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#61 DerpiousMaximus

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Posted 18 March 2014 - 01:33 PM

View PostRallo, on 13 March 2014 - 10:14 AM, said:

@Corleonex

I have a question regarding the mastery vs crit discussion, you explained above on what comps we should go crit and mastery.
But I'm more of a "why" guy, can you elaborate on mastery is good? and why is that good for certain games/comps.
I know for a fact that crit grants Infusion of Light and haste grants shorter cds and more ticks to EF.
But what does mastery grant us except for a shitty absorb. What is it good for?

If someone can honestly give me a serious and detailed answer I'll appreciate it.
I quit ln 5.2 and reactivated my subscription around 2 weeks ago, 5.4.7 is new to me.

Personally i main difference is that mastery might be better if your going to sit in cc a lot (so vs spellcleaves). Mastery is pretty much a direct healing increase, and next to crit scales pretty well with your other stats(and is less rng then crit). So when you know cc is coming you can try to generate a huge buffer shield (up to 150k) on your main target for whilst your in the cc. so  your shield will be up when during cc(wereas crit only works when your out of cc (which frankly isn't happening vs spellcleaves). I also figured it is better if you're playing against any kind of ele or lock team. Since you will want to have your entire team stacked with eternal flame all the time, which keeps stacking up mastery shield (which helps against a possible swap).

I still think that haste and crit are better tough (for beacon of light healing, which doesn't work with mastery)  I personally feel beacon of light healing is underestimated. If you stack up your entire group with eternal flame (which is easily doable)  you will have +- a 20k HoT/s rolling on your teammate. With the 1.5x HoT on yourself 1x on your partner 1x on their target and maybe  1x on your Pet. Even if the team is dispel heavy they most likely won't dispel your eternal flames on the off-targets. Which amounts to a HoT that equals that of a full lifebloom stack+rejuv or healing stream. The only annoying part is ofcourse the lack of dispel protection, because a good team will also dispel your teammates.

Tldr: Go mastery+haste if you feal eternal flame is your main heal, go crit if you feel like burst healing is your main heal. And go crit/haste if you love beacon of light healing and having eternal flame up on your entire team.

This is coming from a player that only played paladin for 3 weeks last season, and never played one before. I however did get to 2.2k+ rating but that was playing with alts of my main arena partners playing kfc, so i don't know what that stands for :P

p.s. i have another question, personnaly i really love to always keep eternal flame up on myself, due to the fact that it heals for 150% of what it normally would thus it is a 75% eternal flame HoT on your beacon target. Which most likely won't get dispelled. Do you guys think this is worth it or a waste of a possible eternal flame procc?

Edited by DerpiousMaximus, 18 March 2014 - 01:36 PM.


#62 Warac

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 12:46 PM

when can i sign up for this tripple paladins 3s team.
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#63 Rallo

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 02:56 AM

A question about Kittycleaves, I recall you once stating that you have played this comp.
Anyway, what is our playstyle, what is my job except for healing the insane amount of damage the feral is taking.
Pointers and tips you can give, I achieved 2.3 on different set of comps on Tyrannical so I'm a bit rusty.
Appreciate the help.
jaime maek goodest post

#64 Rallo

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 03:01 AM

View PostDerpiousMaximus, on 18 March 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:

Personally i main difference is that mastery might be better if your going to sit in cc a lot (so vs spellcleaves). Mastery is pretty much a direct healing increase, and next to crit scales pretty well with your other stats(and is less rng then crit). So when you know cc is coming you can try to generate a huge buffer shield (up to 150k) on your main target for whilst your in the cc. so  your shield will be up when during cc(wereas crit only works when your out of cc (which frankly isn't happening vs spellcleaves). I also figured it is better if you're playing against any kind of ele or lock team. Since you will want to have your entire team stacked with eternal flame all the time, which keeps stacking up mastery shield (which helps against a possible swap).

I still think that haste and crit are better tough (for beacon of light healing, which doesn't work with mastery)  I personally feel beacon of light healing is underestimated. If you stack up your entire group with eternal flame (which is easily doable)  you will have +- a 20k HoT/s rolling on your teammate. With the 1.5x HoT on yourself 1x on your partner 1x on their target and maybe  1x on your Pet. Even if the team is dispel heavy they most likely won't dispel your eternal flames on the off-targets. Which amounts to a HoT that equals that of a full lifebloom stack+rejuv or healing stream. The only annoying part is ofcourse the lack of dispel protection, because a good team will also dispel your teammates.

Tldr: Go mastery+haste if you feal eternal flame is your main heal, go crit if you feel like burst healing is your main heal. And go crit/haste if you love beacon of light healing and having eternal flame up on your entire team.

