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#161 Reedztv

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:20 PM

If you're good at something never do it for free

#162 Reedztv

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:22 PM

Also on the subject of morality, can we take a look at donation buttons?

Edited by Reedztv, 23 February 2014 - 11:24 PM.


#163 Azyos

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:27 PM

View PostReedztv, on 23 February 2014 - 11:22 PM, said:

Also on the subject of morality, can we take a look at donation buttons?

aka twitch panhandling

#164 Toitles

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:38 PM

View PostNadagast, on 23 February 2014 - 10:02 PM, said:

As far as this discussion goes, I don't really care very much that it's against the ToS.  I think this discussion is more about morality, in as much as you can talk about that in the context of WoW arenas.  :D
Morality is not a question  of peoples thoughts and feelings but rather their motivations and incentives  and the structure of their communities. Blizzard is the only entity capable of changing things, but for some reason they don't find it worthwhile to punish cheating. Players who benefit from it will twist themselves into the most retarded of logical units attempting to justify the actions they benefit from-arguments, no matter how well crafted, will only ever work to enlighten a rare, guilty few.

The only solution: have fun, stop caring, and learn how to play video games with your friends like real humans.

affix said:

The #1 sign that your thread was unnecessary is if the you can copy+paste the thread title in to google, hit 'I'm feeling lucky', and get your answer

#165 Esiwdeer

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:59 PM

Quote

And in a complete turn of irony - this topic is about not being an asshole, moderating this site in a more effectual manner.  This post has +4 rep so far and is one of many in this posters arsenal of very direct and pointed insults toward bailamos, on a personal level even.  How many infractions does he have?  Why is the post still up?

This is only on the last page.  How many posts like this exist?  And how many posts like this, in this topic alone, serve to prove the points made in my previous reply?
This is a website for people who are supposed to be good at World of Warcraft, is it not? Bailamos comes in here saying he's "R1" at something(while plugging his bullshit website that advertises selling carries) and I feel like it shouldn't go uncorrected. If anything, this is a case of a player buying Gladiator and deserving a ban - this player literally purchased his access to this website and you're defending him because...

But right, instead of me pointing that out and something being done about that, my post gets deleted. My post contained facts: I did beat him 9v10, he pretended to be a girl while talking to me, his girlfriend found it repulsive and had sex with me instead and he really did buy Gladiator. How is that an attack?

There's access on this website for a reason. He doesn't deserve it. If anything you're part of the problem for letting him talk as though he should ever be taken seriously. He bought access to the website.

You clearly have some dislike for me - what if you found out someone fucked my girlfriend, beat my life's work RBG team 9v10 and that I bought Gladiator? You'd just forget about it, right? Wouldn't want to be an "asshole." Are my posts incoherent? Is my vocabulary too small for you? And yet, you're not defending me at all. I'm attacking Bailamos. Bailamos was attacking Nadagast. What are Nadagast's crimes, again?

The community needs a memory, not a revamp. If you have any evidence that I ever bought Gladiator, screenshots of beating me 3v2 or 9v10, or naked pictures of any of my girlfriends I'll happily stop posting forever out of defeat. I'm simply asking the inferior RBG team leader to show me the same courtesy and kill himself with ritual suicide.

Thank you.

#166 hekumzx

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:11 AM

View PostEsiwdeer, on 23 February 2014 - 11:59 PM, said:

This is a website for people who are supposed to be good at World of Warcraft, is it not? Bailamos comes in here saying he's "R1" at something.

But right, instead of me pointing that out and something being done about that, my post gets deleted. My post contained facts: I did beat him 9v10, he pretended to be a girl while talking to me, his girlfriend found it repulsive and had sex with me instead and he really did buy Gladiator. How is that an attack?

And yet, you're not defending me at all. I'm attacking Bailamos. Bailamos was attacking Nadagast. What are Nadagast's crimes, again?

I'm simply asking the inferior RBG team leader to show me the same courtesy and kill himself with ritual suicide.

Thank you.

View PostNadagast, on 21 February 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

Before you post a reply or topic, ask yourself: am I being an asshole?  If you are, change your post to take a more educational tone. If you're feeling heated about something, take some time to cool off before replying.  
Post interesting, informative content. Post drama if you want, but don't be an asshole.  Fuck the trolls, post for the lurkers.

He wasn't attacking Nadagast.  His reply was a statement of opinion - that's what these topics are meant to be.  Nadagast will probably read his post and consider it in an intelligent manner.  You read his post, immediately apply context that does not exist simply to benefit your need to continue babbling about some five year old shit.

