Jump to content

Photo

Calling the AJ community


  • Please log in to reply
53 replies to this topic

#21 Cruxis

Cruxis
  • Posts: 2,584

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:41 AM

Affliction sucked in TBC? Demonology did? Are you trying to look stupid? Last time I checked, prety much every Warlock in 5v5 was Felguard spec.

And Enhancement didn't suck either, infact Enhancement was better in TBC than it is now.

Every class had viable specs in TBC, some had 3 (Shaman) some had 2 (Paladin, Druid) most had 1.

It has 1000x more balanced than it was now.
  • 0

Honestly it doesnt matter what people think of me. I make money playing this game, and soon to be a world champion. stop us if u can.


Salute to the World Champion.

#22 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:42 AM

This one time, I saw a feral druid.

What factor more arms warriors or resto druids did you see than enhance shaman or demo locks?

And really, why are you talking about 5v5...
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#23 Abeyance

Abeyance
  • Members
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Bleeding Hollow
  • Ruin
  • Posts: 2,422
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/0/0/2/.

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:45 AM

What Fierss said.

2's games in TBC could last forever (this is completely ignoring 3's/5's, except for possibly PHD mirrors, lol), but at least they didn't randomly end with someone dying in a HoJ. While many specs were terrible, at least the experience was more enjoyable (I am sorry if your shitty offspec wasn't good in Arena, you should have respecced or rerolled).

The rest of the game may be better balanced, but balance doesn't mean enjoyment. PvE is PvE, as long as you're doing your role to the best of your ability and your raid doesn't can you because your class is shitty, who cares if your class is shitty? PvE hasn't been fun since AQ/Naxx for me.
  • 0

Arenajunkies is here to entertain you.

Activi$ion Blizzard.


#24 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:49 AM

I am sorry if your shitty offspec wasn't good in Arena, you should have respecced or rerolled


Do you even know what balance is? Pick and choose what you want and ignore the rest?
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#25 Abeyance

Abeyance
  • Members
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Bleeding Hollow
  • Ruin
  • Posts: 2,422
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/0/0/2/.

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:49 AM

Despite that list, every class was viable in TBC (as long as you didn't have downs and cried about not being able to spec for specific spec X).

I mean seriously, why do Prot specs need to be viable in Arena? (Same goes with most on that list.)
  • 0

Arenajunkies is here to entertain you.

Activi$ion Blizzard.


#26 Abeyance

Abeyance
  • Members
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Bleeding Hollow
  • Ruin
  • Posts: 2,422
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/0/0/2/.

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:51 AM

Do you even know what balance is? Pick and choose what you want and ignore the rest?


The game is more balanced now (between the specs). That doesn't mean the game is better.

I would rather have a less balanced game (aka can all the offspecs) that is more enjoyable (aka TBC > WotLK).
  • 0

Arenajunkies is here to entertain you.

Activi$ion Blizzard.


#27 Sykeasaurus

Sykeasaurus
  • Moderators
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • US-Sargeras
  • Shadowburn
  • Posts: 7,072
  • Talents: Shadow

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:52 AM

A handful of changes. Are you kidding me?

Specs that sucked in TBC;

Demonology (Not SL/SL)
Affliction
Destruction
Fire
Arcane
Protection (paladin)
Fury
Protection (warrior)
Balance
Feral
Beast Mastery
Survival
Holy (priest)
Holy (paladin)
Enhance
Combat
Assassination

And hell, maybe more. No, "This one time, I saw a feral" doesn't count. Balance those with a "handful of changes".

Anyone who looks at that list and says "Well, they don't need to be balanced" has no right to comment on GC. Balance isn't just making 6 specs of 5 classes work and telling the rest to fuck off or reroll.


Are you trolling, or are you this retarded? Like I can't even tell. I'm hoping you're trolling.

Druids: Deep resto, Dreamstate.

Hunters: Marks, Survival (I played with one in 2v2, so you're already 100% wrong here, and multiple other Hunters played this), BM worked in 4 dps 5v5, you're also wrong there.

Mages: Frost

Paladins: Holy worked. Difference is you had to be good. There's even rank 1 paladins from TBC. Ret worked, obviously.

Priests: Disc worked. Shadow worked. In multiple comps these worked.

Rogue: Mutilate did work. Stop fucking talking out of your ass. I played with one and saw several others running Priest/Rogue as mutilate. Shadowstep worked. In some cases, there were a few Combat/Shadowpriest setups.

Shaman: Resto worked. Ele worked for several seasons in 5s. Enhance worked. Did you even play BC? Did you notice tournaments had enhancement shamans IN THEM? And they were on MULTIPLE cleave setups?

Warlock: SL/SL worked. Felguard/Shadowbolt spec worked for 5s. In some rare cases, even destro worked for 4 dps comps.

Warrior: Arms worked.



Holy shit you are trolling. That's 19 different AND NOT COMPLETELY UNCOMMON SPECS.

9 classes back in the day, 27 different trees. And you could come up with at least 19 different ways to spec.

.............
  • 0

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes



I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.


i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day


#28 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:52 AM

The game is more balanced now (between the specs). That doesn't mean the game is better.

