119+5439)/2 = 6494
Add in ~5% more crit for the Mage, and we're at 5552 Nether Tempest DPS vs 6494 Warlock DoT DPS.
That's 85% of a full DoT stack on a single spell which always only takes one global to apply, procs ~70k instant nukes, and is not even really a Mage's main form of attacking. I would say the situation is pretty ridiculous right now... Note that these numbers are from an RBG where I was able to spend more than my regular armount of shards under a spellpower increasing effect, which means in an arena the numbers would be even more favorable to Nether Tempest.
Posted Tosan on 14 March 2013 - 07:46 AM
they rewarded players who stuck with the game despite it being worse and worse .. if you think that your honor gear should be better or even close to my 2/2 upgrades with the amount of conq / time i spent putting into it you should probably just go back to not playing anymore.
Cool you want to come back thats awesome - grind it like the rest of us until you get tyrannical.
Do you really have so little confidence in yourself that you desire an item/stat advantage? I never understood this mentality; stating you don't think people should start a season on an even playing field is almost exactly the same as saying "I want every unfair advantage I can get to compete because I'm not confident in my ability to play better than others to win".
Maybe that's just me.......
My favorite part........as if it cost you something to get that. Conq / time? Conquest points are something you get from simply playing the game, which you are doing for fun in the first place; you'd do it without a reward as long as you can play arenas, right?
And "time".......you'd be spending that regardless, it's not like you invested it specifically for an advantage, you spent the time playing arenas for fun anyway, the gear came along as a free additional prize.
You act like you bent over backwards to get 2/2 upgraded gear, when in reality you just got it for free for doing something you were already going to do.
Always baffled when I read comments like this tbh.
Posted Conradical on 14 March 2013 - 07:33 AM
I don't understand this argument. Why would you want to just dominate people that can't compete at near the same level? Do other competitive games force you to be stuck behind for months before you are finally able to do a fraction of the damage of the people that played in the previous season?
Your Tyrannical grind is going to be MUCH easier than those that started again this season.
Posted Zaephyr on 14 March 2013 - 02:15 AM
Posted Smooviex on 14 March 2013 - 01:12 AM
Posted Coldizzle on 13 March 2013 - 09:00 AM
an full honor mage has 354kHP and 18k spell power(with arcane brillance) and an full 2/2 with t2 2/2 has 392kHP and 22k spell power(with arcane brillance) its retarded.
only after like 2 and half months the gear will be close to equal with 3.2kcap.
Posted Salutations on 13 March 2013 - 08:11 AM
Posted Kettu on 13 November 2012 - 08:16 PM
1. Fix the bug
2. Ban those who exploited and reset their teams / mmr
3. Reduce the rating and mmr of everyone above 2.2k to exactly 2.2k
Would fix everything without affecting 95% of the pvp'ers. If everyone's rating gets reset to 0 and mmr to 1500, I'm sure the offical forums will be filled with people whining for weeks.
Posted WildeHilde on 25 August 2012 - 10:15 AM
If you cannot write in the general section, please send me a PM if you want to contribute.
