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#3795107 Seriously.....just stop it

Posted Mattadoro on 25 October 2012 - 03:21 PM

with no warning? the in game sound of a giant charge jumanji noise and 20 extra pets didnt help you predict what was happening? lets say in 5s they go on you  if you play with a mage in 5s and lets assume you do you can just block it.

is the dmg dumb yes

was this post needed.. no

also you're talking about 5's...  4 of a class has always worked  4 mages in cata 4 eles in wrath and in bc 4 ele's was unreal

#3790114 5.0.5 Changes.

Posted Champz on 13 October 2012 - 10:57 AM

buff mm already

#3790081 MoP Arena: First Impressions

Posted Ctuhlu on 13 October 2012 - 07:39 AM

To me, the mechanics of the way Affliction works has always meant that it will be a PVP god or a bottomfeeder. If aff dots are strong and the spec is competitive with other top damage specs, then Warlocks become out of control and are represented in almost every comp due to their ability to do just as damage as the next class while ALSO keeping 1/3 of the other team almost permanently CCed with Fear, regardless of how fast it breaks. With strong dot damage, Fear has the advantage of controlling the opponent without having to worry about stopping your damage output. It becomes an interrupt, a CC, and a potential position-changer all in one clean spammable package.

Past seasons have conditioned warlocks to expect to do insane levels of dot damage (From Cata especially), and all the while Warlock's survivability and utility was extremely high. I'm not playing MoP so I can only speculate on a design level, but to me the way Affliction is built mechanically should mean that its dots DON'T do just as much damage as every other spec. You have to remember that Affliction has the advantage of being able to easily do multitarget damage while having strong survivability and CC that still allows you to do 100% of your damage.

The thing is, Warlocks have been godmode for so long that they will never accept anything but overlord status. Can't really blame them either when Blizzard has proven themselves absolutely incompetent in the balance department (especially in leaving Resto Shamans, Rogues, and Warlocks virtually unchanged for 4 seasons of Cataclysm). Anyways flame away but that's how I see it.

#3790072 Tosan Tribe - Trap Trolling 3

Posted Tosan on 13 October 2012 - 06:58 AM

#3787141 Frozire's MoP thread on Hunter PvP [WIP & Open for discussion]

Posted NickyEU on 05 October 2012 - 06:43 PM

What is this? This is not a comprehensive guide just a place where I will be directing people with questions.

If anyone feels like contributing be it fixing my horrible english or adding content let me know.

Note: English is not my first language so be prepared.

As some of you might remember I was previously a writer here on ArenaJunkies for multiple years but decided to leave the team about 8 months ago due to management disagreements. At the time I was answering hundreds of questions in Ask A Gladiator and because of that people realized that I was always happy to help which lead to me getting an overwhelming amount of PM’s and whispers. That is the main reason I have decided to put together a small guide that I will be updating as I see fit with information relevant to the current Meta game.

Why listen to me?

Short About Hunter:
With the release of Mists of Pandaria the hunter play-style changed but our role stayed the same.

Now how is this going to work out? Previously, we had big limitations by having a minimum range that caused our entire playstyle to focus around progressive positioning, predicting enemy movement and using max range to our benefit. We were put in teams to offer control with numerous instant cast CCs and high burst to open up possible kills for our partners. A common trend for our combos meant creative use of other classes to baby-sit us and fill in the absent synergies. This led us to playing “uncommon” compositions with a lot of off-spec classes such as; Ret Paladins, Prot Warriors, Feral Druids and Enhancement shamans.

With Mists of Pandaria we had two major changes, one being the removal of minimum range. This changed a lot about the way we play as we are no longer constantly staying at max range but instead we moved into the fight. At the same time getting new utility that benefits us being closer to the target, both for defensive and aggressive play. The second major change is the generalization of our specializations causing BM to have the same utilities as MM. This lead to BM being much more attractive and will be the dominant spec until MM catches up with either utility changes or damage buffs.

I won’t go too much into detail about how we should play yet as it will become more obvious as we go through the spells and talents that we will be picking up. At the end of this post I will also be posting a tips and tricks as well as a how to play against X that should give you great insight in how to play your hunter.

