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Resto Shaman survivability

holinki wwdk rsham wodpvp stun

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#1 Atosy

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 03:52 PM

Hey guys. Simple question, can we just start spamlinking Holinki + other retard skilled devs this video on twitter? Maybe they will realise they fucked up horribly (again), and do smth about it.



Shoutout for Absterge for this video. :D
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#2 Mikefraud

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 05:52 PM

Just WW DK being retarded
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#3 Jim_Jim

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 05:55 PM

You realize that this kind of video could have been done for every single xpac, for every class (minus fmages, and rdruids in a way) in every situation. (By the way, rsham died exactly like that during MoP against the same comps, but it was not that visible considering rsham was the top healer and wwdkhpal and turbo wasn't that good - didn't even exists in Cata -. Those compo was viable because rsham/lock was the most popular duo, but not viable because the other duo was... rdruid/mages, which counters every single double melee in MoP)
From the disc being raped by a shadowmourne tsg which doesn't kick, stun or anything, a hpal dying during a shadowfury on ring of valor, enhancement shaman dying to triple dps or jungle in Cata, every healer had a comp which destroy them for no reasons. (My plate armor is an illusion since the end of TBC, and my defensive CD are all dispellable and useless if you don't play with classes which can cover them - wait for Legion, we will have 0 trashs buffs -).

What would be your solution to "nerf" those comp without destroying them, without making them replacable like they were for years? (I target ww, dk, hpal especially - hpal is a trash spec since they decided to give every healer bigger heals than us and magic dispel - we are just viable because of retarted comp like mage/hpal/x or ww/dk). What will be the consequence if you nerf dk's damage or self-healing? They will have the same damage as warrior, less than a enhancement, without anything for the team. Because DKs are just for that : damage. Damage that an enhancement shaman can have, with the spamable purge, healing, and all utility.

DK's class have been destroyed since years, just because of the constant whining of people. Before, they were the "annoying" dps, which can cleave people with powerful disease - now a fire shock deal as much -, could slow people with desecration, while protecting their mates with AMZ, and unholy frenzy (Yes, it was good against mages, that's maybe why they nerfed it.).

Of course they need a nerf. A good nerf, but how can you nerf a class which only bring damage without making them useless, or without adding them some utilities? And facing LSD, RMD/P, or shatter all the time will be exactly the same pain. Oh, not for rsham of course. (I don't mind facing warlocks, it's kind of challenging). I actually vomit disc priest and their instant and powerful healing + passive wall.

Frost dk, and hpal rely on retarded mechanics to be viable, like MW during MoP (Orbs). Touch them, and you can make those classes either OP, or useless. Look at how the 6.1 patch (Execution Sentence and 4-part) for hpal turn them from the worst healer into the best.
I do think WW monks are balanced on their own. (So balanced that they fit in one unique comp.)

Buff Unholy DK. (But as again, Unholy have no real utility besides damage, so the consequence will be exactly the same.)


Edited by Jim_Jim, 10 January 2016 - 06:08 PM.

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#4 Velcaa

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 06:44 PM

its not a proper ww/dk thread if there isnt a jimjim post
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#5 Nicholaes92

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 06:51 PM

This stuff has always been in the game. Beast cleave use to do this shit to everyone


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AJ's Wall of Tough Guys

i'm not your average aj user bro you're gonna have to up you game little boy.

Also tread lightly my friend, you dont know who you are talking to ;)

who the fuck do u think you are, random fucking nobody, u dont deserve any of my time/effort retard. "tell me that a blizzcon" srsly? great fucking insult m9. dont even talk to me


#6 Jim_Jim

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 07:01 PM

its not a proper ww/dk thread if there isnt a jimjim post


Hey i'm the Jaime of this comp. Equally retarded, but less biaised, and less fotm.

Edited by Jim_Jim, 10 January 2016 - 07:01 PM.

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#7 Maxish

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 07:16 PM

nice video absterge thanks for showing how very susceptible you are to dying in stuns in this particular expansion

why is the game bad because a shaman dies in stuns? using that logic, every expansion is bad since this has always been the case. other than the comp - what's WoD got to do with it?

of course shamans have it hard versus windwalker dk, just as windwalker dk struggles with mage/hpal comps - sucks to be a blue in that matchup - but thats just how the game works

and half of these kills happen when he still has stuff left to use - pointless to show
and some aren't even in stuns - wtf man i was expecting stuns
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#8 Fedx

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 07:27 PM

i was gonna write a post to trigger jaime but jimjim already did the job
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#9 Blizo

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 07:43 PM

Hey i'm the Jaime of this comp. Equally retarded, but less biaised, and less fotm.