[CR] = Controlled Root
- Death Knight Chains of Ice (Chillblains root)
- Druid Entangling Roots, Entangling Roots Treants (Balance), Nature's Grasp, Mass Entanglement (talent)
- Hunter Narrow Escape (talent), Pin (Crab), Web (Spider), Lock Jaw (Dog), Venom Web Spray (Beast Mastery Silithid)
- Mage Frost Nova, Freeze (Frost Water Elemental)
- Monk - Disable
- Priest Void Tendril's Grasp, Glyph of Mindblast
- Rogue - Partial Paralysis (Paralytic Poison Shiv effect) - unconfirmed
- Shaman Earthgrab (talent), Freeze (Frozen Power talent)
- Warrior Staggering Shout
- Death Knight Asphyxiate (talent), Gnaw (Unholy Ghoul), Monstrous Blow (Dark Transformation Unholy Ghoul ability), Remorseless Winter (5th stack, talent)
- Druid Maim, Pounce, Mighty Bash (talent), Bear Hug (Guardian), Bash (Treants in feral spec, bugged stuns 3 times and makes the target immune to stuns until the DR wears off)
- Hunter Binding Shot, Intimidation (Beast Mastery), Bad Manner (Monkey), Sonic Blast (Bat), Sting (Wasp)
- Mage Deep Freeze, Combustion (Fire)
- Monk Charging Ox Wave (talent), Leg Sweep (talent), Clash (Brewmaster), Fists of Fury (Windwalker)
- Paladin Hammer of Justice, Holy Wrath (Protection), Fist of Justice (talent), Glyph of Blinding Light
- Rogue Cheap Shot, Kidney Shot
- Shaman Static Charge (Capacitor Totem Stun)
- Warlock Shadowfury (talent), Felguard: Axe Toss (Demonology), Infernal Awakening (Infernal)
- Warrior Shockwave (talent), Warbringer (talent, Charge knockdown), Storm Bolt (talent)
- Tauren War Stomp
- Hunter Snatch (Bird of Prey), Clench (Scorpid)
- Monk Grapple Weapon
- Priest Psychic Horror (Shadow)
- Rogue Dismantle
- Warlock Voidwalker: Disarm (also Voidlord, same spell)
- Warrior Disarm
- Druid Hibernate
- Hunter Freezing Trap, Wyvern Sting (Survival)
- Mage Polymorph, Ring of Frost (talent)
- Monk Paralysis
- Paladin Repentance (talent)
- Priest Shackle Undead
- Rogue Gouge, Sap
- Shaman Hex
- Warlock: Succubus: Seduction, Mesmerize (Shivarra demon)
- Pandaren Quaking Palm
- Hunter Scare Beast
- Paladin Blinding Light, Turn Evil
- Priest Psychic Scream, Psychic Terror (Psyfiend fear, talent)
- Rogue Blind
- Warlock Fear, Blood Fear (talent, same debuff for both), Howl of Terror (talent), Sleep (Demonology)
- Warrior Intimidating Shout
- seems gone
- Rogue - Paralysis (Paralytic Poison five stack stun)
- Shaman - Earthquake
- Warrior - Dragon Roar (talent)
- Death Knight Strangulate
- Druid Solar Beam (Balance)
- Hunter Silencing Shot (talent)
- Mage Improved Counterspell, Frostjaw (talent)
- Monk Spear Hand Strike
- Paladin Avenger's Shield (Protection)
- Priest Silence (Shadow)
- Rogue Garrote
- Warlock Felhunter: Spell Lock, Optical Blast (Observer demon)
- Warrior Pummel and Heroic Throw with Glyph of Gag Order
- Blood Elf Arcane Torrent
- Druid Cyclone
- Hunter Entrapment (Survival)
- Mage Ice Ward (talent),
- Priest Dominate Mind
- Shaman Bind Elemental
- Warlock Banish
- Druid - Disorienting Roar (talent) (5.4 PTR),Wild Charge Immobilize in Bear Form
- Hunter - Scatter Shot does not have dimishings returns (5.4 PTR)
- Mage - Dragon's Breath (Fire) (PTR), Frostjaw root (talent) - only DR as silence,
- Priest - Holy Word: Chastise (Holy)
- Warlock - Unstable Affliction Dispel and Infernal Awakening
- Warrior Charge
Thanks to all the responders and the people that messaged me for information updates. I will include further participants here, too.
- Cybeloras, author of TellMeWhen for many additions and spell ID corrections
- Firebunny, author of the new 5.0 Gladius
- Vishas and Deliantha aka Vadrak for testing with me in the Gurubashi Arena on beta
- Randomguy, Itsnel, Jackow, BettySuarez, Zeiyo, Rimathil, Nyzzeh, Pka, Ramsig, Zong, Kerzen, Hertzuk, Trancey, Wowdruid, Buachaille, Altruit, Friedkitteh, Enilix, Cirous, Sobbz