We are in the extremely rare situation that our talents are essentially up for debate. Picking talents may vary depending on playstyle, experience, team composition and much more. So I will be explaining the spells below for you to get a feel of what you might want and then what I think is most suitable for different setups.

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Narrow Escape:
Extremely versatile utility that acts as a semi passive! The wonderful thing about Narrow Escape is that it allows us to pick a single talent that opens up the possibility for a full team control, aggressive play, defensive play and positioning to a whole new extent. Using it to root melee, root targets, help healers or keep people LOS or to go LOS. I don’t think I need to explain this spell to much as it really speaks for itself.

You will see top hunters running posthaste as mobility and positioning is extremely important at higher ratings some of them might even be heard saying Narrow Escape is “for noobs”. While having mobility is extremely beneficial it does not provide you anything directly besides positioning advantage. This spell requires practice and experience to understand and utilize what I like to call “progressive positioning”.

This comes natural to some hunters that played pre-cataclysm but can be a challenge for new hunters to learn. I suggest picking up this talent when you are playing in a heavy mobility composition or if you are targeted often, it is great for passive kiting and using LOS to relief pressure.

Crouching Tiger, Hidden Chimera
In a situation where you are facing a lot of spell-cleaves. The shorter duration of Disengage allows you to much more effectively and consistently get behind pillars to Line of Sight and the Deterrence cooldown reduction combined with Deterrence glyph, can turn a spell-cleaves push into a spell-cleaves death. Notice this is a dangerous talent to pick for winning spell-cleaves, good players will see the hunter deterrence and immediately try to get a dot reflected to be immune to damage sensitive CC for a longer period.

The deterrence is our survival skill and as thus should be treated as such, using it for aggressive purposes is dangerously as it gives reason for enemies to make swap to you. Using the deterrence for reflecting CC is also a possibility and often game changing. Use with caution!

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Silencing Shot:
Short cooldown, Long Range, Instant cast and 3 second interruption spell. Most hunters will be picking this as the current meta means playing with melee classes who is short on silence effects and thus no chance of it going on diminishing returns and devaluing. It is instant cast, 40 yards range and off the global cooldown which nearly guarantee you being able to get it off to interrupt or to prevent healing.
The short cooldown leaves it open for most situations and an easy tool for setting up crowdcontrol chains.

Wyvern Sting:
The not so popular Wyvern Sting! It shared Diminishing Returns with our trap leaving it extremely lacking compared to our beloved silence shot. However if Survival undergo a little changes replacing silence shot with Wyvern sting, and Freezing Trap with constant Frost Trap could prove extremely powerful... enough dreaming.

Binding Shot
Although Silencing Shot is better in pretty much every situation I can’t stop but dream of situations where a well-positioned Binding Shot combined with a glyphed Explosive Trap to trigger the stun could make you win the game. But the insecurity, inconsistency and required timing to pull that off makes it not worth it compared to our guaranteed on demand Silence Shot!

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Exhilaration has its strength in two fronts: an emergency heal and healing our pet. There will be so many situations where we are low on health and our healer is sitting in a few more seconds of CC, and this spell will be our free-pass. At the same time it will also allow us to use our pet in even more aggressive scenery allowing us to keep up the consistent pressure that BM require to be truly effective. All of the above combined with being reset through Readiness makes it a really valuable spell.

Aspect of the Iron Hawk
As much as an emergency heal is great; there will also be compositions where having a consistent damage reduction will be more valuable. You will have to take notice on this spell yourself, if you often find yourself in situations with sudden bursts, and one CC deaths, then do not pick this up. This spell’s strength is for consistency purposes, if you are often caught in longer games waiting for kills or in situations where you “almost” survived, then pick up this up. I will be explaining this further under the “build” explanation section.

Spirit Bond:
Yeah… no.

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Thrill of the Hunt:
Early season I would have argued that the in consistency of the spell made it a not looked-for talent. But given that the buff stays on you for a good period and that the meta game of BM require you to prepare burst periods with Arcane Shot I will go head and give this a little more credit than it most likely deserves.