how can u say ur less biased when in that video we can see shaman dying every game in less than 2 mins, u as wwdkpala can atleast survive vs other comps for more than 2 mins. As any rshaman comp u have like 0% to win wwdk, they only lose if they go afk. And I also like how can wwdk split and kill targets in 2 mins anyway.
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#10 Blizo

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 07:48 PM

nice video absterge thanks for showing how very susceptible you are to dying in stuns in this particular expansion

why is the game bad because a shaman dies in stuns? using that logic, every expansion is bad since this has always been the case. other than the comp - what's WoD got to do with it?

of course shamans have it hard versus windwalker dk, just as windwalker dk struggles with mage/hpal comps - sucks to be a blue in that matchup - but thats just how the game works

and half of these kills happen when he still has stuff left to use - pointless to show
and some aren't even in stuns - wtf man i was expecting stuns

u shouldnt talk about dying without using cds, u was actually the worst paladin i ever met last season, boping charge stun and dying without using buble. if rshaman trinkets opener he is dead next go cus he has no NG proc but i guess u dont know it.
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#11 Maxish

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:02 PM

u shouldnt talk about dying without using cds, u was actually the worst paladin i ever met last season, boping charge stun and dying without using buble. if rshaman trinkets opener he is dead next go cus he has no NG proc but i guess u dont know it.


ill gladly admit to being bad if that makes you feel better, does not matter to me in the same way it apparently does every other player

and no, he isnt dead per se, playing ww dk ive had seen quite a few shamans live for a while even if they trinket the first go with proper help from his teammates but if he sits everything and uses nothing, he's dead for sure
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#12 jaimee

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:05 PM

BABA GOING HAM POGCHAMP
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if you play a disc priest you are not a real human being 


#13 Blizo

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:05 PM

ill gladly admit to being bad if that makes you feel better, does not matter to me in the same way it apparently does every other player

and no, he isnt dead per se, playing ww dk ive had seen quite a few shamans live for a while even if they trinket the first go with proper help from his teammates but if he sits everything and uses nothing, he's dead for sure

then the wwdkpala fcked up if they dont kill shaman without link and ng next stun :) i would like to know what peels u can get from lock and warrior next go :)
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#14 Jim_Jim

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:21 PM

how can u say ur less biased when in that video we can see shaman dying every game in less than 2 mins, u as wwdkpala can atleast survive vs other comps for more than 2 mins. As any rshaman comp u have like 0% to win wwdk, they only lose if they go afk. And I also like how can wwdk split and kill targets in 2 mins anyway.


I'm less biaised because i played, i play, and i will play this comp unless my mates decide to stop. I always said that this comp is retarded (Less from the hpal PoV compared to any wizardcleaves, but it's an other subject - FMP or shatter is beyond stupid as a hpal -), and making fun of it.

I don't see the point of your pourcentage, wwdk has 0% chance to win against shatter too (Even the rdruid version is easier), WoW has always been comp vs comp, it's not because rsham are not the best healer anymore that it's more retarded. It's like rdruids in Wotlk, complaining that they lost their throne because of shadowfrost spec DK (Everyone was being fucked by DK back then), and it was the end of the world. They reclaim it shortly after by the way. (And the downfall of the DK class began at that moment).

What's your opinion about this video? Is that normal?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3J-dGwW2V0

Comp vs comp.

During Wotlk, it was impossible to lose against a TSG as ele/destro/hpal. (Unless you had a huge difference in your PvE gear)
During Cataclysm, dk/enhancement/hpal raped all the RLS without doing anything (I never lose against RLS as this comp, try to cast something as lock with a 5-s kick enhancement and a DK with Desecration on your face), and was being destroyed by any triple dps, jungle. (Enhancement back then wasn't as resilient as now)
During MoP, my ww/dk destroyed every single KFC or rsham variant, and any mage/druid just laugh at us.

Hey, maybe in Legion, rsham will become the total counter of wwdk, and wwdk will rape any mage team, we'll see. But for now, it's impossible to change DK without making them useless. (Because they only bring damage)

Edited by Jim_Jim, 10 January 2016 - 08:26 PM.

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#15 jaimee

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:39 PM

I'm less biaised because i played, i play, and i will play this comp unless my mates decide to stop. I always said that this comp is retarded (Less from the hpal PoV compared to any wizardcleaves, but it's an other subject - FMP or shatter is beyond stupid as a hpal -), and making fun of it.

I don't see the point of your pourcentage, wwdk has 0% chance to win against shatter too (Even the rdruid version is easier), WoW has always been comp vs comp, it's not because rsham are not the best healer anymore that it's more retarded. It's like rdruids in Wotlk, complaining that they lost their throne because of shadowfrost spec DK (Everyone was being fucked by DK back then), and it was the end of the world. They reclaim it shortly after by the way. (And the downfall of the DK class began at that moment).