This is coming from a player that only played paladin for 3 weeks last season, and never played one before. I however did get to 2.2k+ rating but that was playing with alts of my main arena partners playing kfc, so i don't know what that stands for :P

p.s. i have another question, personnaly i really love to always keep eternal flame up on myself, due to the fact that it heals for 150% of what it normally would thus it is a 75% eternal flame HoT on your beacon target. Which most likely won't get dispelled. Do you guys think this is worth it or a waste of a possible eternal flame procc?
I read what you wrote briefly, because what you were referring to is outdated.
Eternal Flame no longer refreshes the absorb made by the paladin, therefore why most of what you were basing your statement is no longer valid.

Sorry for double posting.

Edited by Rallo, 12 April 2014 - 03:02 AM.

jaime maek goodest post

#65 SaintsWH

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 11:26 PM

Nice post! About time a holly pal stepped up!

I have a question, I've just started playing properly after abit of a break from wow. What's the strongest comp/comps for as atm? Is it still pretty much the same old?

Cheers in advance

#66 bl00dlust

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Posted 03 May 2014 - 01:44 AM

View Postzenga, on 17 February 2014 - 10:38 PM, said:

It's a shame that if a player who is better than 99,9% of the playerbase at his spec and who steps forward to help fellow players, gets trolled by people to make themselves look interesting/in an attempt to be funny. Even more when a good amount of players complain about 'a dying game' where there are not enough players around. Even more so when you think that these same players most likely weren't glad level players themselves and learned from others.

exactly what i wanted to say

#67 Corleonesx

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 01:26 PM

View PostSaintsWH, on 02 May 2014 - 11:26 PM, said:

Nice post! About time a holly pal stepped up!

I have a question, I've just started playing properly after abit of a break from wow. What's the strongest comp/comps for as atm? Is it still pretty much the same old?

Cheers in advance

I also came back from a break man, and I am not fully geared atm thus I can't play arena competitively... However things are not too different from that of the previous season so I'd say, LSP - Kittycleave - TSG - Turbo - KFC etc. are all viable. I'll edit this answer as I get to higher ratings throughout the season :)
Xwede ji te razi be...

#68 Feliclandelo

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 02:11 PM

Don't forget Mage/Spriest/Hpala. A pretty strong variant of the regular setup with a rdruid instead.

#69 diblis

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 07:28 PM

Im going full crit with neck, belt, boots + both trinkets.. While gemming  80inte+ 160 crit (orange), 320 crit (yellow) and 160 spirit+160 crit (blues).. I could never aim mastery since i dont like it that much..
However i'd like to ask: Does our mastery gets affected by Battle Fatigue?

#70 Corleonesx

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 08:12 PM

View Postdiblis, on 04 May 2014 - 07:28 PM, said:

Im going full crit with neck, belt, boots + both trinkets.. While gemming  80inte+ 160 crit (orange), 320 crit (yellow) and 160 spirit+160 crit (blues).. I could never aim mastery since i dont like it that much..
However i'd like to ask: Does our mastery gets affected by Battle Fatigue?

Really interesting question, I have not tested it yet. But I think it does get affected. Crit vs mastery is an interesting topic; most of the US players tend to go with mastery but EU players go with crit.
Xwede ji te razi be...

#71 mazu

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 08:23 PM

does no one play anything but retard trainface melee cleaves and lsp(kill yourself)?
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#72 Jim_Jim

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 10:02 PM

Playing a healer in a double melee is harder than double caster, considering the amount of casters this season. :D

Quote

Does our mastery gets affected by Battle Fatigue?

Mastery isn't affected by Battle Fatigue but the amount of shield is nerfed inside arena. Outside, you can stack 33% of your life as absorbs, but inside, this amount is reduced (Stealth nerf from a previous patch - 80k max).


For me, haste is clearly better after reaching ~30% crit.

I have all the non-spirit gear (2511 spirit right now :D), reforging every non crit on haste, and i love it ! 36.67% haste (With Seal of Insight - My melee haste for Holy Shock is lower), sometimes, i don't even need to fake cast, it's really fast.

Having a Holy Shock with ~4.80s CD is awesome. (Especially during Holy Avenger).

Edited by Karlagerfeld, 04 May 2014 - 10:21 PM.

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#73 Juther

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 03:15 PM

View PostKarlagerfeld, on 04 May 2014 - 10:02 PM, said:

Playing a healer in a double melee is harder than double caster, considering the amount of casters this season. :D



Mastery isn't affected by Battle Fatigue but the amount of shield is nerfed inside arena. Outside, you can stack 33% of your life as absorbs, but inside, this amount is reduced (Stealth nerf from a previous patch - 80k max).


For me, haste is clearly better after reaching ~30% crit.

I have all the non-spirit gear (2511 spirit right now :D), reforging every non crit on haste, and i love it ! 36.67% haste (With Seal of Insight - My melee haste for Holy Shock is lower), sometimes, i don't even need to fake cast, it's really fast.

Having a Holy Shock with ~4.80s CD is awesome. (Especially during Holy Avenger).

that's sounds great and interesting.

your GDC this way is 1 sec?

do you have a lot of mana issues?

what about EF ticks?

