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[Frost]Strat advice for 2s


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#1 Kraftyone

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 04:47 PM

I am only about half geared with my mage and am trying to run 2s with some friends to gear up. We were running some 3s as well, but timing is tough for all 3 of us to be on at the same time.

Tried with a low geared WW monk, we got destroyed. He was focused down every time despite my best efforts to keep someone CCd. Not sure if it was bad play or just a bad comp.

He switched to his Feral Druid and we started winning. The comp seemed to play well since they generally focused him and I was free to cast at will. I don't think it was my playing better, but more their mistake for letting me free cast.

I did notice I was having an issue with using FJ in place of RoF. I thought FJ made more sense for 2s since I can get 2 casts to 1 RoF and although the double CC is nice if you can get both, I'm thinking a directed 8s silence/root is better. I noticed my pet enjoys breaking FJ. Do I need a macro to cast it that tells my pet to go passive? If so, should I then also macro my frostbolt to tell it to attack? Or do the better mages just manually control their pets most the time?

Spellsteal - I've seen a feed where it looked like someone had an add-on or something that lets them know there's a buff you can steal. Is there any other indicator that the target has an effect you can steal?

In any comp for 2s, I have to assume that I'm on CC duty if there's a healer or is it always good practice to CC one and focus the other? I know it's very situational, but I'm curious what has worked best for other magi.

I know I'm tardy to the party when it comes to the state of the game and all, but as a casual player that really enjoys PvP, I'm having fun and learning if I'm winning or losing (just hard to gear up losing). Appreciate helpful advice from the players that get a lot more chair time than I do ;)
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#2 iQonic

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 05:17 PM

If I'm not wrong Ring of frost and sheep are still in seperate Schools* so for this reason theres no reason to spec anything else than RoF, Pretty much a free sheep every 45 seconds, not to mention the utility it grants and the potential great openers you can have with it. FJ isn't really worth taking anymore in WoD imo.and don't worry about not performing well without full gear especially as a mage.
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#3 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 05:45 PM

If I'm not wrong Ring of frost and sheep are still on seperate DRs so for this reason theres no reason to spec anything else than RoF

if i'm not wrong then you are having your account played for you, because there is literally no way someone could get to 2.4k rating thinking that if they were playing themselves, regardless of how terrible arena is atm

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 06 May 2015 - 05:50 PM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#4 Forumz

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 07:25 PM

if i'm not wrong then you are having your account played for you, because there is literally no way someone could get to 2.4k rating thinking that if they were playing themselves, regardless of how terrible arena is atm

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#5 iQonic

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 12:21 AM

if i'm not wrong then you are having your account played for you, because there is literally no way someone could get to 2.4k rating thinking that if they were playing themselves, regardless of how terrible arena is atm

Haven't played since the third week of the season but what I meant is in the same school, No need to get offensive.
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#6 Wayreth

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 02:17 PM

I've been playing mage/feral around 2.1 mmr or so and it is really fun. While rogue/mage is the probably the most popular 2s comp for mages, I like mage/feral much better and feel as though it has much better longevity. Some tips from my experience:

Unless facing a team with nothing to spellsteal, I always use the spellsteal gylph. Mage/feral can end up in some long games and the 4% heal helps a LOT. Regarding your addon question, I think there is an older addon called DispelBorder that might still work. Not 100% sure though. Other glyphs are regenerative ice and polymorph. If not using spellsteal, i'll use deep freeze.

When playing a non-druid healer I use Frostjaw over RoF. One key thing to remember that some people don't realize is that Frostjaw DRs with both root and silence. So you have to be very careful about your DRs if you are going to use frostjaw. If you pet nova the healer and then FJ him, it will be half duration. Make sure your feral isn't rooting the healer if you plan to use FJ. Frostjaw and Ring of Frost are both obviously in the frost school, so you can cast one of those when locked on poly. For example to start a cc chain, I'll typically root the dps and deep the healer and cast poly while the feral opens with a stun so they can't stop the first poly. This often gets cooldowns from one or both. I'll try to follow up the poly with a re-poly and cast frostjaw if locked out. Obviously it is situational, but that gives you can idea.

As far as pet control, I keep my pet on passive and have macro pet attack into both frostbolt and ice lance. I'm at work so I don't have the macro but it is written so that you can spam FB/IL and it will not interrupt water bolt. I then have a separate bind to pull the pet back if i need to switch targets or just reposition (also have a bind for the move-to command).

As a mage in 2s you need to balance focusing on CC, doing damage, and surviving. You aren't going to win by just being a CC bot, you have to put out damage during CC (you can't just waste ice novas while a healer is not CC'd). You also have to recognize when you or your teammate is in trouble and need to peel or play defensive.

