Warrior WotLK Talent Builds
Posted 13 November 2008 - 05:27 AM
Thanks in advance for everyone who helps out.
Posted 13 November 2008 - 06:28 PM
how I see myself going for a standard arms spec at 80.
Possibly 2 points out of imp hamstring for imp slam, depending on how rage generation and GCD usage is at 80, since the glyph makes up for those 2 points. Imp execute is amazing, not only because it's extra dmg on your sudden deaths, but because if your sudden death proc takes your opponent under 20% hp, you can instantly execute a 2nd time, with the 10 spare rage from sudden death.
Imp rend because the way things are looking, rend's actually worth using on anything that you're not worried about CCing. It ticks for a ton. I'd pick up trauma too, but I'd rather keep what I have in imp hamstring. You could drop 1 from imp HS and Anger management (though I <3 AM, since you often sit at 9, 14, 29, etc, rage, trying to execute, SR, MS, etc, and you know it'll only be 1-2 seconds before you can get off the ability) to get imp trauma. Imp hamstring is basically a good talent, but if you value trauma and/or imp slam higher, that or AM are where the points come from. Personal taste. And, even with imp rend and/or trauma, taste for blood is a terrible PvP talent.
Odd talents and why:
2/2 unrelenting assault here because I go deep enough into prot to pick up imp revenge. With shield block active, you can spam revenge for over 1000 dmg per use, as well as a 50% chance to stun with each revenge, and it only has a 1 second global due to unrelenting assault, so you can theoretically use it 11 times in 10 seconds assuming you get hit at least once per second. Tons of dmg and a high stun proc rate, all while defensive (taking less dmg). Basically, potentially the new RNG mace stun, only with a much higher proc rate and on command (though only with melee on you). More survivability than arms/fury, and imp spell reflect+imp disarm for assisting your team and setting up burst (or just mitigating dmg more often) but no piercing howl and slightly less dmg.
Posted 13 November 2008 - 09:22 PM
Arms Warrior Talent Guide at Level 80
The standard Arms PvP Build for Wrath of the Lich King is going to be interesting and nothing will be set in stone for a while. There are variations, two different thought trains on what Warrior’s Damage and ability rotation will be like. One is the Standard Old School version where you stay the majority inside Beserker Stance, being able to Pummel, Whirlwind and Beserker Rage. Now that Beserker Rage isn’t in Beserker Stance anymore, there are new Arms talents that encourage Warriors to stay in Battle Stance.
These are the Two Talent Trees I have come up with, one for each different play style.
I haven't completely thought through how the new style would be in the tree, so I'll worry about that later.
This is just experimental builds and there can be variations if you prefer to use Slam, if you like bleeds, how often you would like to make overpower be effective. This is just the opening guide that we are going to use and people will change accordingly to fit their own personal needs. Anything that has a “Debatable” next to it indicates that people may get more or less of what is needed, but it’s still considered a good talent by most. "Needed" really means every warrior will use this talent for this type of build regardless what else might they change.
Old School 53/18/0 or 54/17/0. I used a 53/18/0 as my starting idea, but having the extra point in Arms looks more invested over the fury point.
0/3 Heroic Strike: This is only used as a rage dump and to apply pressure in certain situations, but it isn’t worth it to get.
5/5 Parry Chance: Debatable. Fighting against other melee/hunters comes up often and the extra parry chance helps your healer and helps you to attack quicker since the Parry reset swing timer change.
0/2 Improved Rend: Debatable. Only useable in Battle stance, and the majority of your time will be in beserker stance, even though they did buff this ability and talent to make try to make it worthwhile, it’s still not a proven effective talent to get over 5/5 Parry quite yet, but people are testing it out.
0/2 Improved Charge: You get enough rage with your charge ability and the other tier talents are much more needed.
3/3 Iron Will: Debatable. if you want 2/3 or 3/3. Reducing the time you get stunned is a nice bonus.
3/3 Tactical Mastery: Debatable 1/3 to 3/3. Swapping stances to Defensive or Battle to overpower/disarm/spell reflect. You will be changing your stance a lot and this helps you fight against it. Since Spell Reflect and disarm only costs 15 Rage, you can still do instants of these with just one point. I prefer having 3/3 since I enjoy swapping back to beserker stance to whirlwind right away sometimes, which is 25 Rage.