I would rather have a less balanced game (aka can all the offspecs) that is more enjoyable (aka TBC > WotLK).


Because if I want to play a prot warrior in arena, the arena should be balanced around allowing me to.

Now, you tell me why certain specs don't deserve to be viable.

The latter part of your post, I agree with. Balance is easier when there's only 10 specs to do it around rather than 30, but that doesn't make the game more balanced as a whole.
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#29 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:54 AM

.

Druids: Deep resto, Dreamstate.

Hunters: Marks, Survival (I played with one in 2v2, so you're already 100% wrong here, and multiple other Hunters played this), BM worked in 4 dps 5v5, you're also wrong there.

Mages: Frost

Paladins: Holy worked. Difference is you had to be good. There's even rank 1 paladins from TBC. Ret worked, obviously.

Priests: Disc worked. Shadow worked. In multiple comps these worked.

Rogue: Mutilate did work. Stop fucking talking out of your ass. I played with one and saw several others running Priest/Rogue as mutilate. Shadowstep worked. In some cases, there were a few Combat/Shadowpriest setups.

Shaman: Resto worked. Ele worked for several seasons in 5s. Enhance worked. Did you even play BC? Did you notice tournaments had enhancement shamans IN THEM? And they were on MULTIPLE cleave setups?

Warlock: SL/SL worked. Felguard/Shadowbolt spec worked for 5s. In some rare cases, even destro worked for 4 dps comps.

Warrior: Arms worked.




You think because a handful of people made a bad spec work, it's balanced?

See many enhance or rets outside of cleave? Were enhance and rets as flexible as arms or rogues?

CBA commenting on 5v5.
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#30 Sykeasaurus

Sykeasaurus
  • Moderators
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • US-Sargeras
  • Shadowburn
  • Posts: 7,072
  • Talents: Shadow

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:56 AM

Specs that sucked in TBC;

Demonology (Not SL/SL) Wrong.
Affliction
Destruction Wrong.
Fire
Arcane
Protection (paladin)
Fury
Protection (warrior)
Balance
Feral
Beast Mastery Wrong.
Survival Wrong.
Holy (priest)
Holy (paladin) Wrong.
Enhance Wrong.
Combat Wrong.
Assassination Wrong.

For a TL;DR.
  • 0

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes



I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.


i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day


#31 Sykeasaurus

Sykeasaurus
  • Moderators
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • US-Sargeras
  • Shadowburn
  • Posts: 7,072
  • Talents: Shadow

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:57 AM

You think because a handful of people made a bad spec work, it's viable?

See many enhance or rets outside of cleave? CBA commenting on 5v5.


It's impossible for me to pull up an SK-100 or whatever the fuck you want me to do to prove you wrong. What do you mean, HANDFUL of people?

You just quoted my fucking post and don't even talk about which spec is A HANDFUL OF SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE.
  • 0

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes



I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.


i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day


#32 Pobzy

Pobzy
  • Junkies
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • EU-Dragonmaw
  • Cataclysme / Cataclysm
  • Posts: 664
  • Talents:

Posted 05 June 2009 - 10:58 AM

Yeah the 5-6 viable specs made the game a real joy. I loved nothing more than chasing a druid around a pillar for 20 minutes while every time he came close to dying, I'd get a convenient mace stun.

No. TBC was awful.


GTFO to elitist jerks.
  • 0

#33 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:00 AM

It's impossible for me to pull up an SK-100 or whatever the fuck you want me to do to prove you wrong. What do you mean, HANDFUL of people?

You just quoted my fucking post and don't even talk about which spec is A HANDFUL OF SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE.


Think you ought to grab a coffee before you pop a vein.

So I'll ask something simple. Were rets, enhance, and everything I listed on that list well rounded, balanced specs viable in every bracket?
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#34 Abeyance

Abeyance
  • Members
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Bleeding Hollow
  • Ruin
  • Posts: 2,422
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/0/0/2/.

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:04 AM

Because if I want to play a prot warrior in arena, the arena should be balanced around allowing me to.

Now, you tell me why certain specs don't deserve to be viable.

The latter part of your post, I agree with. Balance is easier when there's only 10 specs to do it around rather than 30, but that doesn't make the game more balanced as a whole.


I am assuming the people who come to AJ are the kind who play to win. Yes they want balance, but at the end of the day I believe they want 2 things: enjoyment and accomplishment. These are the kind of people who will, most of the time, play the spec that is going to give them the best, and if not the best at least a good chance, at winning. Therefore, for this crowd, as long as their class has 1 viable Arena spec, then things are "balanced" for these players. In the end those at AJ, while wanting to play to win, aren't getting any sense of accomplishment out of winning because of how much of a joke it is to win 1-2 minutes. The shorter a game, the larger impact CD's have.

Honestly, I couldn't care less (and I am sure that many at AJ agree) if the casuals running around the 1500's are trying to make spec Y viable. They are playing a completely different game than those at the higher brackets.
  • 0

Arenajunkies is here to entertain you.

Activi$ion Blizzard.


