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Fucking wow, I've no idea how you manage


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#1 Lolflay

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:10 PM

I've always despised rogues, especially rogue druids in s4 but I felt there was skill involved so I just kept my mouth shut and played the game, especially because I was playing friends rogues' at the time and learning the class, etc.

But now, I've got to 2200 as RM, with me being the rogue, and we dropped to 2000. I can't even fucking TELL you how much I wanted that fucking nerd DK to be infront of me so I can fucking rip his throat out and stab him with a large kitchen knife so much fucking times so he'd scream like a little girl.

Clos ? NP LOL DISEASES GO THROUGH
Vanish ? LOLOLDOLAWODL DEATH GRIPPED
Evasion ? ROFL I DONT EVEN NEED WEAPON TO DEAL DMG ITS JUST A BONUS LOL :D
Dismantle ? C ABOVE LOL
Stun ? ROFL NP MY HP DOESNT MOVE ONE BIT :D

Hunters are no different, dropping from 100% to 40% in one TNT stun...

Seriously, although you cunts devastate me on my SP I can't fucking wait to see either DKs nerfed or you buffed, it doesn't fucking feel right that class with highest skill cap ingame can't do shit versus retarded DK who was 1600 in TBC and now spams icy touch and wins without any fucking effort.
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[13:49:14] Creed: u have 20min to find a healer, going for a jog
[13:49:53] Creed: nothing like running through the bush being chased by wild animals to get a proper workout
[13:50:01] Creed: you europeans and ur silly gyms


#2 Nez

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:13 PM

They're just better players, sorry. :)))))
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#3 Alvaress

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:15 PM

Well according to Wheyyaat we all jsut gotta l2p, druids have as hard as palas had in tbc right!?!?!?!?!?!!?!!??!!?!?
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#4

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:17 PM

confirm
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Believe it or not I'm a nice guy with a mild mannered personality. So no, i wouldn't "choke someone", even though my 6pack abs allow me to do that


#5 Zekt

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:25 PM

yep i promise myself to never break anything after my weekly 10 games, but srly how the fuck did blizz make a class that is absolutely invincible and not at least HOTFIX some stuff
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#6 Deviouss

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:26 PM

http://img509.images...dotomuchdmg.jpg
http://img509.images...dotomuchdmg.jpg
if the pic wont load ^.^
pic talks for itself
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#7 Pobzy

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:28 PM

Rogues are pretty much on spot atm, they should be way more viable after hunters get nerfed and DKs actually become a melee class.
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#8 Xandos

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:32 PM

Rogues are pretty much on spot atm, they should be way more viable after hunters get nerfed and DKs actually become a melee class.

one day
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lol i win about 80% of my games, and i only play after smoking a fresh bowl of some dank bud, it does not reduce your APM's


#9 Nez

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:33 PM

http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dksdotomuchdmg.jpg
http://img509.images...dotomuchdmg.jpg
if the pic wont load ^.^
pic talks for itself



He had to do around 2700 dps for that O.o
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#10 Xandos

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:35 PM

http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dksdotomuchdmg.jpg
http://img509.images...dotomuchdmg.jpg
if the pic wont load ^.^
pic talks for itself

...
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lol i win about 80% of my games, and i only play after smoking a fresh bowl of some dank bud, it does not reduce your APM's


#11 Zaci

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:40 PM

I myself dont have any idea how we manage...

We got too many fucking broken abilities...
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" Never argue with idiots, they pull you down their level and beat you with their experience "

#12 Kathor

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 05:43 PM

Rogues are pretty much on spot atm, they should be way more viable after hunters get nerfed and DKs actually become a melee class.


To the first part, I think they are very squishy for melee, bit more than they used to be but I also think that in the times of gigantic burst a class that with a partner almost kills mine before my sap breaks and then has cc to follow is at the verge of being op when buffed in terms of survivability...

But yeah I think when hunter representation drops rogues will shine more. And dks are a problem for everyone.
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#13 manifest

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:13 PM

more survivability and mobility is really all we need, nice post tho <3
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#14 Magdain

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:27 PM

Rogues are pretty much on spot atm, they should be way more viable after hunters get nerfed and DKs actually become a melee class.


This is pretty much a major copout that is no longer realistic. Damage-wise, rogues feel slightly too powerful against rogues, priests, and warlocks. Against EVERY OTHER CLASS (assuming most viable spec, not fucking shit enhance shamans and w/e) rogue damage is in the fucking gutter.

Even against shaman a 5cp 130e pool overkill isn't enough to kill them without peels. Would you argue shaman are in a position to warrant a nerf? I sure as hell wouldn't.