2/2 Improved Overpower: Debatable, but most pick up at least 1/2 to help against Rogues/Feral Druids. I prefer 2 to give the overpower a big chance to hurt.
1/1 Anger Management: I like it, sometimes you just need a bit more rage and this gives you it.
2/2 Impale: Needed. More Damage on crits which is what we are based around.
3/3 Deep Wounds: Debatable Most get 3/3 here. I know some warriors testing out 2/3 but I enjoy the dots now since its over 6 seconds and can stack the DoT up if you get multiple crits in a row while the debuff is still on your targets. Deep wounds rolling stacks like Ignite used to do, where the dot is refreshed on the Target and does more damage if it hasn’t worn off.
3/3 Two handed Specialization: Debatable. More Damage, you need it. People can skip a point though here and there.
0/3 Taste for Blood: Not going to be using rend that often, so this is not worthwhile.
1/1 Sweeping Strikes: Needed for MS. Must get it.
5/5 Axe or Mace or Sword Specialization: Whatever you pick is what works for you. Just be sure to only get one of the 3 though.
2/2 Improved Intercept: Needed. You will always be waiting for your intercept button to come back up to help with timing stuns, getting to targets away from you. Must have.
3/3 Improved Hamstring: Debatable. Hamstring Glyph helps increase this to 25% so some people try to use 1/3 or 2/3 since it was never an issue before. Some warriors ran with 10% before so even 0/3 works as long as you have the Glyph. But this talent does help you most of the time to keep your targets still.
0/3 Trauma: Debatable. Helps your bleeds. You won’t be using rend and Deep Wounds won’t always be up. So the effectiveness of this talent isn’t there, but it doesn’t mean it isn’t useful
2/2 Second Wind: Needed. You will be crowd controlled and contained while doing BGs and arena and this really helps counter the fact that you are in beserker stance all the time taking 10% more damage.
1/1 Mortal Strike: Needed.
2/2 Strength of Arms: Debatable. I enjoy the extra expertise and Stren+Stam increase. It’s all stuff you need.
0/2 Improved Slam: Debatable. I never been a huge fan of Improved Slam, but people do enjoy it and I am open to this in Wrath since it doesn’t share the swing timer attacks. You still have to sit still for .5 seconds though and you are really always on the move as a warrior.
3/3 Improved Mortal Strike: Debatable. It’s more damage and ensures that Mortal Strike effects stay on your target will a second less cooldown. But you can get other talents to improve your damage with your own play style.
1/2 Unrelenting Assault: Debatable. I like having this at 1 so far, but if you do get 2/2, your GCDs do get reset to 1 second instead of 1.5 so you can use overpower every second, provided that your attack does dodge the next time used. Only really effective against targets that dodge a lot.
3/3 Sudden Death: Needed. RNG Wins games, this gives you another RNG to win.
1/1 Endless Rage: Useless before Wrath because it required so many talent points, but now you should get it to ensure you always have enough rage.
2/2 Blood Frenzy: Debatable, but I prefer to have it. 2% Damage on your target, plus reducing your Swing Timer gives you a huge damage increase.
5/5 Wrecking Crew. Needed. You need an Enrage to give you more damage and to use the new regen ability.
1/1 Bladestorm: Needed. Learn to use it, get used to all its abilities to help you move and do tons of damage.
3/3 Armored to the Teeth. Lots more AP for you to use, get it.
2/2 Booming Voice. Lets you keep up Battle Shout up longer, and increases the Range of your Demoralizing Shout for those nasty steathers.
5/5 Cruelty: Needed. More Crit, More damage.
0/5 Improved Demoralizing Shout. It was nice to have before to help debuff other melee on you and your teammates, but you are there to do damage.
0/5 Unbridled Wrath: You have endless rage from Arms, this is not needed.
0/3 Improved Cleave: Never seen another warrior take this, or really ever use cleave in arena ever.
1/1 Piercing Howl: Needed. You will get out of range from people to hamstring and this will get them slowed when you can’t reach them. Plus helps out in other areas.
0/3 Blood Craze: Debatable. It helps out your healers and gives you more survivability. If you can trust your healers, then it loses it’s effectiveness, but it does help you out.
4/5 Commanding Presence: Debatable It’s more attack power/HP for you and your teammates.
0/5 Duel Wield Specialization: You aren’t duel wielding.
2/2 Improved Execute. More Executes and more damage when used.
