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Frost gettin huge buff


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#1 Mekila

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 03:34 PM

So according to MMO-Champion, frost strike is losing its 10% chance to proc freeze and turning into an instant strike.

What does this mean? It means an on-demand shatter combo from melee range!

Frost Strike:
weapon dmg +
60% bonus from crit talent +
60% bonus for targets under 20% HP +
10% more dmg with target under effects of Icy Touch, Hungering Cold, or Chains of Ice+
3x DAMAGE WHILE TARGET IS FROZEN =
gg

When you proc a freeze from Icy touch or Mind Freeze, you can now pop Death Chill, (100% crit from frost spells for 6s, 2m cd) Frost strike, Chains of Ice (freezes), Blood Tap (lets you use a blood rune as a frost rune), Howling Winds (aoe icelance).

If Frost Strike is getting 3x bonus dmg from frozen targets, this shatter combo would do 5-6k dmg at lvl 70. You can imagine how hard it would hit at 80, Howling winds base dmg is doubled by the lvl 80 rank version.
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#2 Oteb

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 05:19 PM

I dont think frost strike has x3 mutliplier. I thought only howling winds do?
But still a called melee crit with 2hander with over 150% multiplier can be huge. Even now if I time it right i can get something like 3k crit with just blue starter set at level 58.
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#3 Oteb

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 05:21 PM

Well one thing for sure. Frost dks will have sick synergy with frost mages. Way better than spriest have with ualocks
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#4 Mekila

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 05:24 PM

I dont think frost strike has x3 mutliplier. I thought only howling winds do?
But still a called melee crit with 2hander with over 150% multiplier can be huge. Even now if I time it right i can get something like 3k crit with just blue starter set at level 58.


They are adding that mechanic to frost strike next patch, thats what this post is about.
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#5 Exiledshmoo

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 06:49 PM

The only problem is you are using four frost runes to do this. While it is possible to get some death rune or rune tapping going on to make this happen, its going to be inconsistent burst. Its going to eat several cool downs, all of your runes, its just not going to be consistent.

Getting a freeze then doing a frost strike, then following it up later with howling winds after another freeze is workable, just not right after the other.
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#6 Mekila

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 07:00 PM

The only problem is you are using four frost runes to do this. While it is possible to get some death rune or rune tapping going on to make this happen, its going to be inconsistent burst. Its going to eat several cool downs, all of your runes, its just not going to be consistent.

Getting a freeze then doing a frost strike, then following it up later with howling winds after another freeze is workable, just not right after the other.


Its not sustainable if that is what you mean, but its a consistent, guaranteed burst.

You wouldn't spec frost to have more sustained dps, you would spec frost to pwn face with a huge shatter burst using all your cooldowns :)

You wouldn't do the cooldown version shatter using 4 frost runes unless they are below 40%, the first hit should get them to 20% and then the 2nd should finish them off.
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#7 Exiledshmoo

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 07:34 PM

I understand frost is burst. What I am saying is you do not have enough runes to really do that on a consistent basis.

Icy touch puts a frost rune on a 10 sec cd. Death chill takes runic power.
Frost strike takes a frost rune as well, putting your second frost rune on a 10 second cd.

Ok you have done the burst from frost strike which was nice, but now you do not have any more frost runes. Yes you can now blood tap to get another frost rune to drop a chains of ice on them to freeze again, but that is on a cd as well. The only 2 ways that you are going to be able to follow up with a howling wind during that 6 seconds is if you proc'd a death rune or if the frost rune cool down talent procd and your first frost rune is usable after 5 seconds.

You need four frost runes to do all of that. Its not burst unless it happens quickly. You have to use a cd to get up to 3 runes, and get a proc to get that fourth rune. So it is not consistent. It is random burst.

In addition, you can use hungering cold instead of chains of ice, because that takes runic power instead of a frost rune. However, hungering cold breaks on damage and is a 1 min cd.

Edited by Exiledshmoo, 28 July 2008 - 07:39 PM.

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#8 Mekila

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 11:39 PM

I understand frost is burst. What I am saying is you do not have enough runes to really do that on a consistent basis.