What's your opinion about this video? Is that normal?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3J-dGwW2V0

Comp vs comp.

During Wotlk, it was impossible to lose against a TSG as ele/destro/hpal. (Unless you had a huge difference in your PvE gear)
During Cataclysm, dk/enhancement/hpal raped all the RLS without doing anything (I never lose against RLS as this comp, try to cast something as lock with a 5-s kick enhancement and a DK with Desecration on your face), and was being destroyed by any triple dps, jungle. (Enhancement back then wasn't as resilient as now)
During MoP, my ww/dk destroyed every single KFC or rsham variant, and any mage/druid just laugh at us.

Hey, maybe in Legion, rsham will become the total counter of wwdk, and wwdk will rape any mage team, we'll see. But for now, it's impossible to change DK without making them useless. (Because they only bring damage)


u rly dont realise that if you weren't so dogshit you would win shatter? AMS Horrify, hoj, whatever, line, stop cc, its not fucking difficult -you just expect to win by rolling in and killing in 3rd legsweep like you do vs everything else, stfu
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if you play a disc priest you are not a real human being 


#16 Velcaa

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:43 PM

i dont think its the damage that is most people's issue as much as how retarded the cc is paired with the damage and how short of a break there is inbetween each burst session and how unavoidable it pretty much feels

ya 90% of the video is him dieing when he had shit up still but even if you do rotate cds, its pretty unavoidable shit

with shatter you at least have a chance of outplaying them and interrupting their cc chain and interrupting their burst

with rmx the same thing

with ww/dk its literally bopping both of them so they cant be slowed into leg sweep into fof into strangulate into the pseudo interrupts

i was under the impression with wod they were taking out a lot of the blanket silences and here we still have disc priest silence, a dk silence that is on a short cd because they somehow thought it was a good idea of saying "hey if u overlap stuns enough we will take ur stun spell and turn it into a 50 hour silence" and u can repeat this every 30-45 seconds

both of them can have their damage, could care less, the issue comes in when theyre actually REWARDED for overlapping all their shit with no skill involved and being able to keep overlapping every 45 seconds forcing big cooldowns each time compared to their small ones
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#17 Maxish

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 08:54 PM

then the wwdkpala fcked up if they dont kill shaman without link and ng next stun :) i would like to know what peels u can get from lock and warrior next go :)


vigi? rally? stopping fist? sfury? fears? i don't know why you would ask specifically about a warrior and a warlock, but it's definitely possible for the shaman to live the second go after trinketing the first even though he arguably shouldn't - but not if he just dies the first go w/o using his cooldowns
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#18 Jim_Jim

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 09:00 PM

u rly dont realise that if you weren't so dogshit you would win shatter? AMS Horrify, hoj, whatever, line, stop cc, its not fucking difficult -you just expect to win by rolling in and killing in 3rd legsweep like you do vs everything else, stfu


I don't like arguing with you, because i'm clearly above you (Both physically, and intellectualy), i never criticize your "skill" or whatever gives you a boner in game, in fact, i think you are one of the best shaman at the moment. But outside of that, i would gladly reproduce the scene of "The Pianist" with the handicaped guy in the appartment (You in the wheelchair, that seems logical) with you.
Of course we can win shatter, like a turbo can win a wwdk, etc... everyone can win everyone, depending of the mistakes of the others, but some match-ups are clearly at the avantage of a team, like wwdk vs rsham, or shatter vs wwdk. (Try to use hoj and horrify on the monk at the same time).

Do you understand what i read? Or do you need a drawing? Or will you call your friends, or insulting me as a "moron"?

(Edit : If i have the Beta of Legion, i can tell you what class is OP btw)

Edited by Jim_Jim, 10 January 2016 - 09:05 PM.

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#19 Zaephyr

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 09:03 PM

u shouldnt talk about dying without using cds, u was actually the worst paladin i ever met last season, boping charge stun and dying without using buble. if rshaman trinkets opener he is dead next go cus he has no NG proc but i guess u dont know it.


man

you can just tell you're English.
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#20 Maxish

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Posted 10 January 2016 - 09:04 PM

u rly dont realise that if you weren't so dogshit you would win shatter? AMS Horrify, hoj, whatever, line, stop cc, its not fucking difficult -you just expect to win by rolling in and killing in 3rd legsweep like you do vs everything else, stfu


u rly dont realise that if you weren't so dogshit you would win wwdk every time? wall pillar, fist, whatever, run at pally, get bop wings bubble rotate bark skin wall freedoms ns vigi charge fear shockwave spirit walk guidance trinket trinket trinket , its not fucking difficult -you just expect to win by rolling in and killing whatever after playing like an immortal bitch for 5 minutes like you do vs everything else, stfu
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