#74 Jim_Jim

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Posted 06 May 2014 - 11:20 AM

Quote

that's sounds great and interesting.

your GDC this way is 1 sec?

do you have a lot of mana issues?

what about EF ticks?

I have a short GCD yes. Mana is not a huge problem if you switch your Beacon of Light for every cast, and use your EF smartly when you have to heal 2 peoples (Against L.SD for example.).
Of course, sometimes, i have lost some arenas because of my mana, but those arenas are very rare.

For the EF ticks, i don't rely on them because it's always purge (Which team doesn't have a spamable purge? :( ), but it's really fast too.

4.83s CD for my holy shock, i use haste mainly for that and for my main team (dk/monk/pal) to have fast fear, and it give a real fast gameplay.

(I'm french, so correct my mistakes :D)

I've tried mastery, and i don't like it :(
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#75 Feliclandelo

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Posted 06 May 2014 - 01:13 PM

Mastery doesn't get affected by dampening because it already gets affected by dampening due to healing being nerfed. It would doubledip if it was affected by dampening even further.

My advice is to keep a certain amount of mastery, because it is a really strong stat for healing when you don't get a crit. Basicly the more intellect you get the better your secondary stats will get since they amplify your healing by a percentage increase and not a static one like intellect. Thats why intellect/strength/agi is so good early on and why PvP power is almost on a 1:1 ratio with Intellect now.

Edited by Feliclandelo, 06 May 2014 - 01:28 PM.


#76 SaintsWH

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Posted 07 May 2014 - 01:49 PM

I actually copied Jìmjim's haste build. And i am actually loving it, the EF ticks are awesome and having holy shock on nearly a 1 sec shorter cd is really really nice. I haven't really had much problems with mana, went pretty low on a couple of games, but wasn't much of a problem!

#77 Feliclandelo

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Posted 07 May 2014 - 01:54 PM

It's only like 1 or 2 extra EF ticks you gain. You gain 1 tick more per 5% haste fyi.

Having such low spirit is only viable in comps that go heavy on zerg and puts your healer in a lot of CC

#78 Depression

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Posted 08 May 2014 - 01:53 AM

But if you are over 10k haste like he is, thats 2 extra ticks.

http://www.totemspot...paladinholy.gif

And if you are spreading EF to everyone including any pets possible then thats an extra 2 EF ticks per person that go to the beacon target.

Personally for me the problem I have is refreshing EF so much that I might not benefit from having all the haste. If someone already has a 3 stack EF on them but they are low and I dont want to cast because I know a counter is up but I have HP then I just EF again for the instant heal but of course that resets everything

Edited by Depression, 08 May 2014 - 02:01 AM.

If the square peg won't fit in the circle then you are not smashing them together hard enough.

#79 Feliclandelo

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Posted 08 May 2014 - 05:34 PM

View PostKarlagerfeld, on 06 May 2014 - 11:20 AM, said:

I have a short GCD yes. Mana is not a huge problem if you switch your Beacon of Light for every cast, and use your EF smartly when you have to heal 2 peoples (Against L.SD for example.).
Of course, sometimes, i have lost some arenas because of my mana, but those arenas are very rare.

For the EF ticks, i don't rely on them because it's always purge (Which team doesn't have a spamable purge? :( ), but it's really fast too.

4.83s CD for my holy shock, i use haste mainly for that and for my main team (dk/monk/pal) to have fast fear, and it give a real fast gameplay.

(I'm french, so correct my mistakes :D)

I've tried mastery, and i don't like it :(

Can you tell a little bit about your 3v3 comp?

Btw met you in RBG the other night, I hope you paid attention to the Druid that kept bugging you in WSG when you tried to take the leaf ;)

#80 Jim_Jim

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Posted 08 May 2014 - 06:23 PM

My dk/monk works like a kitty against 80% of Rsham teams = Train The Blue, but we have a powerful and immediate ability to switch our target, and kill it really fast (Warrior for example), and double focus works well too because a monk on a healer is a nightmare. Rsham with 2 casters is hard to focus for example, because even if the monk's mobility is great, it's not like a warrior who can reach his target by one charge. (Monk's roll just make you move in a direction, not on the target)

We have weakness against every mage teams, especially war/mage (The druid version is more winnable than the hpriest, because hpriest is really hard to focus), but sp/mage/druid can be kill and RMD is the easiest of them (Because the monk can kill a rogue by himself). Kittycleave and Jungle are nearly impossible because they can't assist me like a warlock when i'm focus all the time.

We won some kitty by killing the warrior when i'm on my mount+freedom at the begining :(

But our dk are not really here for the moment (Personnal reason + Work), so my "main" team is now monk/warlock/pal.

And everything is better with a warlock. (Only beastcleave is better to face with a dk, and war/mage is as difficult - thanks spellsteal ._.)

For the RBG, yeah, i was sure it was you :D

For my Spirit, i have made a 12min-game today against a LS.D2, and no problem at all, no drink :D

Edited by Karlagerfeld, 08 May 2014 - 06:26 PM.

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