0/5 Enrage: You got Wrecking Crew, don’t need it.
Thank you for reading and if you spot any errors or don't agree with me, feel free to PM me since we should keep this thread clean for more Spec ideas instead of debating about what is better.
Posted 14 November 2008 - 02:37 PM
My reasoning is that in arms you have all the major offensive talents and defensive talents, and the points are all well placed, you get the most bang for your buck. For instance 1/2 in unrelenting assault doesn't make a huge difference versus 2/2 so that frees up a talent point. The arms tree is perfect imo, then in Fury we have the most important talents in piercing howl and in my opinion imp execute. Sudden death is absolutely amazing and with the execute glyph + sudden death + this talent, execute will be even better. 3/3 Blood Craze instead of 4/5 commanding presence because blood craze was buffed from 3% to 6% health reneged which is very significant, especially in smaller brackets and at a time when damage is largely out of control.
For PvP I don't think its possible to have a more well rounded spec then this and I honestly see this being cookie cutter at some point in the future as more people realize how good imp execute + blood craze + 1/2 UR will be. Overall not much of a difference between most specs but a few extra talent points invested here and there aren't bad.
Posted 14 November 2008 - 08:14 PM
Posted 14 November 2008 - 09:19 PM
It sucks ass for overpower in pvp.
Posted 14 November 2008 - 10:07 PM
2/2 ua is a must, just for that I think.
Posted 14 November 2008 - 10:21 PM
I forgot that blizzard changed shield block to be a 100% chance 10sec buff though so that changes my opinion on its usefulness considering that you can still pump out significant damage when you go defensive just for 1 extra talent point.
In that case if its really that good, just transfer 1 point from imp MS to 2/2 UA.
Posted 14 November 2008 - 10:35 PM
could be wrong
Posted 14 November 2008 - 10:43 PM
On a side note, what's so great about Imp. Execute? It doesn't increase damage, and the only time I see it being even remotely useful is for chaining Sudden Death procs (and even then, MS/Hamstring would probably be a better use of global)
Posted 15 November 2008 - 12:12 AM
Posted 15 November 2008 - 07:20 AM
Posted 15 November 2008 - 08:30 AM
Also Sudden Death + Execute talent + glyph is some serious execute pwnage.
Posted 16 November 2008 - 07:20 PM
Posted 17 November 2008 - 08:31 PM
Side note: Lol S4 glad? Wth.
Posted 18 November 2008 - 06:14 PM
Posted 24 November 2008 - 06:57 PM
Dots, rng overpowers, rng string, rng suddendeath executes and facerollstorm.
Sounds like a supah cool spec to play.
Posted 25 November 2008 - 07:28 PM
The more I look at the arms tree the more I seriously hope I'm going to be able to avoid playing it.
Dots, rng overpowers, rng string, rng suddendeath executes and facerollstorm.
Sounds like a supah cool spec to play.
I'll be fury because of that. >_>
Heroic fury is amazing, the burst from recklesness + bloodthirst/slam/whirlwind is incredible, and whirlwind hits like a truck. Oh, and 2h + shield is pretty amazing considering how good revenge/OP are now. 2h+shield might be the way to go against most melee teams in the lower brackets.
However, the MS is a bit unreliable in how quickly it stacks, you need more hit which hateful glad won't have, and having your intercept cooldown be 25 seconds once heroic fury down is gay as hell.
Actually, you might want to take a look at prot (since you haven't played in so long not sure you know how much it got buffed lol) HUGE damage, charges in combat, shockwave stun, intercept stun, group spell reflect, extra damage on disarms, etc. Maybe that would be more your style, being able to spell reflect and intervene when you see a shatter combo coming on your healer.
Prot warriors will be amazing for 5v5... charge -> intercept -> concussive blow -> shockwave -> fear -> imp shield bash -> intercept -> imp disarm so they take more damage... rinse, repeat, you get the point. Prot warriors have a stupid amount of control, silences, and stuns, and are able to protect their whole team (30% reduced damage for however many seconds on intervene, group SR) while still maintaining pretty good damage and stupid survivability.
Posted 25 November 2008 - 08:48 PM
A deep prot build is something I've considered but intercept and especially charge putting conc blow and shockwave on dr is retarded. I think it would make it rather ineffective in smaller brackets. But just swapping targets and stunning different people all the time might make it good in 5s.
I'm probably going to mess around with different builds while leveling.
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