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MW PoV: Got Into Alpha.


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#1 TurboKill

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 03:34 PM

I will be trying to answer questions in an orderly fashion as I get time to play the alpha. Ill also be posting my opinions in this thread. For the WW and Rando BM's Ill try my best to test that stuff or answer, no guarantee. never been very good at dps.

XP wise I've played mw around 2500+ every season except this season, On one of my three monks.
Before that I played Rshaman at 2500+ since s6.

Ill try to do my best senpai.
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#2 TurboKill

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 03:40 PM

If any other MW's got in Please add to the discussion, I feel like our forum itself is pretty dead compared to most classes. Also There is not many of us in general.
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#3

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 10:35 PM

How did u get alpha? WTB alpha 10 dollars each hour
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Shit game is shit :) btw Butthex, ur still a nobody, thx for reminding me to fix my shit sign

#4 TurboKill

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 10:56 PM

How did u get alpha? WTB alpha 10 dollars each hour


Eh not sure to be honest.
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#5 TurboKill

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 11:04 PM

So got a little bit of time in today took a while to set up the bars and frames.

Frames: So now you can just right click your Player and target frame, unlock them and move them. I havnt figured out how to move the Party frames yet which is killing me they are tiny and I havnt played with them in the standard spot since like '09.

First experience with Skrim 3's, Demon hunters are like the tankiest thing ive seen in years that still just blow people up.
Healing wise Its hard to say right now I dont have access to but one of the pvp talents and I feel our best talents come around the honor level 35+ I only got to level 3 today.

Stuff I noticed, You cannot have mistwalk AND transcendence, if you talent mistwalk it removes Trans. Nimble Is gone, or They havnt implemented it, I could be wrong but I seen a few other MWs that didnt know where it is either. Spear handstrike is gone. I rolled into stop a few polys out of reflex thinking I had it :0. Healing potency: I think healing is kinda undertuned and dps self survival is really high for some classes. I was getting hit with average 116k howling blast and The most I was crit healing was like 80ks but take this with a grain of salt, I havnt figured out the new healing method since I do not have access to the pvp talent allowing me to channel SM to instant cast other heals. So It was a rough first experience, kinda like our first few days after they released The WoD heal changes. So im sure most of my issue is me just being retarded and not using stuff correctly yet.
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#6 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 11:07 PM

So now you can just right click your Player and target frame, unlock them and move them

you can do this on live currently x)

I havnt figured out how to move the Party frames yet which is killing me they are tiny and I havnt played with them in the standard spot since like '09

this requires a macro, search for the gigantic UI thread on this site by Thaya, has everything in it that you need

Nimble Is gone, or They havnt implemented it, I could be wrong but I seen a few other MWs that didnt know where it is either. Spear handstrike is gone

Nimble Brew and Spear Hand Strike both did not fit the mistweaver monk CLASS FANTASY unfortunately :)

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 22 March 2016 - 11:13 PM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#7 TurboKill

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Posted 22 March 2016 - 11:41 PM

you can do this on live currently x)


this requires a macro, search for the gigantic UI thread on this site by Thaya, has everything in it that you need


Nimble Brew and Spear Hand Strike both did not fit the mistweaver monk CLASS FANTASY unfortunately :)


Ahh, My mistake on the Macro I asked about it in trade some goober told me they didnt work. Ill look into it.

Class fantasy My ass :0 Guess its more cap'ing to stop ccs >_>.
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#8 Rorechec

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Posted 23 March 2016 - 01:41 AM

have few
1)what happens when you para some1 with dots on him since we dont have glyphs anymore or they add that to the spell?

2)can you use cocoon in stuns /dont have that glyph too/ will be really weird without nimble and cocoon with only 1 trinket cuz we usually take tons of dmg in stun compared to the other healers. Also no more fort. brew?

3)if you choose rising thunder pve talent and the old aura mastery from the pvp tree will you just spam rising sun kicks-->reset aura mastery cd--->free aura the whole game anytime something gets close to you so u can hit it? :o

4)can u mistwalk on your statue? for some clutch stuns
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#9 TurboKill

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Posted 23 March 2016 - 02:42 AM

have few
1)what happens when you para some1 with dots on him since we dont have glyphs anymore or they add that to the spell?