Fervor provides us with an on-demand focus gain for those situations where we need to spam dispel, do extra damage or prepare for damage. Unlike the other talents this has its strength in being on-demand, consistent and very reliable. But it gives us an overwhelming amount of focus that can be hard to dump fast enough! Especially given that when we do eventually go for kills it is mostly combined with other buffs that alone will leave us with overwhelming amount of focus

Dire Beast:
No, having an extra pet and have focus regeneration rely on yet another pet mechanic is suicidal. We manage with our own pets as they have multiple ways of getting out of CC but Dire Beast is…silly

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Blink Strike:
I will not be commenting on this as it is being changed shortly.

Lynx Rush:
Read above

A Murder of Crows:
Read above

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Glaive Toss:
Glaive toss is instant cast so positioning, besides not breaking CC along the way, is not a primary concern when picking up this talent. One of the dangers with Power Shot is that we often spend long channeling the spell to get interrupt and essentially CCing ourselves. This is not a concern with Glaive Toss as it is instant cast and on a short cooldown we can get it of reliantly and maybe even twice during kill attempts. (Or three if Readiness) With the current meta forcing hunters to pick up the Vicious Talisman of the Shado Pan Assault it is also worth noticing that the most of these we can get off during a proc period, the stronger it gets. (Duhh)

Powerful burs that even with the 25% reduction recently is still an extremely powerful shot which can be utilized for opening bursts or swaps. It has a knock back that can prove useful on blade edge and dalaran but as these arenas are getting changed shortly I will not be going too much into the knockback besides a mini interruption for surrounding healers.

A simple no, should do for now.

Major Glyphs:

Glyph of Explosive Trap.
Removes the damage, adds knockback effect. Great spell for throwing people out of position, knocking down from Blade’s Edge Bridge/Pillars or Dalaran Sewers boxes. Takes our main weakness, (LOS/Position issues) and makes it into our greatest strengths. (The LOS at Dalaran is not much of a problem given the recent change to our ranged attacks not having a minimum range – and less relevant once they get changed with more stairs!)

Glyph of Morrored Blades.

This could be swapped for Master’s Call or Solace depending on what composition you are playing and where you are lacking as a team. There are more things to consider as written earlier:

[…] turn a spell-cleaves push into a spell-cleaves death. Notice this is a dangerous talent to pick for winning spell-cleaves, good players will see the hunter deterrence and immediately try to get a dot reflected to be immune to damage sensitive CC for a longer period. The deterrence is our survivability skill and as thus should be treated as such, using it for aggressive purposes is dangerously as it gives reason for enemies to make swap to you. Using the deterrence for reflecting CC is also a possibility and often game changing. Use with caution!”

Glyph of Disengage.

This could be swapped for Master’s Call or Solace depending on what composition you are playing and where you are lacking as a team.

This glyph will increase the length through height in which you disengage; this is extremely useful as it provides you with the possibility to disengage from the bottom of sewers floor, up onto the main platform. It will also allow you to do some stylish disengages on Blade’s Edge Arena.

Minor Glyphs:

Glyph of Revive Pet.
When our pet dies, we need it back up, this will be our savior when trying to get that 6 seconds cast off!

Glyph of Aspect of the Cheetah.
It isn’t crucial but since none of the other minor glyphs is more interesting this will be our second minor glyph. Use it for those few situations where you need to kite and don’t have any globals to use for other things.

Glyph of Stampede/Random

Depending on what arrangement of pets you choose to go with. I will be explaining this in much further detail under the pets section.

With the publication of Stampede at the release of Mists of Pandaria our pet selection got a whole lot more complicated than previously. During Cataclysm most people would use a wolf and a cat for buffing pre-match and then have a couple of monkeys for swapping out/abandoning dead ones during the fight.

During the stampede our 5 pets will be using all of its “auto-cast” spells, which means any spell that can be toggled to auto-casting will be cast through it. This includes damaging spells, debuffs and their 1 minute buffs.