You imply you agree with nadagast, your entire reply to bailamos as well as to my post contradicts that implication.

This is exactly why what Nada is presenting is a complete pipe dream, the entire premise is based upon the assumption that posters are capable of self constructive and logical thought.  This is something that most of the population of this planet is incapable of, made evident by an infinite number of social and economic issues that will never find resolution or change.

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#167 Esiwdeer

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:26 AM

My post didn't imply that I agree with Nadagast. It implied that The World's Most Corpulent RBG Leader was guilty of the same thing as me which made me wonder why you chose to attack me instead of him. Whether or not I agree with Nadagast is irrelevant. I said, "I attacked Bailamos. Bailamos attacked Nadagast." - hope this helps, good luck with your literacy.

Whether or not you care about "5 year old shit" you did nothing to refute:

1) links in his signature that advertise selling boosts

2) the fact that he bought access to the website

You have poor reading comprehension. You feel like you're on some soapbox and make a comment like "This is something that most of the population of this planet is incapable of, made evident by an infinite number of social and economic issues that will never find resolution or change."

Your post was entirely you not understanding what you read, and then some comment about how the entire human race is doomed. It's pedantic, sophomoric and stupid. I'm posting about facts: RBG outcomes, Gladiator boosts and things that are relevant to PvP in World of Warcraft. You're posting about how you've mastered economics and that we're all doomed. Click on the links in his signature. Advertises to carries are right there. What more evidence do you need?

But my posts should get deleted, right? I'm Bill Nye and you're the other guy who doesn't care about evidence and thinks every animal in the world lived on a boat for some sort of apocalypse holiday. I don't care about your opinions. I think you're like, some teenager who just discovered Rage Against the Machine and now you're so deep, and edgy. But I don't report your posts, no matter how stupid I think you are and how little I respect your opinion. This is an open forum which you're entitled to post on. Bailamos isn't entitled to post here. Hopefully this cleared some things up.

#168 hekumzx

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:29 AM

Cleared it all up.  

Very informative.

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#169 Bigmoran

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:48 AM

View PostAces, on 23 February 2014 - 09:08 PM, said:

1. You don't really believe that boosts imrpove the quality of the game, and you know that.

2. If boosting was good for the game it wouldn't be against the ToS. If boosting was good for the game, we wouldnt be seeing see the lowest point in WoW's competitive history ever, in a time where we're seeing the highest participation ever.

3. Kettu is playing Devils advocate, no Esport in the world would say boosts increase competition, or the skill of players. And i could see why a lot pf people would be upset by this. As we saw on kettus list, Reagant would have lost out on his titles. Wether or not you care about titles is your personal opinion, as Kettu doesn't but i can see how it upsets people.


4. How would you like it to have said 'Gladiator Bigmoran' or 'Duelist Bigmoran' instead, because the Alts and boosts of another team took up your R1 or Gladiator spot?

1. I do hold a genuine belief that boosts are good for the game. At the very least, I don't believe that boosts are destructive to the arena ladder.

2. This is just a really bad argument. "Boosts are bad because it is against the TOS." The reason why this arguement is bad is because it ends: there is nothing further to be discussed. If your only justification in making a claim on the ethics of an action is to explain that is "against the rules" then you have closed off any further discussion. Perhaps the TOS we are provided with needs to be reworked. Are you honestly that willing to submit yourself to an unquestioned list of rules?

3. You are once again making a claim about someone else's beliefs from your OWN framework. Knock it off. Also, we are not dealing with eSports, so I don't see how this argument even works. If WoW was an eSport, your agument still wouldn't hold. Surely any eSport event would be composed of the best of the best, something which could easily comb out the people who purchased boosts. (ie, you don't see people getting boosted playing at the WoW regional tournaments, do you?)

4. I would acknowledge the fact that I should have tried harder to beat a team. The one thing that has been killing the competitive community is that people are often unwilling to reflect on the fact that their bad performance might be because they themselves are the problem. No joke, people are often unwilling to LEARN TO PLAY.

bigmoran | bobrosslol | skill-capped


#170 Capstone

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:50 AM

View PostEsiwdeer, on 23 February 2014 - 11:59 PM, said:

This is a website for people who are supposed to be good at World of Warcraft, is it not? Bailamos comes in here saying he's "R1" at something(while plugging his bullshit website that advertises selling carries) and I feel like it shouldn't go uncorrected. If anything, this is a case of a player buying Gladiator and deserving a ban - this player literally purchased his access to this website and you're defending him because...

