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Mage Redesign.

PvP Redesign WoD Frostbolt Fire Frost

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#1 Qualver

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 05:20 AM

Frost redesign:

- Frozen orb no longer proccing FoF vs players, or atleast reduced amount of charges, it still provides too much lance spamming.
I want the damage back into Frostbolt/shattercombos.

- Main damage being Frostbolt/shattercombos, and not just a proc generator.

- Icicles removed, mastery now increases frostbolt damage vs non-frozen targets instead.

- Also want Fire Blast back, just like Ice lance for Fire, Fire Blast has many uses for Frost.

- Ice nova no longer stunning or not having 2 charges.
I really hate Ice nova, primary damage spell that also stuns for measly 2 seconds, its like a chopped up Deep Freeze,
except both the stun & dmg happens at the same time, and with 2 charges it makes it too disruptive. Who thought that'd be a good idea?

Deep Freeze breaks from damage because they wanted to reduce ice lance spam, but then moved all of that into a single spell, Ice Nova. It needs redesign.

- Deep Freeze no longer breaking on damage, frostbolt damage increased & ice lance dmg reduced vs deep frozen targets. OR only have DF break from ice lance.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My favourite mage spec Fire is awful aswell, way overpruned.

- Bring back Cone of Cold for kiting, it's essential, and has always been available to all specs.
Why, after 10 years, should it be replaced by Dragon's Breath for fire mages? Ridiculous.

- Bring back Ice Lance, it had many uses (when locked out/totems/stopping restealths etc) and now Fire doesnt have Blizzard, Arcane Explosion or Cone of Cold, and Flamestrike has a 1,5 sec cast time. What they could do, is to remove Flamestrikes cd baseline, and have the perk reduce its cast time to 0.5sec, or instant.

- Scorch, no longer useable while moving. Casting on the move was supposed to be nerfed across the board but only targeted Shamans & Warlocks.
Why is Scorch special? Scorch got a movement speed buff perk, shouldn't that be more than enough? Cone of cold should be the kiting tool, not scorch.

- Ice ward removed (for fire mages), Blastwave redesigned and put on the 45 row, remove the damage from Blastwave and have it not replace Frost nova anymore.

- Blastwave: A wave of flame radiates outward from the caster, all enemies caught within the blast knocking them back and Dazing them for 6 sec. 30 sec cooldown.

Then on the 75 row, Flame Orb brought back and gets the damage Blastwave had.

- Flameglow removed.
Evanesce moved to the 30 row, no longer replaces Ice Block.

It would make sense to move it to this row because it's a defensive, and Flameglow just won't compete with Alter Time & Ice Barrier.
If evanesce was on this row, you'd actually have the choice between 3 talents, instead of 2.

Not sure what to replace on the 15 row though.

And ofcourse the Evocation heal, its now tied to Ice block, HOW HORRIBLE IS THAT?
The new Amplify Magic I don't care much for, and would love to have Evocation heal brought back via a glyph that replaces Amplify Magic so it won't be bloat:

Glyph of Amplify Magic:
No longer increases healing recieved, but instantly heals 15% and another ~35% over 6 seconds.
Exclusive to Regenerative Ice..


Thoughts?
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#2 Maleficent

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 05:28 AM

Icicles will never be removed as long as PvE exists in WoW.
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#3 AlcaMage

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 08:05 AM

not really well thought through, seems very subjective.
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#4 Ngzlife

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 08:22 AM

Blastwave with 30 sec cd seems dumb and too powerful tbh
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#5 mazu

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 08:28 AM

Frost redesign:
- Ice nova no longer stunning or not having 2 charges.

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#6 Slamspamx

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 01:25 PM

I'd love to see a change that brought back shatter combos, such as "Deep Freeze will only break from damage caused by Ice Lance" to let you FB>FB>IL, but still prevent Lance spamming into Deep. Maybe some kind of charge system where each Frostbolt into Deep will let you Lance into it once without it breaking, so you could still FB>IL>IL if casting two frostbolts isn't an option. Or, Deep Freeze could be two separate debuffs: the stun that breaks on dmg and the target counting as frozen, so you could still shatter someone if an orb tick or pet attack breaks Deep stun.

I'd also like it if we didn't have to use retard dragonslaying AoE spells that break everything to do single target damage. Would be cool if they made Frozen Orb a talent which wasn't mandatory for PvP. And fuck everything about Ice Nova.

EDIT~ I like Icicles, but I can see how having damage based almost entirely on Frostbolt (if they end up not forcing Orb+Nova on us) can be problematic with how strong melee are looking to be. Maybe give mages the s12 Ele thing where getting hit generated Fulmination charges but with Icicles based on our spell power at the time which only happens at <5 icicles so a random one doesn't shoot @ cc'd things you're targeting?

