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Frost damage needs to be reevaluated


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#1 Napkincakes

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:34 AM

At the moment frost damage overall is too low. Prior to 3.2 :mage: shatters were not amazing but they still kept pressure. Now frost damage is just completely horrible, and it needs a change.

Heres a screenshot of a shatter against a 950 resil :shaman:.
http://img23.imagesh...56/shatterk.jpg

I have 2239 spell power. I know that it's not a lot but another 300 spell power in S7 isn't enough to make my shatter good. :warlock: on the other hand are still ridiculous, even with the resil change.
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#2 Pirated

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:37 AM

am I really bad at math or did that do 7.5k damage?
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#3 Quadzy

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:40 AM

am I really bad at math or did that do 7.5k damage?


clearly cant be viable if u cant deal atleast 10k dmg in 1 global...
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#4 Rabidhobo

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:43 AM

these threads are like the who is a moron identifier. at least one person from every class posted a thread saying My dmg went down alot this patch wtf? yea resilience change = less dmg. everyone got toned down slugger read some patch notes.
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#5 Napkincakes

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:47 AM

these threads are like the who is a moron identifier. at least one person from every class posted a thread saying My dmg went down alot this patch wtf? yea resilience change = less dmg. everyone got toned down slugger read some patch notes.


I am glad that you could add some insightful conjecture to this thread.
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#6 Adetter

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 05:15 AM

Mage damage is fine. Other classes having retarded burst doesn't justify mages becoming op also. My frostbolts went from critting for 8k down to 7k-7.5k. If you're asking for a damage buff you're probably doing something wrong.
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#7 Charred

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 06:13 AM

mage dmg is how it should be tbh.
I still go chaosbolted for 8.6k in 3V3 yday ;<, though not stacking full resi yet
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Posted 06 August 2009 - 06:14 AM

doesnt change much with resil
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#9 nim

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 06:55 AM

We got a 20% MS.
We got about a net 5% buff to Frost Bolt damage (Traded 4% crit for ~9% haste on Emp. Frost Bolt).
We got a flat 15% cut on the cost of Frost Spells.
We got more haste options on PvP gear and our PvE gear this cycle is broken as he'll if you can get ahold of it.

We lost about five or six precent damage from the resil change, which effects everyone.

What the fuck more do you people want? Mages are awesome and balanced, shut the hell up.
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#10 GLopez

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 10:33 AM

Uh, my Mage feels amazing and it's in pretty bad gear. The only problem is I kind of struggle with healers in duels, but that translates really differently in BGs and arenas, where I've had no problems.
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#11 Janni

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 12:39 PM

Wow.. I thought that mages finally became on pair with other classes.
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#12 elyk456

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 12:45 PM

i honestly do not see any difference in my lolburst as destro, and still feel completely overpowered


not even going to play for the rest of the season unless i go affy for a 3s
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#13 Fleetwood

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 12:57 PM

Destro burst does seem a little lower on it's own, but it's certainly still enough. I personally feel like my damage has gone up significantly since the patch.
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#14 Hide

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 01:05 PM

shatter damage does plenty of pressure..... when it crits.
I wish there was some sort of reliable way to make sure it would.
when you're getting cleave trained and can only set up 1-2 shatters per game, having 0 crits, thus pathetic damage, is very very frustrating.

Locks do about as much as a crit shatter with their NON-crits.....
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#15 Spiders

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 07:06 PM

If shatter crit 100% of the time mage damage would be fine. Theorectically it doesn't even double crit half the time. Needs to be changed
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#16 affix

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 07:59 PM

these threads are like the who is a moron identifier. at least one person from every class posted a thread saying My dmg went down alot this patch wtf? yea resilience change = less dmg. everyone got toned down slugger read some patch notes.


The difference between Mages and other classes is that our damage was already too low before the patch hit. I'm at 2k spell power. That's perfectly respectable for a Mage without a lot of PvE gear. My frostbolts crit for about 4.5k against an average opponent. That's not okay for a 2.5 base speed cast.

We got a 20% MS.
We got about a net 5% buff to Frost Bolt damage (Traded 4% crit for ~9% haste on Emp. Frost Bolt).
We got a flat 15% cut on the cost of Frost Spells.
We got more haste options on PvP gear and our PvE gear this cycle is broken as he'll if you can get ahold of it.

We lost about five or six precent damage from the resil change, which effects everyone.

What the fuck more do you people want? Mages are awesome and balanced, shut the hell up.


4% less crit and 9% more haste is not equivalent to 5% more damage. Our shatters will, on average, hit for less now. Realistically we get a few options per game to put out a lot of pressure. The -0.2 seconds probably won't let us create any MORE options to put out pressure. I see it as a nerf, personally.

BEFORE the patch, I figure we needed a ~10% damage buff. Now that number is more like 15-20% against a geared opponent. We're roughly 20% behind fire in PvE, so a 15% damage buff does not seem unreasonable to me.
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#17 Revelstoke

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 08:04 PM

The difference between Mages and other classes is that our damage was already too low before the patch hit. I'm at 2k spell power. That's perfectly respectable for a Mage without a lot of PvE gear. My frostbolts crit for about 4.5k against an average opponent. That's not okay for a 2.5 base speed cast.



4% less crit and 9% more haste is not equivalent to 5% more damage. Our shatters will, on average, hit for less now. Realistically we get a few options per game to put out a lot of pressure. The -0.2 seconds probably won't let us create any MORE options to put out pressure. I see it as a nerf, personally.

BEFORE the patch, I figure we needed a ~10% damage buff. Now that number is more like 15-20% against a geared opponent. We're roughly 20% behind fire in PvE, so a 15% damage buff does not seem unreasonable to me.

yeah but the whole point is the reason you have 2k spell power is because you stack all that haste. which makes none of your frost bolts even close to 2.5seconds

mage damage is fine, considering their utility, and survivability
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#18 Erase

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 08:05 PM

We got a 20% MS.
We got about a net 5% buff to Frost Bolt damage (Traded 4% crit for ~9% haste on Emp. Frost Bolt).
We got a flat 15% cut on the cost of Frost Spells.
We got more haste options on PvP gear and our PvE gear this cycle is broken as he'll if you can get ahold of it.

We lost about five or six precent damage from the resil change, which effects everyone.

What the fuck more do you people want? Mages are awesome and balanced, shut the hell up.


this
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#19 affix

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 08:11 PM

yeah but the whole point is the reason you have 2k spell power is because you stack all that haste. which makes none of your frost bolts even close to 2.5seconds


I don't think you understand how insignificant ~400 spell power exchanged for ~400 haste is in terms of an individual Frostbolt's damage. If I drop all that haste for spell power, they'll crit for ~4750 instead of ~4400. My ice lances will gain maybe ~100 average damage per cast. This is exactly why we stack haste.

mage damage is fine, considering their utility, and survivability


The facts just don't substantiate this baseless claim. 9th in 2v2, 8th in 3v3, tied for 10th in 5v5. Dead last in the top 100.

We can have all the utility in the world, completely stopping anyone from moving at all times. We can survive being trained till we turn blue. But eventually our teammates will die, or we'll run OOM, or both, without some damage.

High survivability is a good reason for HEALERS not to do good damage, not DPS.
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#20 yoyot

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 08:12 PM

Buffing frost mage damage by 15% would make it really overpowered coupled with tricks and imp kidney, those shatters already hurt alot
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