Fact is there's too much instant frontloaded healing in the game now, and there will be more next patch (self penance). The way rogues kill people is a horribly antiquated system from the remnants of bc when every single class healer on resto druid levels.

Rogue survivability and mobility is also low almost globally. Our survivability cannot be based around cooldowns that either flat out don't work (vanish), or cooldowns that are ineffective against 3/5 melee classes (evasion).

Ineffective survivability, ineffective killing system against 70% of the classes in the game, non-existent mobility isn't fine.
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#15 Zaci

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:32 PM

This is pretty much a major copout that is no longer realistic. Damage-wise, rogues feel slightly too powerful against rogues, priests, and warlocks. Against EVERY OTHER CLASS (assuming most viable spec, not fucking shit enhance shamans and w/e) rogue damage is in the fucking gutter.

Even against shaman a 5cp 130e pool overkill isn't enough to kill them without peels. Would you argue shaman are in a position to warrant a nerf? I sure as hell wouldn't.

Fact is there's too much instant frontloaded healing in the game now, and there will be more next patch (self penance). The way rogues kill people is a horribly antiquated system from the remnants of bc when every single class healer on resto druid levels.

Rogue survivability and mobility is also low almost globally. Our survivability cannot be based around cooldowns that either flat out don't work (vanish), or cooldowns that are ineffective against 3/5 melee classes (evasion).

Ineffective survivability, ineffective killing system against 70% of the classes in the game, non-existent mobility isn't fine.


QFT

Maggs ur my idol <3
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#16 Magdain

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:41 PM

QFT

Maggs ur my idol <3


I dislike you because you're a human rogue and I can't sap you. :(



btw, just an addendum to my post:

No, I don't think rogues are hopelessly broken at all. I still love playing my rogue (in pvp) and I don't really feel completely handicapped against any class. I also don't think our damage is truly "in the gutter," against any class.. That was just heat of the moment hyperbole.

For the sake of clarity:

-I believe rogue damage should be a little more normalized. We don't dent mail+ at all. We do a lot to casters. While this is inherently the point of armor, in wrath it's much more pronounced and excessive than it should be.

-I really like where rogues sustained damage is. If we have high uptime on a target we can pressure pretty well. But:

-Rogues damage is, largely, out of our control when we play it. We don't just press a button when we want to do damage and get good, reliable burst. In PvE ~60-70% of our damage comes entirely from auto attack (+ auto attack poison procs). In PvP this is around ~40% estimating. I'll try to see if I have some recount numbers from games today to be more accurate. 40% of our damage out being completely auto attack is DUMB and a large part of why it's a complete nightmare to land kills against some classes even when playing perfectly.

-Another big reason why it's out of our control is assassination has absolutely no cooldowns to increase damage over a medium length of time like almost every other class does. Rogues need a controllable burst ability, in both pvp and pve, even if it's at the cost of some sustained damage.


Many other people have explained what can be done to increase survivability and mobility, so I won't be a broken record and parrot it here. Other than that, like I said I don't think rogues are tremendously broken. A couple talent shifts and replacing the atrocity that is Hunger for Blood (a good place to add a cooldown) and we'd be in a much more reasonable place.
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#17 Tahaa

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:44 PM

Pretty much what Magdain said. Rogues are such a joke as a DK it's not even funny, you frost presence, go through ALL of their cooldowns with no trinket, and then proceed to 3 shot them.

Exaggerating but it's almost on point.
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#18 Magdain

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:50 PM

For accuracy. Here's a breakdown from a handful of games this morning. Sample size is 437,370 damage.. I recorded like 25 games, but I think it deleted some of the data because I did way more than 437k over 25 games. :P

Posted Image

~50% of my damage is from auto attack and poisons, abilities out of my control. My passive weapon enchant did nearly as much damage as my 41 point talent, and my only combo builder.
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#19 Rudeface

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:50 PM

This is pretty much a major copout that is no longer realistic. Damage-wise, rogues feel slightly too powerful against rogues, priests, and warlocks. Against EVERY OTHER CLASS (assuming most viable spec, not fucking shit enhance shamans and w/e) rogue damage is in the fucking gutter.


This. Armor type/class is in a very bad place right now, you have some traditional "physical" dps that bypasses it completely - and then you have rogues with poison on autoattack and pretty shitty bleeds.
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DKs make me lol. It's like a hobo winning the lotto, no one knew of him before he got rich and no one likes them.


#20 Vexo

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Posted 29 March 2009 - 06:52 PM

Posted Image


:D
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