There is currently one limitation; pets will only cast the spells if they have the auto-cast toggled on individually. If they do not have this you will need to have a macro for all of these spells,

A great place to go for a list of spells is here: http://www.wow-petop...nts/skills.html

The A-Team Pet Setup;
This is the most streamlined set of pets that you can run with. Now you will evidently be playing with team mates that will be bringing certain buffs. I suggest swapping out the pet that is rendered "useless" with one of the swaps listed below depending on what you lack/want as a team.

1. Shale Spider (Primary)  Or if MM/Surv Crane (Primary)
2. Quillen (Crit, 2min) Or if MM/Surv Wolf (Crit, 1min)
3. Hyena (Attack Speed, 2min)
4. Spirit Beast (Heal, Mastery, 2min) -///-  
5. Shale Spider (Back Up) Or if MM/Surv Crane (Back Up)

Devilsaur: 25% Healing Debuff. Reduce globals by not having to refresh Widow Venom.
Moth: 4 second interrupt.
Birds of Prey: 8 Second Disarm:
Ravager: 4% physical damage taken.
Raptor: 4% Armor Reduction. (Stacks up to 12%)
Spore Bats: 30% Casting Speed Reduction AoE.

Buff Setup: 5 Buffer’s
Given the swap list above you will should be able to put together a nice collection of pets focused on buffing.

Debuff Setup: 5 Debuffers
Given the swap list above you will should be able to put together a nice collection of pets focused on debuffing.

Role Confused Healing BM Setup: Spirit Beasts
5x Spirit Beasts - You run with a Spirit Beast and you use the Stampede Glyph to get even more spirit beasts. This is a good setup for running 2vs2 or doing battlegrounds, but really not desirable in competitive arena. Although it was extremely strong in the start of the expansion as you could easily put out competitive healing but given the changes it is no longer viable.

Build Explanation:
The Aggressive Hunter (...)
Coming Soon!

The Defensive Hunter (...)
Coming Soon!

The "I am in  your face and all over you" Hunter (...)

The Smart Hunter (...)
Coming Soon!

The "The floor is lava" Hunter (...)
Coming Soon!

The Confused Hunter (...)
Coming Soon!

The Average Hunter (99% of Hunter Population)
Coming Soon!

Coming Soon!

Coming Soon!

Coming Soon!

Head – Coming Soon!
Shoulders – Coming Soon!
Back - PvP Power - Coming Soon!
Chest – Stats - Coming Soon!
Wrist – Agility - Coming Soon!
Hands – Agility - Coming Soon!
Legs - Coming Soon!
Feet – Coming Soon!
Weapon - Coming Soon!

Frequently Asked Questions:

Question 1: Zionsfall doesn't even use Focus Fire because it makes you do less dmg is this true?

Question 2:


Shot Priority
Coming Soon!

Tips and Tricks
Coming Soon!

How to play against:
Coming Soon!

Coming Soon!

#3785735 Where the fuck do you buy honor gear

Posted Ensipid on 02 October 2012 - 11:41 PM



#3765143 PvP Power needs to be nerfed

Posted Tosan on 10 September 2012 - 09:08 PM

View PostFearful, on 10 September 2012 - 09:00 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure Tosan doesn't go outside or at the very least has no social life outside of WOW.

He literally thinks a girl who walked home drunk and dies deserved to get hit by a drunk driver.

In other news, stay small, stay 8th. Cy@

rofl you got trolled so hard it made you this mad, I own.

#3765124 PvP Power needs to be nerfed

Posted Tosan on 10 September 2012 - 08:35 PM

Your life must suck if you think having fun is a bad thing yo

#3758088 5.4 PVP Power and Resilience Guide

Posted Eldacar on 03 September 2012 - 01:00 AM

***With the release of Patch 6.0 leading up to Warlords, this guide is fully out-of-date, a full re-write is in progress***

Eldacar's Guide to PVP Power & Resilience

Hello PVP'ers! For those of you that don't know me I go by Eldacar and I am a long time PVP'er and PVP Theorycrafter, as well as a member of Blizzard's forum MVP program. I write PVP focused guides and do everything I can to help the PVP community grow and prosper, which is why I wrote this PVP Stats Guide. You can find me on twitter as @EldacarJS and on the US Official Forums as Eldacar@Boulderfist. This guide goes into a lot of detail and gets into some complex stuff in a few places, if you have questions leave them in the comments and I will answer them as best I can.