But right, instead of me pointing that out and something being done about that, my post gets deleted. My post contained facts: I did beat him 9v10, he pretended to be a girl while talking to me, his girlfriend found it repulsive and had sex with me instead and he really did buy Gladiator. How is that an attack?

There's access on this website for a reason. He doesn't deserve it. If anything you're part of the problem for letting him talk as though he should ever be taken seriously. He bought access to the website.

You clearly have some dislike for me - what if you found out someone fucked my girlfriend, beat my life's work RBG team 9v10 and that I bought Gladiator? You'd just forget about it, right? Wouldn't want to be an "asshole." Are my posts incoherent? Is my vocabulary too small for you? And yet, you're not defending me at all. I'm attacking Bailamos. Bailamos was attacking Nadagast. What are Nadagast's crimes, again?

The community needs a memory, not a revamp. If you have any evidence that I ever bought Gladiator, screenshots of beating me 3v2 or 9v10, or naked pictures of any of my girlfriends I'll happily stop posting forever out of defeat. I'm simply asking the inferior RBG team leader to show me the same courtesy and kill himself with ritual suicide.

Thank you.
if i had a nickel for each time you posted about this bailamos thing

well you have 59 posts, so i'd only have like 29.5 nickels

#171 Bigmoran

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:51 AM

Let me just emphasize how important my last point is.

People often find the most external excuses as to why they lost a game.

"Ugh, RMD is just too strong!" "Ugh, Shaman KFC is so gay how can they ever lose?"

The point is that in ANY given game, you probably did not play at skill cap. Barring EXTREME countercomps, you SHOULD be able to beat ANY team so long as the other team does not play at ABSOLUTE skill cap.

People fail to see this. They fail to see their own play as a part of the problem. Instead they conveniently complain about x Class being gay or comp Y being OP.

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#172 ROKMODE

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 12:52 AM

I don't like boosts, but the TOS argument is dumb
Evermorph/tmorph is/was against the TOS, but everyone had a pocket evermorph in cata. Doesn't mean it's bad for the game just because it's against the TOS.
Expect bias in posts because
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#173 Flavours

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 01:03 AM

View PostBigmoran, on 24 February 2014 - 12:48 AM, said:

1. I do hold a genuine belief that boosts are good for the game. At the very least, I don't believe that boosts are destructive to the arena ladder.

2. This is just a really bad argument. "Boosts are bad because it is against the TOS." The reason why this arguement is bad is because it ends: there is nothing further to be discussed. If your only justification in making a claim on the ethics of an action is to explain that is "against the rules" then you have closed off any further discussion. Perhaps the TOS we are provided with needs to be reworked. Are you honestly that willing to submit yourself to an unquestioned list of rules?

3. You are once again making a claim about someone else's beliefs from your OWN framework. Knock it off. Also, we are not dealing with eSports, so I don't see how this argument even works. If WoW was an eSport, your agument still wouldn't hold. Surely any eSport event would be composed of the best of the best, something which could easily comb out the people who purchased boosts. (ie, you don't see people getting boosted playing at the WoW regional tournaments, do you?)

4. I would acknowledge the fact that I should have tried harder to beat a team. The one thing that has been killing the competitive community is that people are often unwilling to reflect on the fact that their bad performance might be because they themselves are the problem. No joke, people are often unwilling to LEARN TO PLAY.

I like the format.

1. I find that hard to believe, and i don't see how having boosts in the ladder isn't destructive? Imagine if at the olympics, the people get Gold (R1) Silver (Glad) and Bronze (Duelist) where the same guy, and Duelist his boost. If the booster hadn't boosted the bronze medaler, the person who is bronze medal skilled, would have gotten it. I feel it's very destructive.

2. So, explain to me why it shouldn't be against the ToS? I get WoW isn't an Esport anymore, but it was. And we should adapt the strict guidelines the other Esports games right now whos communities are growing every day. LoL & Dota.

3. Kettu was arguing with 3 / 4 people earlier in the thread. Reading his posts is like he's trying to troll me, saying the ladders shouls look like the one he made with 51 boosts and alts before a real 4th player. Either he is really 100% bhind his argument, or he's playing Devils advocate for the sake of the argument, which in my opinion is what he's doing.

