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What about 21/0/40 ? (2v2)


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#1 Krallin

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Posted 04 November 2007 - 06:03 PM

Hi everyone, with the upcoming changes in 2.3, I wondered if it could be a good idea to get some elemental talents in a resto build (Using a resto stuff)
So let me recap
- We get -0.5 casttime over LB and CL
- We get 1/3 of our healpower in spelldmg in addition of nature's blessing

So, that brings us to a decend spelldmg (I mean for a healer), and a bolt that is sightly long to cast.
Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying "Look i'm gonna dps in resto !", what i'm saying is that, remaining a healer, i might be able to assist dps and bring that little spark that will get ou target down.

The other motivation is that ES is getting too easy dispelled in arena at decent rankings (So much warlocks / SP, etc), and the last thing is that mana tide is so easily destroyed by players who have an idea of what they're doing.

So here's the template
http://www.wow-europ...251005013505300
Yeah, it isn't finished yet, but that's the main idea.

But there's always those things that may make it an useless template
- Isn't relisience gonna break it ?
- Is it really worth it ?
- I need hit rating, but i don't renember how much exactly, where to find it ?(i'd say rings)


Things to help you understand why I'm wondering about this template :
- I play 2v2 with a sp, it isn't the best lineup ever, but we're friends and want to play together in 2v2, and generally our problem is about 10-15% remaining.
- ES and mana tide are usually broken, and I wonder if they are really worth their cost (7 talent points)
- Note that this template is only for 2v2.

I tested it on PTR, but it's so freaking laggy and i only meet people wearing crappy stuff.
However i was surprised by the proc rate of Eye of the Storm.
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#2 buena

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Posted 04 November 2007 - 06:38 PM

I was going to do the same thing basically with my freshly 70 shaman, in fact I think there is another thread farther down this forum about it.

I would still get mana tide, and simply try to be sneakier about placing it. It's too good really not to get, especially with the mana spring totem buff going in which will make the prereq talent more valuable.

I think people are going to be surprised by the DPS potential of resto shamans. Even with resilience the 100% crits talent is worth it because your resto gear already has spellcrit all over it, so you are going to crit. Might as well crit harder.

The biggest problem is finding points to take out of resto to get down to 21 elemental. Even assuming that I'll give up earth shield - not a gigantic loss due to dispells - where do I get the rest of the points? I'll probably have to sacrifice focused mind and try to get a [item]Talisman of the Breaker[/item] instead, but even that is not enough.

For experienced resto shamans, which of these talents is required and which can be done without? I can only get 2 or 3 of them.
- Tidal Focus (-5% mana to all heals)
- Ancestral Healing (armor buff and purge fodder which applies on crit heals)
- Totemic Focus (-25% totem costs)
- Healing Way (healing wave buff and purge fodder applied on any healing wave)
- Tidal Mastery (5% healing and lightning crit - keep in mind this is for a hybrid build which plans to nuke a bit)
- Nature's Guardian (how good of a defensive talent is this? I can't tell from the description)
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#3 Solitary

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Posted 04 November 2007 - 06:46 PM

I've heard a bunch of people talking about something like this in recent weeks, and my answer has always been the same.

In short, no.

In long, no, and here's why.

1) You really don't get the cast time off of LB/CL, look closely at your spec. You need to be 30 points deep in order to max that talent.

2) You lose way too many of those vital resto talents.

3) Even with increased spell damage our gear isn't comparable enough to warrant spending that many points in the tree.

4) Trying to be the jack of all trades and master of none usually doesn't work out too well. Elemental shamans are the exception to this rule as they do not have to gimp their elemental talents to pick up a good number in resto. Not to mention even then they're still only a spot healer not a full one.

5) ES can be dispelled but its still very valuable. Immensely so against teams without a dispel.

6) Your shocks (pretty much the only damage you should use to help out your teammate) will not benefit as much from the elemental tree as much as you think.

7) Using mana on both will often gimp you in the fight overall.

To answer your other questions, no resilience won't break it, but it makes it difficult for someone who isn't really a damage class to do good damage. No, its not worth it, see above. You need 3% hit rating, talents are easy for those.

If you are truely considering something like this it is more beneficial for you to just play elemental and gear so. Personally I believe that elemental shaman are going to be better at backup healing than resto will be at backup damage dealing.
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#4 buena

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Posted 04 November 2007 - 06:54 PM

I think you have missed the patch note where the base cast time of LB/CL is reduced? The talent will only have 0.5s benefit now instead of 1s benefit, which makes nuking without it at least possibly viable. In effect resto shamans gain half the benefit of the current talent.

Also, nature's blessing is what makes your spelldamage comprable to elemental. What is a fair assumption for an arena geared resto shaman? 1500 healing and 400 intellect? That would be 620 spelldamage, where arena elemental shamans have around 850. For a healer in healing gear to reach 70% of the spelldamage of a nuker in nuking gear is a lot closer than anyone would have expected I think. And of course the spells have some base damage, so realistically you will be hitting for around 80-85% of what an elemental shaman hits for.
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#5 Krallin

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Posted 05 November 2007 - 10:26 AM

First of all, thank you for answering.
You seem to be saying that I will lose to much mana, well actually I don't really care about that mana with my lineup, usually when I win, I don't really need Mana tide and finish with 20% mana minimum.
When I lose, yeah, mana could've been useful, but I lost because I needed just a little more burst on that target.

Don't forget that I play with an unusual lineup, if I played with a warrior (Or rogue, SL lock), I would've probably stayed resto, but actually I don't.

A friend of mine who plated elemental at high ratings told me that usually, he does more healing that dps, and that's what made up that idea in my mind.

And yeah, you're saying that ES is wonderful against teams with no dispell, probly, but I actually win most of the time against those teams, because they don't have those classes that break our lineup (Warlock, priest, etc..) the only lineup I'd say ES is a must-have is against a druid-rogue lineup, but still, I think that having more burst on that druid would be more useful.

And last thing I forgot, yes, with this spec my spellpower goes aroung 650.
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