- The base damage reduction of Resilience was increased to 72%.
- The Resilience rating to damage reduction conversion formula was altered.

Summary & Key Points:
-Resilience has linear returns, +100 Resilience rating increases your effective health by 1.235% relative to displayed health.
-PVP Power has linear returns, +400 PVP Power gives you +1% damage or healing in PVP (before spec modifiers).
-The latest season's PVP gear is generally the best gear for instanced PVP, however in world PVP players with heroic raiding gear will have an advantage.
-PVP Power does not cancel out a target's Resilience but it will still help you hit them or heal them harder.
-It is generally ineffective to gem for PVP Power, gemming for primary stats is more effective in most cases.
-The PVP trinket set bonus offers roughly 8.25% effective damage reduction and will always increase your effective health by 32.11% of your displayed health.

Table of Contents:

Section 1 - Resilience
1A - The Exponential Returns of Damage Reduction
1B - The Diminishing Returns of Resilience Rating
1C - Baseline Damage Reduction
1D - Effective Health
1E - The Full Scale of Resilience
1F – Resilience on Items

Section 2 - PVP Power
2A - The Absolute vs Relative Returns of PVP Power
2B - PVP Power's Interaction with Resilience

Section 3 - Gemming for PVP

Section 4 - Closing Thoughts and Remarks

Section 5 - Appendix
Appendix A - Valuation and Frame of Reference
Appendix B - Formulas

Section 1 - Resilience

Everyone reading this likely already has at least a general understanding of how Resilience works; its fundamental purpose is to provide percentage based damage reduction against all damage done by players, the more Resilience you have the less damage you take. That is fairly straightforward and easy to understand; however understanding how the stat scales and all the factors at work is more complicated. There are three main factors that go into how Resilience scales, first is the exponential returns of percentage based damage reduction, second is the diminishing returns of Resilience rating, and third is the baseline 72% reduction that all players have in PVP.

Section 1A - The Exponential Returns of Damage Reduction

The effects of percentage based damage reduction scale exponentially, the more you have the more valuable additional damage reduction becomes. For example, let's say someone is hitting you for 100 damage, if you have 0% damage reduction and you add 1% that 100 damage is reduced to 99 damage, a 1% effective reduction. However if you already have 90% damage reduction and you add another 1% that 100 base damage which was already reduced to 10 is now further reduced to 9. That change in incoming damage from 10 to 9 is a 10% reduction in actual damage taken by adding just 1% of damage reduction.

Here is a graph that shows how the value of damage reduction increases as you gain more:

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As you can see at 50% damage reduction additional reduction is worth twice as much as normal, at 90% its worth ten times as much as normal. This kind of scaling isn't unique to Resilience, armor and any other percentage based damage reduction (even in other games) function the same way. Games control the overall scaling of these mechanics by manipulating how fast you are awarded the damage reduction.

One additional note on this, in World of Warcraft different damage reduction mechanics have multiplicative relationships NOT additive, what that means is that the value scaling for any one of these mechanics is only accurate within that one mechanic. At 50% damage reduction from Resilience an extra 1% from Resilience is effectively worth 2%, however none of this has any bearing on the value of additional damage reduction from say armor, that scales totally independently but in a similar fashion. Because these defensive stats scale independently from each other and have a multiplicative relationship they can each be examined and valued independently.

Section 1B - The Diminishing Returns of Resilience Rating

For Resilience the main factor that counters the exponential scaling of percentage based damage reduction is the diminishing returns on Resilience rating. The more Resilience rating you have the less damage reduction is awarded by each additional point of rating, as shown in the graph below. This is how Blizzard controls the overall scaling of Resilience as a whole, and it is what they change when they want to alter the way Resilience scales.

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As you can see in the graph, the amount of additional damage reduction provided by additional Resilience gradually declines as Resilience rating increases.

