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HpalaShatter vs Cleaves (Mostly Ebola)


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#1 Le_Chuck

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 12:33 PM

Hey Guys!

We play HpallyShatter on around 2500MMR. I am the HolyPladin and i am having huge trouble against melee cleave teams, especially Ebola.
Most of the time, they connect on me and I try to get away getting stunned silenced etc. which forces me to pop Wings+NS to top me. After wings they force me into bubble pretty quickly and after bubble i am just dead without any chance to get into boprange. Is there any strategy or rotation which helps me doing better against such teams? They are totally out of cds cause their pally uses every cd Trinke bubble etc. to keep their team offensive and i die most of the time before we can get this final setup to kill something.
We try to kil the feral most of the time.
If u need any more information. just feel free to ask.

Greets and thanks for answers.
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#2 Fedx

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 12:48 PM

I have never played shatter myself but I have faced very many at quite high mmr as ww/dk/hpala and I would assume ebola works the same as that comp vs shatter. In my experience a good shatter should never lose to any of these teams unless they play really bad. What most shatters do is: go either feral or dk, i'd assume feral since he can't get polyd. So every go should look like this: Horror feral > hoj and at the same time silence dk + deep pally. That will be a cd or the feral will die 100%.

Keep doing your goes all the time and go ham and eventually they will have nothing left and then you win. In terms of cooldown usage, never use anything besides bubble first time they connect to you. Instead bubble before your save by the light proc, save wings, aura mastery + trinket and eventually bop after that. After they have gone through all of that you are in big fucking trouble but so should they be. In the next 30 seconds of the game it's gonna be over and the winner usually is the shatter because the pally should be able to kite a bit with the help of his teammates peeling.
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#3 Xonika

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 12:55 PM

use bop in opener(instantly if dk used cds) before wings so you survive forbearnce, take advantage of them being in cc when you attack, you'll have triple cc and just top yourself, be careful of trinket kick at the start etc, outside of this its predicting how much dmg they will do "can i use wall here or will i have to bubble 3 secs after using wall" (wall will be a waste), same with freedom/sprint, if u use freedom/sprint, will u still have to bubble 2 secs later. just try to not overlap cds thats all, cant tell you much because the rest depends on how they play, just practice alot spreading out your cds, u can get away from things like dks easy because 999999999 million slows from mage, the game shouldnt last long.
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#4 Xonika

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 12:57 PM

I have never played shatter myself but I have faced very many at quite high mmr as ww/dk/hpala and I would assume ebola works the same as that comp vs shatter. In my experience a good shatter should never lose to any of these teams unless they play really bad. What most shatters do is: go either feral or dk, i'd assume feral since he can't get polyd. So every go should look like this: Horror feral > hoj and at the same time silence dk + deep pally. That will be a cd or the feral will die 100%.

Keep doing your goes all the time and go ham and eventually they will have nothing left and then you win. In terms of cooldown usage, never use anything besides bubble first time they connect to you. Instead bubble before your save by the light proc, save wings, aura mastery + trinket and eventually bop after that. After they have gone through all of that you are in big fucking trouble but so should they be. In the next 30 seconds of the game it's gonna be over and the winner usually is the shatter because the pally should be able to kite a bit with the help of his teammates peeling.

wwdk is hard now with the buffs, i think if your team played with a good hpala you'd have a different opinion
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#5 Le_Chuck

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:02 PM

Using bop on opener is a very good tipp. I already thought about freedom glyph because they only use their stuns etc when I try to kite away. I used wall most of the time in the opener to delay my wings.
Some other questions:
1. Do you use Speed of light or Pursuit of justice?
2. Do you run around pillar or just try to kite open field so your casters can freecast?
3. When is the best timing to get gripped by your priest?
4. wich talent workd best? double hands? unbreakable will or even purity vs feraldots? I guess with freedom glyph doubel hands is mandatory!
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#6 Xonika

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:08 PM

Using bop on opener is a very good tipp. I already thought about freedom glyph because they only use their stuns etc when I try to kite away. I used wall most of the time in the opener to delay my wings.
Some other questions:
1. Do you use Speed of light or Pursuit of justice?
2. Do you run around pillar or just try to kite open field so your casters can freecast?
3. When is the best timing to get gripped by your priest?
4. wich talent workd best? double hands? unbreakable will or even purity vs feraldots? I guess with freedom glyph doubel hands is mandatory!

i prefer unbreakable but im not sure which is best, i also use speed of light and you want to kite the dps in the open so they take max dmg and also try to drag pala away from his pillar so he is cc'd easier, no matter were you kite it wont make a difference for you so try to make it easier on your team and harder on thier healer, u want to get lifegripped before you use freedom/sprint so the dk will grip you back, then u just freedom sprint and your not gona take much dmg for a while. i wouldnt use freedom glyph ever, flash, merc wrath + wall imo
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#7 Le_Chuck