2)can you use cocoon in stuns /dont have that glyph too/ will be really weird without nimble and cocoon with only 1 trinket cuz we usually take tons of dmg in stun compared to the other healers. Also no more fort. brew?

3)if you choose rising thunder pve talent and the old aura mastery from the pvp tree will you just spam rising sun kicks-->reset aura mastery cd--->free aura the whole game anytime something gets close to you so u can hit it? :o

4)can u mistwalk on your statue? for some clutch stuns



1) will edit in answer later.

2) I could not Cocoon during kidney :|, No more fort brew.

3) yes auto reset after RSK with talent. pretty badass.. I tested it on chickens.

4) Yes you can Mistwalk your statue, but again lose your trans.

Also neat thing, you statue just forever soothing mist now after a heal, only like 5k ticks but it just dont stop, Shuilens gift with 4 clouds healed me for 160K+.

Dueled a couple of rogues, not sure how good they actually were dps wise (the whole relearning stuff) But I was able to sustain heal through almost all their dmg with just hots and SM from statue and Myself. Effuses everyonce in a while, EvM during their cds.

Fistweaving, well I guess just dpsing now, is actually pretty good blackout kick is a good 80k-110k RSKs crit for like 100k and Tiger palm does about 20-35k So You can put up like 300k dmg really fast. JL says its supposed to do like 327k in 3.something seconds but I was only getting 20-30k ticks on players. So its not MoP JL sith lord dmg but its decent for a free range dps spell.
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#10 Frosteye

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 06:03 AM

Got into Beta -- I'm a bit worried for Mistweavers, the whole spec feels rather clunky and out of place... Maybe things will change at 110.

I was shocked to see that mistweavers no longer use Chi -- kinda sad about this, it was a fun resource to manage.
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#11 Creptius

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 07:48 PM

the whole spec feels rather clunky and out of place... Maybe things will change at 110.


It takes a little bit to get used to. I haven't leveled as MW, but I played on the PvP realm and enjoyed it. It's a lot different from live, but I like the direction they took the spec. If it wasn't for damage being so high it would actually be more enjoyable to heal than on live. The only thing I really wish they'd bring back is SHS. It just feels wrong having my interrupt key be empty on my monk, but I understand why they removed it.

Auto cast soothing mist seemed like garbage at first and I really hated it on paper, but when I started playing with it and realized being locked out on soothing mist was a different tree, it felt a lot better. Now MWs have strong hots, hot protection, more healing when dots are up, dot removal, a strong defensive that has to be used preemptively, consistent interrupt immunity, decent damage (cjl does damage again, no stance changing for RSK), mobility and control. They're in a good spot right now and are one of the only specs I've enjoyed playing on the alpha.

Almost every change to the spec has been positive or a quality of life change. I'd like mana tea to come back as it added some complexity to MW mana mangement, but it won't kill me to see it gone. I can live without them having chi because it was only spent on EM anyway. I can live without nimble if they tone down stuns. I think If they gave shs back they'd be perfect.

Edited by Creptius, 13 May 2016 - 07:48 PM.

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#12 Frosteye

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Posted 13 May 2016 - 08:20 PM

With glyphs gone what do we have for stuns? Just trinket right?

Getting caught in a 6second stun is going to be brutal.



Once the PVP Realm is up (it may be up already, but i am at work), I will test MW out and report back.

Edited by Frosteye, 13 May 2016 - 08:21 PM.

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#13 Frosteye

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Posted 14 May 2016 - 01:14 AM

Some of the feedback I posted on our class thread in the Legion Forums:
http://us.battle.net...65186?page=3#41


Mistweaver PVP Feedback:

Criticism:
1) Healing output is very low compared to the amount of damage people are taking in PVP -- Because of this I run OOM very quickly and people are still dying -- even when I am spam healing them.

2) We have one way to get out of stuns with our PVP Trinket (or Dampen Harm to help mitigate some damage) -- we are easily killed in a single stun. It would be nice if we could have Dematerialize back from MOP, would really fit this Meta.