Section 1C - Baseline PVP Damage Reduction

Mists of Pandaria added a new factor to the way Resilience scales, the baseline PVP damage reduction that all players have which was increased from 65% to 72% in patch 5.4. What this has effectively done is significantly shrink the damage reduction gap between under geared players and fully geared players. This combined with the limited availability of Resilience on gear and through gems has significantly lessened the impact of resilience as a stat at level 90. The difference in damage reduction between a fresh level 90 and someone in the best possible pvp gear is now relatively small.

Section 1D - Effective Health

Effective Health (or EH) is perhaps the most critical metric for measuring survivability. Effective health is essentially how much pre-mitigated damage it takes to kill you. If you have 100k health and 0% damage reduction your effective health is just that same 100k. However if you have 100k health and 50% damage reduction your effective health is 200k, because someone would need to do the equivalent of 200k pre-mitigaged damage to kill you.

It is also important to note that more than just increasing the size of your effective health pool, damage reduction also increases the relative effectiveness of heals on you. With 50% damage reduction a 1k heal actually restores 2k of effective health. This is one of the reasons why increasing your effective health through damage reduction is better than increasing your effective health an equivalent amount through raw stamina.

Effective health is really the stat that best indicates the value you are getting from Resilience and it is the stat you need to be paying attention to when evaluating the survivability of your character. Effective health is displayed on the graphs below as a percentage relative to displayed health, an effective health (EH) value of 150% for a player with a 100k displayed health pool would mean that player has an effective health from just Resilience of 150k. When you factor in other effects like armor and damage reduction from talents your EH is higher but we are just looking at Resilience by itself here.

Looking at effective health over the full scale of resilience as shown below illustrates how the exponential returns of damage reduction and the diminishing returns of Resilience rating combine to cancel each other out and generate perfectly linear returns.

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As you can see the effective health returns of resilience are perfectly linear, adding 100 Resilience rating will always increase your effective health by 1.235% relative to your displayed health.

Section 1E - The Full Scale of Resilience

This next graph brings it all together displaying both the scaling of damage reduction and effective health based on Resilience rating at level 90 in patch 5.4.

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This graph should drive home once again that although the damage reduction you get from additional Resilience diminishes the more you get your effective health continues in a linear fashion anyway thanks to the increasing relative value of that damage reduction.

Section 1F - Resilience on Items

At this point you may be thinking "I want to get as much resilience as possible and become totally unkillable!" which sounds great, but unfortunately it is a bit impractical. Although there is no Resilience cap you are extremely limited in the amount of resilience you can get in game on current season items. Most fully geared players will have around 3375, which is what you get from the PVP trinket set bonus and the PVP meta gem. The lack of resilience on gear is not a big issue because currently a player with nothing but the baseline 72% reduction already has 357% effective health, which is more than most fully geared players had at the end of Cataclysm.

For those of you contemplating using a PVE trinket or two here are some facts to help you make your decision. The 2600 Resilience offered by the PVP trinket set bonus provides roughly 2.31% additional damage reduction from baseline, which is about 8.25% effective damage reduction after factoring in the value scaling. Furthermore the set bonus will always increase your effective health by 32.11% relative to displayed health, so if you are currently at baseline you would go from 357% EH to 389% EH.

Section 2 - PVP Power

PVP Power is a relatively new stat introduced to the game in Mists of Pandaria which acts as the offensive compliment to Resilience. The idea behind this new stat is to encourage players to use PVP gear in PVP by putting major PVP-only offensive gains onto PVP gear (or in the case of healers, healing gains). PVP Power increases all damage done to players (under all circumstances), and healing done (while outside PVE-instances), by a percentage that increases based on how much PVP Power rating you have. The amount of each bonus you get is also dependent on your class and spec.

-Healing specs receive 100% of the healing bonus but 0% of the damage bonus
-All other specs receive 100% of the damage bonus and a partial healing bonus depending on class.
-Damage specs for Druids, Monks, Paladins, Priests, and Shamans receive a 70% healing bonus.
-All other specializations and classes (including tanking) receive a 40% bonus to healing from PvP Power.