4. More than one thing is killing the community. People not willing to learn doesn't hurt the community, it hurts themselves, i know there are plenty of people in Rival/Duelist range who believe they are Gladiator level players and blame blizzard/class/teammates for their failure, but you honestly believe if the ladder looked like this:

R1 Cutoff
Warlock (We'll call him tim)
Mage (John)
Shaman (Ted)
Druid

Gladiator Cutoff
Warrior
Mage (A boost john did)
Paladin
Shaman (A boost ted did)
Warlock (A boosts tim did)

Duelist Cutoff
You
Your teammate
Shaman

You would look at that ladder and 'acknowledge' you should have tried harder to beat a team? Why? You where a Gladiator level player that season, you played at what was Gladiator level. If those boost hadn't been done you would have gotten Gladiator.  If the ladder wasn't corrupt you would have a Gladiator title.

Wether not you need to learn to play more, or you're complacent, you where cheated by an unregulated system.

Edited by Aces, 24 February 2014 - 01:20 AM.

View Postisthisnametakenyet, on 18 August 2014 - 11:24 PM, said:

fucking scum why don't you just offer him help instead of being a dick

#174 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 01:15 AM

View PostBigmoran, on 24 February 2014 - 12:48 AM, said:

1. I do hold a genuine belief that boosts are good for the game. At the very least, I don't believe that boosts are destructive to the arena ladder.
4. I would acknowledge the fact that I should have tried harder to beat a team. The one thing that has been killing the competitive community is that people are often unwilling to reflect on the fact that their bad performance might be because they themselves are the problem. No joke, people are often unwilling to LEARN TO PLAY.

View PostDizzeeyo, on 23 February 2014 - 09:18 PM, said:

because if there were 200 titles available from the US ladder, and those 200 spots were made up of jahmilli having 39 alt mages + 10 mage boosts, 39 alt shadowpriests + 10 shadowpriest boosts, elitex having 49 alt paladins and pikaboo having 39 alt rogues + 10 rogue boosts, so the highest you could get was rank 201 duelist, you obviously still wouldn't see the issue, other then it being a l2p issue on your part? :D
I'm curious enough to repeat my post to see if I get a direct answer from you

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 24 February 2014 - 01:16 AM.

View PostPouncedd, on 12 June 2014 - 01:51 AM, said:

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper and have looked at the numbers comparatively for almost every class

View PostJontex, on 23 June 2014 - 04:48 PM, said:

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)

#175 flannelsoff

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 01:20 AM

Boosts suck the fun out of the game for the booster while ruining others experience as well and all for what? 100 bucks~? Do what you gotta do to make a living but don't argue it helps the game
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#176 Cakesz

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 01:36 AM

View PostBigmoran, on 24 February 2014 - 12:48 AM, said:

1. I do hold a genuine belief that boosts are good for the game.

Poof. Credibility gone.

#177 Glink

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 01:56 AM

Reedwise does raise a valid point. He did have sex with bailamos' girlfriend.
Twitch.tv/Glinksz Rank 1 Hunter PvP
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#178 Dreoras

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 02:34 AM

US drama best drama.

USA USA USA
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#179 Shridevi

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 02:38 AM

View PostEsiwdeer, on 23 February 2014 - 11:59 PM, said:

This is a website for people who are supposed to be good at World of Warcraft, is it not? Bailamos comes in here saying he's "R1" at something

[…]

Thank you.

I agree with Hekumz.  It is evident to everyone but you that you wrote an "asshole" comment in a thread describing the issue of asshole comments.  If you're able to be honest with yourself there will be two benefits: 1) it will save you hours of typing out excuses, and 2) you won't believe in your own excuses.  Taking responsibility is faster and easier.

Revenge fucking is something which a mentally sound person would feel terrible about, after the fact.  Revenge fucking over a video game, whether it's true or not, is a unique brand of "pitiful," and to characteristically brag about it makes you look like a psychopath.  People might think it's funny because it's edrama lulz, but that doesn't mean they have any respect for you.

#180 Regent

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 02:40 AM

View PostDizzeeyo, on 24 February 2014 - 01:15 AM, said:

I'm curious enough to repeat my post to see if I get a direct answer from you

No one will answer you, because the only way to answer it is to admit that there is something wrong with their idea.

The only possible argument that is anywhere near coherent is the monetary gains one. Thats why you hear it so often. It just makes them come off as selfish, poor, scumbags though.

Edited by Regent, 24 February 2014 - 02:42 AM.





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