3) It doesn't feel like there is much to do outside of healing. I can RSK/BoK/CJL for some damage, or Paralyze > Leg Sweep someone for CC -- There is no more Spear Hand Strike to pull off a Roll/Teleport + Kick. Also no Touch of Death to help finish off a Target. I seriously feel like I am a glorified healing dispenser and bring zero utility.

4) Life Cocoon heals like a wet noodle -- also cannot cast it while stunned which diminishes its usefulness in PVP.

5) Soothing Mist (ancient mistweaver artS) should work on Vivify so we can use procs easier.

6) Loss of Chi as a resource -- makes healing/gameplay dull and boring.

7) Some of the little things that added flavor to abilities is gone. No more armor pen from Tiger Palm. No crit buff from Blackout Kick, etc. All of our abilities are generic and uninteresting. Difference between RSK and BoK ? Absolutely nothing.

As for the good things:

1) Healing brew being an active ability is a welcome change, especially since tea/brew is gone.

2) No stance requirements makes switching between Healing vs DPS a lot easier, our damage output is decent and we can dish out damage while healing a lot more effectively.

3) Crackling Jade Lightning actually does decent damage again, could still be increased a little bit though.

Conclusion:
Overall Mistweavers feel very generic and bland -- mostly in part to having so many of our abilities removed. Even with Ancient Mistweaver Arts, healing still feels very clunky and slow in contrast to the fast and fluid gameplay that we have on WOD right now.

I would like to see several improvements, and at the very least, have Spear Hand Strike (kick) returned.
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#14 sarma

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Posted 14 May 2016 - 04:00 AM

2) We have one way to get out of stuns with our PVP Trinket (or Dampen Harm to help mitigate some damage) -- we are easily killed in a single stun. It would be nice if we could have Dematerialize back from MOP, would really fit this Meta.



Because of 3 rolls and port only way you can kill a monk is in stun

So lets try it by stunning monk on CD on DR

1) stun > nimble - port , roll roll = safe

2) stun > coocoon - port roll roll = safe

3) stun > trinket - port roll roll = safe

4) stun > if nimble is not offcd ask your warrior friend to press vigilance and port + roll roll = safe


Rinse and repeat untill dampenging SUCH AMAZING PLAYS !
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#15 Frosteye

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Posted 14 May 2016 - 05:16 PM

Because of 3 rolls and port only way you can kill a monk is in stun

So lets try it by stunning monk on CD on DR

1) stun > nimble - port , roll roll = safe

2) stun > coocoon - port roll roll = safe

3) stun > trinket - port roll roll = safe

4) stun > if nimble is not offcd ask your warrior friend to press vigilance and port + roll roll = safe


Rinse and repeat untill dampenging SUCH AMAZING PLAYS !


Well we have the lowest mitigation of any healer, which is part of why we are so mobile. Once you DO lock us down, we take crippling amounts of damage.

If we didn't have the outs we currently do, comps like Feral/DK would kill us in the opener with zero effort. There needs to be some kind of balance.

Right now on BETA dmg is retarded, and the only way out of a stun is with our PVP Trinket (or if you have the Human Racial that removes stuns -- i see what you did there Blizzard).
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#16 zenton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 12:12 AM

Because of 3 rolls and port only way you can kill a monk is in stun

So lets try it by stunning monk on CD on DR

1) stun > nimble - port , roll roll = safe

2) stun > coocoon - port roll roll = safe

3) stun > trinket - port roll roll = safe

4) stun > if nimble is not offcd ask your warrior friend to press vigilance and port + roll roll = safe


Rinse and repeat untill dampenging SUCH AMAZING PLAYS !


Try to tell me you have a hard time to kill a MW as melee.

On topic, any news now that we are into our good beta?

I'm interested in some things:

- How's anchient MW healing? (aka the old channeling)
- How's healing flowing? One of the fun factor of MW was the very unique playstyle (see above), but with channel+instant and chi mechanics removed won't it be just like another healbot?
- How is our mobility/utility?
- And last, but not least, how's heal/dmg not just for the spec but in general compared to dmg? Still zero heal with normal rota 1-100 with cds?
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#17 Frosteye

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Posted 02 June 2016 - 06:35 PM

Try to tell me you have a hard time to kill a MW as melee.

On topic, any news now that we are into our good beta?