PVP Power is currently the primary differentiator between PVP gear and PVE gear. It is a "free" stat on PVP gear, meaning it is not factored into the item's stat budget. As a result when comparing PVP items to PVE items of the same item level all the general-purpose stats should be equivalent but the PVP gear will have PVP Power on it as well making it a better choice for PVP. This fact is particularly important due to the presence of item level limits in all instanced PVP. The item level limits change with each season, but their purpose is to limit the item level of PVE gear to be equal to or lower than the item level of the current season's PVP gear. These two factors together generally ensure that the current season's PVP gear is always the best gear for instanced PVP. However the item level limits do not function in the open world, so in world PVP a player in the latest heroic raiding gear will likely (and unfortunately) have a large gear advantage.

Section 2A - The Absolute vs Relative Returns of PVP Power

PVP Power's scaling is very straight forward; it has linear returns when looking at it in an absolute sense, adding 400 PVP Power will always give you another +1% damage or healing in PVP depending on your spec. So every additional point of PVP Power will increase your damage/healing by the same amount. However I have seen some players around the forums describing PVP Power as having diminishing returns, and they are correct to an extent.

If you evaluate the returns of PVP Power in a relative sense it does have diminishing returns, going from 0%-1% will give you the same absolute damage increase as going from 30-31%, but in the latter case that damage increase is smaller relative to the damage you are already doing. Virtually everything in the game operates the same way. Think about primary stats for example; +3000 strength would give a warrior a pretty nice bump in damage right now. However if Blizzard said "Hey we like you random warrior!" and bumped their strength up to 100,000 then that +3000 strength would suddenly be worth a lot less to them even though it would still increase their damage by the same amount. The reality is that in order for a stat to offer you consistent relative gains as you gear up the stat would need to have increasing absolute returns, in other words it would need to give you more and more damage or healing the more of it you got. (For more info on absolute vs relative valuation see Appendix A)

Now it is time to look at the actual scaling of PVP power, which is shown in the graph below.

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As shown in this graph PVP Power's returns are perfectly linear. You gain either +1% damage or healing for every 400 PVP Power you have, this is also the “baseline” upon which the reduced healing bonuses for non-healing spec are based. The red line shows the healing bonus for hybrids (70% of baseline), and the yellow line shows the healing bonus for everyone else (40% of baseline).

Section 2B - PVP Power's Interaction with Resilience

The most common misconception that most players seem to have about PVP Power is that it acts as a kind of "Resilience Penetration" which counteracts the target's damage reduction 1 for 1, that is simply not true. PVP Power increases your damage by the percentage shown in your stat panel, it always increases it by that same amount regardless of how much damage reduction the target has. Your outgoing damage is calculated first, then the target's damage reduction mitigates that damage according to their stats.

Take for example a warrior who's swing always does 100 damage in PVE. This warrior gets a +50% damage increase from PVP Power in PVP, so that 100 damage get's increased to 150 damage in PVP. This warrior has now decided to attack a paladin that looked at him the wrong way. Lets say the paladin has +50% damage reduction; so when the warrior's 150 damage hits him it is reduced to down to 75. That is how PVP Power and Resilience interact, the outgoing damage is boosted up by PVP Power, then the total incoming damage is mitigated down by Resilience.

Section 3 - Gemming for PVP

One of the most popular questions I get is "What should I gem for?" Unfortunately I cannot provide a clear cut answer to that question. The answer is dependent on your gear level, class, spec, play style and more. My recommendation is to check how the pros of your class/spec are gemming, and then experiment to see what works best for your personal play style. However I will say that it is typically ineffective to gem PVP Power at level 90, gemming primary stats is generally more effective for damage or healing.

Choosing the best gem for survivability is significantly more complicated. Stamina gems will almost always provide you with more effective health, but Resilience gems don't lag too far behind in the effective health they add. Additionally Resilience gems scale up in value proportional to the amount of healing you receive because they increase the amount of effective health restored by that healing. For now I recommend gemming for resilience if you are looking to increase your survivability, but I will look at this topic in more depth in a future guide.

Section 4 - Closing Thoughts and Remarks

I hope that this guide has been illuminating for everyone that has taken the time to read it, I have tried to provide as much accurate and detailed information as possible about the way these stats work. If you have questions about these stats or about anything written here feel free to ask and I will do my best to get you an answer.