Some basic strats as mage/feral against popular comps:
Hunter/Healer - Fairly short games. Open on the hunter (use blizzard/pet nova to pull hunter from camo) feral stun on opener into deep->sheep on healer. Force CDs in the opener and be careful not to break your opening sheep with ice novas if the hunter and healer are stacked. If they go on you, don't be afraid to block at mid-high health if they use crows/BW/barrage. If they go on the feral(which they should) he has to be able to survive the BW/crows with self heals. Keep a tight CC chain on the healer and you can kill a hunter pretty easily if you save incarn for after the hunter trinkets(triple DR stun with incarn and cc on healer = dead hunter)

Rogue/healer - Difficult matchup. We usually end up killing the rogue but if they play well, they should be able to win if they train the feral. Watch for red/yellow buff and be ready to peel/kite if needed. the goal is to get them to blow cloak/trinket and blow them up in a CC with no feint on the rogue. Easier said than done - there is a reason the 2s ladder is plagued with rogue/healer (druid and paladin are the hardest).

War/Healer - We typically kill the warrior unless it is a resto shaman. Standard opener with deep->sheep on healer with stun on warrior. Force cooldowns(without using incarn) and reset/kite especially if the warrior pops offensives. Wait for DRs and rinse/repeat. The challenge here is kiting/peeling surviving the warrior damage in between CC/DR. Alternately, you can kill healers if you get good CC on the warrior, but be aware without MS it will be much more difficult than killing healers if you were a mage/rogue.

DK/healer - train/kite the DK and CC the healer. Beware of the DK using his multiple CC breaks in the opener to do insane damage. Once you have gotten through AMS/Icebound/desecrated ground/trinket, the dk is fairly easy to kite. Don't use blink until after grip if he is on you. Watch for Dark Simulacrum and don't give the DK anything good(i use remove curse for DS).

Rogue/mage - kill mage, CC rogue. if they open on you, pet nova rogue immediately and try to force a cloak or vanish right away otherwise he sits in the full root. Try to force block without using incarn. Whoever they focus, the other needs to land CC on the rogue (druid cyclones/roots/faerie fire in addition to your CC) try not to overlap but overlapping is better than no CC at all. Also if the rogue trinkets something and is not on stun DR, the druid can pop incarn and you can kill the rogue in a triple DR stunlock with ice novas as long as the rogue doesn't have feint up.

Hunter/Ret - Game will be very fast and druid has to somehow live through crows/BW/barrage/wings. I like to kill the hunter and treat the ret like a healer with CC. Fairly tough matchup if they are good. I play with a glad feral and he's had trouble living (double survival instincts+natures vigil heals with incarn and they can still eat right through it).

Mage/healer - kill mage with CC on healer. keep mage spellstolen as much as possible. juke interrupts and focus on landing good CC chains on the healerl. reset/heal during ice block.

I guess I should get back to work! Hope this helps. Its certainly not meant to be a definitive guide and others might have different opinions, but it worked for us.
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#7 Kraftyone

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 02:19 PM

Well, according to the Battlenet site, Poly and RoF DO share DR under the "Mesmerize" school. FJ counts as a "Silence" and shares DR with Counterspell.

I did watch more closely and noticed I can steal/dispell buffs with a gold border. Would still be nice to find an add-on that just pops up.

So if I am looking for a CC chain, I could pet freeze into a Deep freeze, use that stun time to cast Poly and then just as the poly is ending FJ? Or if they break the poly I can try to land the FJ and it will still be full since it doesn't share DR with the Poly.

You'll have to excuse my "noobness". I've been mainly on my rogue and just recently got him full 660, which is why I am changing over to my mage. I'd level my hunter too, but it seems like you can faceroll the keyboard and still win matches with them... lol
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#8 Tyumbra

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Posted 09 May 2015 - 11:20 PM

The CC combo I was running with Frostjaw was Frostjaw -> DF -> Poly 3x -> Frostjaw (it'd be off CD by this point), CS -> DF
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#9 Kraftyone

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Posted 12 May 2015 - 04:16 PM

Wayrethx - the info supplied was excellent. I am still bouncing between RoF and FJ. I think my next need for understanding is the pet. if I direct him to the other side of a pillar and tell him to attack my target, will he stay there or move as needed to stay on that target? I saw him kind of doing his own thing, but if I ask him to attack a target and he's on Assist, will he just switch targets with me anyway? I have 2 key binds for when I want to use Freeze or Waterjet, both with Frostbolt so I can just give a double tap to cast while the jet is up (want the FoF proc). So if I am understanding the pet mechanics, I can put him in Passive, then add the command to attack to each of those and my lance key and he shouldn't go all mental attacking pets and whatever else he feels like... lol
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