Icy touch puts a frost rune on a 10 sec cd. Death chill takes runic power.
Frost strike takes a frost rune as well, putting your second frost rune on a 10 second cd.

Ok you have done the burst from frost strike which was nice, but now you do not have any more frost runes. Yes you can now blood tap to get another frost rune to drop a chains of ice on them to freeze again, but that is on a cd as well. The only 2 ways that you are going to be able to follow up with a howling wind during that 6 seconds is if you proc'd a death rune or if the frost rune cool down talent procd and your first frost rune is usable after 5 seconds.

You need four frost runes to do all of that. Its not burst unless it happens quickly. You have to use a cd to get up to 3 runes, and get a proc to get that fourth rune. So it is not consistent. It is random burst.

In addition, you can use hungering cold instead of chains of ice, because that takes runic power instead of a frost rune. However, hungering cold breaks on damage and is a 1 min cd.


Deathchill does not take runic power.
Yes you need four frost runes, heres where you get four:

You start off with 2 frost.
you cast blood tap -> 3 frost.
you cast Empower Rune weapon -> 4 frost.

There is your 4 frost runes for that burst I was talking about.

Here is the exact Shatter Combo sequence that does not rely on procs:

1. Cast Death Grip (+10 runic power)

2. Cast Chains of Ice (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power frost mastery makes it give +75% more runic power)

3. Cast Deathchill (no cost, 2min cd)

4. Cast Frost Strike (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power)

5. Cast Hungering Cold (Lasts 10s with 37 runic power b/c of runic power mastery)

6. Cast Blood Tap (+1 death rune, counts as any type of rune)

7. Cast Howling Wind (-1 frost rune, uses up death rune)

There you go, shatter combo w/ cooldowns.

The proc version of the Shatter combo:

1. Death Grip (+10 runic power)

2. Icy Touch w/ freeze proc (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power)

3. Deathchill

4. Frost Strike (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power)

5. Hungering Cold (10s, uses up all 44 runic power)

6. Blood Tap (+1 death rune)

7. Howling Wind (-1 frost rune, uses death rune, +10 runic power)

8. Empower Rune Weapon (+1 of each rune)

9. Chains of Ice (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power)

By now one frost rune will have regenerated due to Frost rune mastery (50% chance to proc when freezing targets, we have frozen someone 3 times for 150% chance)

10. Icy Touch (-1 frost rune, +17 runic power)

11. Death coil x2 (uses 28 runic power each)

There you go, two ways to Shatter someones face off.

P.S. Empower Rune Weapon is a skill with a 3min cooldown that instantly gives you back 1 blood rune, 1 frost rune, and 1 unholy rune. This makes it possible to do 2 Shatter combos in the span of 1 minute (howling winds has a 30s cooldown)

Edited by Mekila, 28 July 2008 - 11:58 PM.

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#9 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 12:33 AM

The new build that is coming out today has a new talent called 'Blood from the North," which has a 20/40/60/80/100% chance to create a Death Rune when Blood Strike (-1 blood rune, +10 runic power) is used.

Depending on when the Death Rune is created, (when blood strike is used, or when the Blood Rune is respawned 10 seconds later) this opens up possibilities for having 2 frost runes and 2 death runes up at the same time.

What can we do with 4 frost runes + blood tap + empower rune weapon? Thats 6 frost runes folks!

Death grip -> Blood strike -> Blood strike -> Raise Dead -> Hungering Cold (Wait full duration so Death runes are up) -> Death Chill -> Frost Strike -> Chains of Ice -> Howling Wind -> Icy Touch -> Death Coil etc etc
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#10 Exiledshmoo

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 01:39 AM

Fair enough, did not know about empower rune weapon, 3 min cd for 3 runes, very nice.

Yeah with that involved, it becomes on demand no problem, very nice catch.

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=49796
According to that it costs runic power, but you seem to be on beta, so your take is probably mroe up to date.

Thanks for the clarification, I keep looking for these specifics but its hard finding a place that lists all the runic power generated for each ability.
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#11 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 03:32 AM

Fair enough, did not know about empower rune weapon, 3 min cd for 3 runes, very nice.