#35 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:06 AM

So we've moved from "GC has ruined balance" to "GC has made high-end arena less attractive."

I agree with the latter. I disagree with the former. The game is certainly more balanced as a whole, even if high-end arena is messy.
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#36 Abeyance

Abeyance
  • Members
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Bleeding Hollow
  • Ruin
  • Posts: 2,422
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/0/0/2/.

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:11 AM

I agree that people are harsh on GC, treating him as the mastermind behind changes when he is merely the spokesman (he has said dumb shit, which is what he should be called out on, but the balance changes aren't really him entirely).

I think most people agree that the game is more "balanced" now (S6) than it has been previously (balanced in the term of spec equality and viability), though this is probably lacking in the healer department. But yes, that doesn't mean the game is more fun. While in theory we all would like a more balanced game, it is quite clear that Blizzard struggles to balance simpler specs (Ret/DK/etc) while still achieving spec parity. Thus, most of us would rather can the offspecs (obviously not the die-hards but as I said earlier, they can diaf) if it meant that the game was more attractive.
  • 0

Arenajunkies is here to entertain you.

Activi$ion Blizzard.


#37 Sykeasaurus

Sykeasaurus
  • Moderators
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • US-Sargeras
  • Shadowburn
  • Posts: 7,072
  • Talents: Shadow

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:11 AM

Think you ought to grab a coffee before you pop a vein.

So I'll ask something simple. Were rets, enhance, and everything I listed on that list well rounded, balanced specs viable in every bracket?


DKs: Blood isn't even on the page anymore with Frost and Unholy being around. Otherwise they can play all brackets.

Druids: Resto is ridiculous in 2v2, but as the brackets get bigger they start to lose viability and other healers become more popular. Balance is no where to be find in any decent 2's, 3's or 5's. Feral is typically seen in 2v2, otherwise it's rarely seen in 3's and never in 5v5.

Hunters: BM is never seen in 2v2, and rarely in 3v3 in 5v5, if ever. Same goes for marks. Survival is typically the only thing you ever see, and it can work in all brackets.

Mages: Arcane can work in 2v2 with a rogue and very rarely is going to be the spec of choice for 3v3. Arcane is like never in 5's either. Fire isn't seen ever. Frost can be played in all 3 brackets.

Paladins: Holy isn't seen as much in 2v2 anymore with the Prot/Holy hybrids. It's viable in 3v3/5v5. Full prot isn't seen in any bracket. Ret can work in all 3.

Priests: Disc can work in all 3 brackets. Holy isn't seen. Shadow sucks dick across the board pretty much. Only a handful of people are even successful with it and that doesn't fit into your argument, so you may as well say they're never seen.

Rogues: Assassination works in all 3 brackets. Combat isn't seen. Sub definitely isn't seen, except MAYBE on a team with an Arcane Mage and those are turbo fucking rare as well.

Shamans: Elemental doesn't work in 2v2, works in very rare cases in 3v3 and in some cases 5v5. Enhance isn't seen in 2v2, and rarely in 3v3. Same goes for 5v5, rare. Resto works in all 3 brackets.

Warlocks: Affliction can work in 2v2, 3v3. Not so much 5v5, destro is going to be better. No one plays demo. Destro can work in all 3 brackets.

Warriors: Arms works in all 3 brackets. Fury isn't seen in any brackets. Prot isn't seen in any brackets, and if it is, it's a rarity and doesn't fit in your argument.


WOTLK "balance" is at best the same as BC if not far worse in terms of viable specs. Couple that with how retarded the burst is and WOTLK arena is far and away worse than BC arena ever came close to being.

Good enough yet?
  • 0

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes



I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.


i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day


#38 Tya

Tya
  • Junkies
  • Posts: 2,480

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:19 AM

We're not on the same level here. I'm not saying "You can take x spec to rank 1", I'm saying "These specs WORK, Joe Bloggs can play his BM hunter or prot warrior and get to a decent standing in arena. In TBC he was fucked.".

Like I said, high-end arena may be messy but PvP balance as a whole isn't. It's a lot better. As is PvE and even professions.
  • 0
<Memorable quote>

#39 Pobzy

Pobzy
  • Junkies
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • EU-Dragonmaw
  • Cataclysme / Cataclysm
  • Posts: 664
  • Talents:

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:21 AM

Think you ought to grab a coffee before you pop a vein.

So I'll ask something simple. Were rets, enhance, and everything I listed on that list well rounded, balanced specs viable in every bracket?


So you'd rather have a game that's balanced and retarded than a game that's semi balanced and good?
  • 0

#40 Cruxis

Cruxis
  • Posts: 2,584

Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:38 AM

So you'd rather have a game that's balanced and retarded than a game that's semi balanced and good?


Compared to now? I'd say every spec was perfectly balanced.

At the very least in TBC you couldn't die to a single DPS in 3 GCDs.

Anyone thinking compared to now that TBC wasn't even remotable balanced is retarded.
  • 0

Honestly it doesnt matter what people think of me. I make money playing this game, and soon to be a world champion. stop us if u can.


Salute to the World Champion.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

<