Edited by metaldiablo, 18 November 2014 - 01:42 PM.

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#7 fonekcef

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 01:57 PM

Bring back fire blast for arcane and frost, arcane explosion for fire and frost then give arcane it's own flamestrike/blizzard. I want no more.
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#8 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 02:37 PM

make deep freeze not break on damage
revert the ice ward changes - make it have 1 charge and be on a separate dr, like in mop
make ice nova do 1% damage vs player targets to remove that horrible brainless spell from pvp

make the frost mage two set increase frostbolt damage vs player targets by 40%-60%, whatever number is right to make the spell worth casting
make the frost mage four set change frostbomb into the mop version, with damage balanced around how the spell worked in the last patch prior to the frostmage mastery change

global change - change the pvp multistrike nerf to make multistrikes hit for 15% damage not 30%, but still have a chance to proc twice - the damage reduction they feel is required is still the same, but specs which function around procs/effects based on multistrike procs are not completely fucked over in pvp by getting 50% less procs

Edit: either the above global change, or make brainfreeze not proc vs player targets for mages so we don't have to bother about stacking multistrike for very little gain

melee is still broken overall, but mage at least is fun again :) shame it will never happen since they like mage nova talent gameplay exDeeeeeee

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 18 November 2014 - 02:42 PM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#9 Hektic

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 03:21 PM

Mages seem decent at 100 in a 'balanced' 3s setup but the way you deal damage is just so boring now. Also the 'real' direct burst is minimal compared to the inflated aoe damage. I'm doing 3-4 x everyones damage in arena games on the scoreboard but almost all of it is fake padded aoe damage from prismatic crystal and icy nova or frostbomb. This will lead to people thinking mages are great and there won't be any rework
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#10 AlcaMage

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 03:43 PM

I like ice nova

so much crazy stuff to do with it, but frostbolt needs a buff, damage is a joke
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#11 Daisyduke

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 04:05 PM

Mages seem decent at 100 in a 'balanced' 3s setup but the way you deal damage is just so boring now. Also the 'real' direct burst is minimal compared to the inflated aoe damage. I'm doing 3-4 x everyones damage in arena games on the scoreboard but almost all of it is fake padded aoe damage from prismatic crystal and icy nova or frostbomb. This will lead to people thinking mages are great and there won't be any rework


Quoted for truth
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Alec

#12 Wayreth

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 04:59 PM

Is prismatic crystal even worth it anymore since it was nerfed to 10% for frost? The whole mechanic is extremely clunky, but when it was 30% on beta, it was certainly worth using and trying to setup properly. Now, 10% just doesn't seem worth the hassle - its just a giant beacon that screams "hey I'm about to try to burst - move away or use a cooldown!". Comet Storm is a pile of shit but at least can be used when silenced/locked(it is categorized as physical).
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#13 Mawky

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 05:07 PM

Is prismatic crystal even worth it anymore since it was nerfed to 10% for frost? The whole mechanic is extremely clunky, but when it was 30% on beta, it was certainly worth using and trying to setup properly. Now, 10% just doesn't seem worth the hassle - its just a giant beacon that screams "hey I'm about to try to burst - move away or use a cooldown!". Comet Storm is a pile of shit but at least can be used when silenced/locked(it is categorized as physical).


The crystal does not only deliver 10% more dmg, its just the thing why everything deals aoe dmg now:

Icenova: You deal the Aoedmg from your icenova to your target and 110% from the original thing (Aoe dmg = 50% of the dmg maintarget dmg, so actually you deal 160% dmg if your killtarget is not grouped up with other players)

Icelance: (Splitting ice is a must have!) You deal 50% from the glyph + 110% from your the nonsplittet lance -> Again 160% of the dmg

Frozen Orb, about the same.

So you have to find the right moment when your target is alone, you got proctrinket and soon 20% from incanters and then you blew about 60% of his hp in 2 globals np!



The only reason to take Comet Storm is still the awesome look :D

Edited by Mawky, 18 November 2014 - 05:13 PM.

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#14 stalebagel

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 08:25 PM

prismatic crystal damage is absofuckinglutely insane (assuming they don't move)
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#15 stalebagel

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 08:25 PM

i see all these mages taking comet storm, seems terrible maybe i'm missing something though

Edited by stalebagel, 18 November 2014 - 08:25 PM.

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#16 Wayreth

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 02:17 PM

Yeah after going back and trying it on live, Prismatic Crystal is definitely the way to go. Its a bit clunky, but when paired with Ice Nova to help keep a target in range, it does pretty well. They hotfixed Comet Storm to be in the frost school so its complete garbage now.
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