Yeah with that involved, it becomes on demand no problem, very nice catch.

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=49796
According to that it costs runic power, but you seem to be on beta, so your take is probably mroe up to date.

Thanks for the clarification, I keep looking for these specifics but its hard finding a place that lists all the runic power generated for each ability.


Yea I've found that wowhead is wrong on a lot of things in beta. For example, it says on wowhead that you can't go in Utgarde until you are 70 but you can go in at 68.

Runic power generated varies depending on your talents, but the base amount generated seems to be 10 points per ability that use runes. Death grip is the exception as it generates runic power without costing any runes to cast.

I've also looked for a source that would tell me how much runic power is generated, but unfortunately I couldn't find any so I had to do self testing.

Another good thing to note is that switching presence (blood/frost/unholy) costs a rune to switch to, but is not on the GCD. (like stances)

Blood tap, Empower rune weapon, and Deathchill are also not on the GCD. I have a macro that casts Deathchill, Empower rune weapon, switches to blood presence (for 15% more dmg), and casts howling wind all at the same time. Why switch out of blood presence in the first place? Unholy presence increases attack speed by 15% and reduces the GCD on all abilities by 0.5s!

15% haste + 1s GCD > 15% dmg + 4% lifesteal

However, on the final big crit of a shatter combo, 15% increased dmg on 3x frozen 60% below 20% dmg is pretty huge!
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#12 Exiledshmoo

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 05:09 AM

I did not even think about switching to blood presence for the extra damage for the frost shatter combo. If you can spike them to 20% with the first shatter, the follow up will certainly kill them.

THanks for the info about runic power btw, really helps me know what abilities I am able to get into a rotation.
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#13 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 05:11 AM

Frost Strike: costs 1 frost, melee range
Does 50% weapon dmg +3 frost damage to target. Does double damage to frozen targets.

Not so good, it does less damage now unless you hit a frozen target with it. Heavy frost gets 20% extra dmg from talents, so its more like 70% weapon dmg. This makes it about on par with the other 'strike' skills in other trees (the trainable ones), except on frozen crits.

Also, with Icy touch having a 6s cooldown and no way to reduce it, you can't do an Icy touch w/ freeze proc -> Icy Touch for double damage. Freeze lasts 5s and Icy Touch has a 6s cd so the only thing you can do after a freeze is frost strike for mediocre dmg.

Once you use your howling winds you are basically stuck to using crappy frost strike to do mediocre damage on freeze procs. LETS TOTALLY WASTE FREEZES TO DO LACKLUSTER DAMAGE! Its time to look at unholy again, or maybe a hybrid unholy/frost spec without frost strike.
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#14 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 05:12 AM

I did not even think about switching to blood presence for the extra damage for the frost shatter combo. If you can spike them to 20% with the first shatter, the follow up will certainly kill them.

THanks for the info about runic power btw, really helps me know what abilities I am able to get into a rotation.


Yea I figured with Empower rune weapon giving back one of each rune, I might as well do something with the Blood rune. Blood presence seemed perfect for that :)
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#15 Exiledshmoo

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 05:13 AM

Well that is unfortunate to hear. I guess frost mage / frost dk was too powerful.
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#16 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 07:15 AM

Just tested, yea frost strike is useless now. :(

Also, armor is bugged atm so everyone has 0 armor lolol
Makes blood look better for this beta build. Death coil bugs were fixed.

Runic power is not generating properly and persists forever, but sometimes you will LOSE runic power when using an ability that should GIVE you runic power.

So many new bugs, but at least they added a Death knight only winged flying mount from ebon hold :) I'm flying to outlands atm to get my riding skill up lol (gg hearth in vengenace landing)
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#17 Mekila

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 07:38 AM

lawl rode all the way to shadowmoon valley to find out that I have 1 riding skill -_-
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#18 Krigare

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 12:33 PM

lawl rode all the way to shadowmoon valley to find out that I have 1 riding skill -_-


yeah i heard about this.

bug?
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