I error checked this guide many times however I am still human, so if you believe you see an error please let know and I will look into it. I also want to make it clear that although I am a member of Blizzard's Forum MVP program I am NOT a Blizzard employee and nothing in this guide is based on any kind of inside information. All the data in this guide was all generated based on direct in-game observation and calculations based on that observed data.

General Notes
-This guide is written for level 90 players, the numbers are different at lower levels
-This guide just underwent a major update and revision, if you notice a typo please let me know!
-Some of the graph types from previous versions of the guide have been removed to reduce the complexity of the guide, but may return in the future.

Section 5 - Appendices

This is some additional information about some of the ideas, concepts, and data discussed in this guide. Additional appendices may be added over time as needed.

Appendix A - Valuation and Frame of Reference

Absolute valuation compares numbers based on addition and subtraction, IE going from 30% damage reduction to 60% damage reduction is an absolute gain of 30%. Relative valuation compares numbers using ratios, IE going from 30% damage reduction to 60% damage reduction is a relative gain of 100%. Why is this important? Because taking the example a step further, going from 60% to 90% is an absolute gain of 30%, exactly the same as before, but it is a relative gain of 50%, half as much as before. So if this trend were to continue, it would signify linear absolute returns but diminishing relative returns. This guide primarily uses absolute valuation because it is much easier to understand and work with when comparing a large number of data points to a common baseline.

Frame of reference is another critical concept for evaluating data, particularly when most of the data is in percentages. There are two basic methods that can be used to evaluate a string of data points; constant frame of reference, or progressive frame of reference. Constant frame of reference uses one common baseline value as a reference point, every data point is compared to that baseline. In contrast a progressive frame of reference compares each data point to the data point before it. Take for example this set of data points: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. On a graph using a constant frame of reference they would be displayed as 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 (all data points were compared to a baseline of 0). However on a graph using a progressive frame of reference they would be displayed as 1, 1, 1, 1, 1 (each data point was 1 larger than the number before it).

Using a constant frame of reference makes it much easier to evaluate the actual changes in the progression of a data set, where as using a relative frame of reference allows you to better evaluate changes in the rate of change over the progression of a data set. Since we are more interested in the actual changes than the rate of change when viewing the scaling of stats I chose to use a constant frame of reference for the graphs in this guide.

Appendix B - Formulas

The formula I use to calculate damage reduction from resilience in patch 5.4 is:
Reduction %  = ((28900*0.72)+x)/(28900+x)
x represents resilience rating.

The formula I use to calculate damage increase from PVP is:
Damage increase %  =  x/400
x represents PVP Power rating

#3756254 Hybrid healing/self healing just as bad at 90

Posted Zong on 01 September 2012 - 05:26 AM

I thought that things were legitimately going to be balanced for level 90, but it doesnt seem that way watching this:

The only thing that seems a tad better is the the mana regen, but they still don't go oom in a fast way at all. Why even play with healers in MOP if hybrids are healing this well?

Expect to see a LOT more triple DPS and triple/double healer teams in MOP if this persists without massive nerfs.

#3754496 10 second disarm.

Posted Shawtss on 29 August 2012 - 01:35 PM

I believe this is the proper response to your post, someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

Shaman mad because of triple dps.

#3748755 That tingling feeling when you get gladiator for the first time

Posted Dagin on 23 August 2012 - 08:05 AM

while 3 dps is gay I like these warlocks coming in acting all self righteous like warlocks are hard.

#3745872 WoW meme thread

Posted mackazar on 18 August 2012 - 02:35 AM

nope sorry Don

#3742223 Am I alone in the world or does this make sense

Posted Conradical on 11 August 2012 - 08:00 AM

View PostLewisxo, on 11 August 2012 - 07:49 AM, said:

i would make love to this man with my eyes closed and pretend that he's the most beautiful woman that i have ever seen

just gonna...walk away...

#3741418 RBG Ladder Cheating, Exploiting, Bugs

Posted Vexo on 10 August 2012 - 03:26 AM

View PostBailamosx, on 10 August 2012 - 01:19 AM, said:

Not sure why idiots like you even bother posting.

Not sure why you even bother posting, everyone knows that you bought glad.