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:16 PM

Thx for your answers!
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#8 jaimee

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:25 PM

wwdk is hard now with the buffs, i think if your team played with a good hpala you'd have a different opinion


buff survivability and flat out nerf that comps damage by 30%, jesus christ its retarded
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#9 Maxish

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 01:38 PM

wwdk is hard now with the buffs, i think if your team played with a good hpala you'd have a different opinion


feel free to elaborate, how should i play it differently?
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#10 Jinngo

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 03:25 PM

buff survivability and flat out nerf that comps damage by 30%, jesus christ its retarded

30%, damn

Edited by Jinngo, 24 September 2015 - 03:25 PM.

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#11 Jinngo

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 03:32 PM

ebola is a lot stronger vs shatter than wwdk is in my experience, heard the same from talking to people that play ebola as their main setup.
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#12 Fedx

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 03:48 PM

wwdk is hard now with the buffs, i think if your team played with a good hpala you'd have a different opinion

you know the only reason we ever win vs you is because you bop the opener or play bad

buff survivability and flat out nerf that comps damage by 30%, jesus christ its retarded

this is coming from an enhancement shaman playing turbo fuck off lol
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#13 Xonika

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 05:41 PM

you know the only reason we ever win vs you is because you bop the opener or play bad this is coming from an enhancement shaman playing turbo fuck off lol

uve won 1/15 games when i had pve spec, i understand your taking the side of your partner but no need
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#14 jaimee

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 05:45 PM

you know the only reason we ever win vs you is because you bop the opener or play bad this is coming from an enhancement shaman playing turbo fuck off lol


you can say whatever you want about turbo but your comp is fucking dumb, the idea that two dps can do as much damage as ww dk can is an absolute joke and its rly funny how you legit believe its counterable aswell
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#15 Fedx

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:13 PM

uve won 1/15 games when i had pve spec, i understand your taking the side of your partner but no need

I've played the exact same comp with you and with max and I can easily say that Max is better at THIS comp

you can say whatever you want about turbo but your comp is fucking dumb, the idea that two dps can do as much damage as ww dk can is an absolute joke and its rly funny how you legit believe its counterable aswell

TURBO does more dps are you serious? The only difference is we got cc instead of just retarded dmg and tankyness
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#16 Xonika

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:15 PM

I've played the exact same comp with you and with max and I can easily say that Max is better at THIS comp TURBO does more dps are you serious? The only difference is we got cc instead of just retarded dmg and tankyness

u played with me last season when i barely played pala/game atall, we also played with a dk who hadnt played in SOOO long :)

Edited by Xonika, 24 September 2015 - 06:15 PM.

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#17 Fedx

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:17 PM

u played with me last season when i barely played pala/game atall, we also played with a dk who hadnt played in SOOO long :)

so what i still got an impression on how you played the setup just like i got an impression the first time i played with max, which to be exact was after he had play paladin after like a month last season. But if you guys keep saying that my healer is shit then I would see what arguments you have to back them up. Because I seriously don't think so, why would I play with him otherwise lol

Edited by Fedx, 24 September 2015 - 06:17 PM.

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#18 Jim_Jim

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:25 PM

you can say whatever you want about turbo but your comp is fucking dumb, the idea that two dps can do as much damage as ww dk can is an absolute joke and its rly funny how you legit believe its counterable aswell


Asking to buff the survivability of ww/dk is stupid, because it will end up as an unkillable team (which kills nothing with your 30% nerf damage), considering ww/dk already have a huge resilience against most comps.
The only comp where your survivability is null is against any mage/hpal/x team, because mage are already annoying for a monk (even more for a dk), but impossible with freedoms and bop, denying your only reliable def CD.

So, yes, buff the survivability. Let's give dk even more self healing while reducing his damage. (Damage that a warrior can do but better and easier with a mortal strike effect by the way.)

It's like the old tank spec at the beginning of WoD. Without the @200k guards for the team.
(And the bug'd charging ox wave.)

Edited by Jim_Jim, 24 September 2015 - 06:26 PM.

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#19 Maxish

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:27 PM

u played with me last season when i barely played pala/game atall, we also played with a dk who hadnt played in SOOO long :)


For real dawg I know I'm shit, no need to point it out

Also for real - how ought I to play vs shatter? You seem keen to point out that I'm doing something wrong but also keen on not offering any advice or concrete examples
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#20 Fedx

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 06:29 PM

For real dawg I know I'm shit, no need to point it out

Also for real - how ought I to play vs shatter? You seem keen to point out that I'm doing something wrong but also keen on not offering any advice or concrete examples

you need to pre sac every deep like you do but still get full pollyd cuz double purge

Edited by Fedx, 24 September 2015 - 06:29 PM.

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