I'm interested in some things:

- How's anchient MW healing? (aka the old channeling)
- How's healing flowing? One of the fun factor of MW was the very unique playstyle (see above), but with channel+instant and chi mechanics removed won't it be just like another healbot?
- How is our mobility/utility?
- And last, but not least, how's heal/dmg not just for the spec but in general compared to dmg? Still zero heal with normal rota 1-100 with cds?


- AMW healing is decent with Enveloping Mists ... Effuse is a crappy weak heal and does not compare to surging mists in any way. It's "okay-ish" with Thunder focus tea, but that's about it. If you need to burst heal someone, you need to Cocoon them end of story (and you can't while stunned anymore)

- Heal flow feels clunky ... Vivify cannot be cast during soothing mist (amw) , so to use your procs you need to hardcast. Can't see it being super viable in Arena. Without Chi you can basically spam enveloping mists, and in most high damage PVP situations this is what you will be doing: Soothe > EM , rinse/repeat/throw in a few effuses for extra healing. Without the chi buildup for EM it feels too easy, and it is rather boring.

- Mobility is still good, but we lost Nimble Brew, and can no longer cocoon while stunned, which means we are easily locked down in stuns now despite our mobility. Basically if you're alliance you should immediately race change Human for the stun break.

- Utility is lacking with the removal of Touch of Death and Spear Hand Strike -- we feel like Heal bots, there isn't much to do in between healing except sap/leg sweep or Fistweaving.



One welcome change is that Stances are gone and you can fistweave and heal at the same time. The only thing that I don't like is the lack of Chi Resource, there is no decision making between using Chi to fistweave and do damage, or heal -- it feels bland and boring.
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#18 RyCP1209

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 04:53 PM

Awesome questions, feedback and replies.

FrostChi and TurboKill, thanks for setting this thread up to allow others to at least get a glimpse into MW Monks in Legion.


I've been in Alpha/Beta Since January-ish, although I haven't logged in to play in about a month or so.
(I get tired of setting up bars and keybinds on the regular with patches.) So far everything that you have brought up to report, is truth with what I've played.

My biggest concerns going forward.

-Lack of Utility (feeling useful outside of healing)
Yes, it was 1 spell that really impacts This feeling in me. Spear Hand Strike and then we also have Touch of Death, which we couldn't even use in PvP before now), both were removed from our toolkit.

-Lack of Control over CC
The CC in game, I feel is still far too much to attempt any balancing, at least at this level of ridiculous dmg in Beta). The trinkets that you do get to pick from, to be don't feel super appealing (Playing a Pandaren Monk). I feel too many classes, have too many Stuns that they can use too often. They said they were revisiting CC, to not surround the entire PvP Play style around it, and all I've experienced is that with MW Monks, they just threw their hands up and signed a death warrant removing/changing abilities.

-Mobility
Our mobility, doesn't outweigh the ways to counter said ability. Don't get me wrong, we're mobile, but our heals aren't strong enough to effectivly hide and Pillar hump. Unless we have CD's (Cocoon), or that's how I feel. If not, we either face death ourselves without escape or team members get locked down/murdered. I honestly don't feel as mobile as I use to feel. Perhaps if we didn't have to choose between Tran and Mist Walk this could alleviate some of those anxious feelings. Doubt this will ever happen though.

-Overall Play and Feeling
I really am sad when I log into to Beta and attempt to play. They lack that "POP" they had, some of which they lost in WoD. The rest now I feel is gone. Welcome to a less interesting Priest v2.0.
The healing itself is quite underwhelming as a whole. As Frostchi stated, you can spam your largest heals and you cannot keep people up against certain comps. You also can devastate with certain comps (in my exp. double DK, Fr/Unh). The class no longer "Feels fun" or "seems interesting", to me.


Now keep in mind, this is Beta and won't go live for months yet. But time is winding down, and I personally feel if these current changes make it to live, they have ruined and destroyed my favorite class in this game. And that's a super shitty feeling, really makes you not want to login and play the game.

I am a 1 class kind of person, due to IRL and time restraints, I don't have the luxury of maining more than 1 class and playing it well. this isn't the case to most of you. In my heart I still love monks, it feels like a bad dream playing Beta. I just want to Wake up!
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