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Rets...What is this?!

Paladin Balance OP Nerf Ret Pally Underpower

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#101 Nightmonkey

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 02:16 PM

Isn't armor making a come back as a tanking stat in WoD?  Personally my pet peeve is being trained by like a Warrior or a Rogue whenever I play Ret.  I think armor making more of a difference would help alleviate this.  The good news for Ret is that armor being made more important would affect us less because of all the magic damage that we do.

I seriously doubt anything will change enough before WoD to make a significant difference though.  Best thing you could do right now is to find yourself a good healer and do your best to keep him out of CC.  There isn't much else to be done.

#102 Sania

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 02:25 PM

View Postmirox, on 04 November 2013 - 04:30 PM, said:

You are one season too late bro, sea of feels.....
+ NERF FAERIE FIRE
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#103 terribleperson

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:26 PM

View PostSharkuuu, on 04 November 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

are you guys for real? ret burst not good?

fuck it, a ret can burst nearly as much as an enhancer, it is insta death without iceblock for a mage, insta death for a hunter without deterr...dont know wich game you play, but its not wow

MAYBE in 3v3 they arnt top, but this game has more pvp than 3v3, and rets shine everywhere. even in 3v3 its fucking scary if a ret pops cds.

and you know, the best thing is that fucking range dmg. you can kite full cds of the ret, yet your dead after 5 seconds


edit: or maybe i only meet russians...got hit for 150k execute and 120k crusader without wings on the ret lolz

There is no way you got hit with a 150k crusader strike with or without wings. Crusader strike will never hit that hard. Biggest you will see with wings up is ~50k. Templar's verdict, which I think you meant, is totally capable of breaking 110k+, HoW as well. With those, if you factor in the mastery proc on top, you'll see numbers total of 150k+, but no single ret ability will reach that alone. Perhaps if some of the heroic pve trinkets manage to sneak under the radar and actually have some use in arena, you'll see some numbers in that region. That said, I did manage to hit some random priest in an rbg for 330,000. No idea what that was.

I really don't see how anyone can complain about ret burst being too low. It is really, really good. The problem is that rets are just so easily peeled through their shit, either through brute force and forcing bubble, or by crazy amounts of cc. Wings also has a very obvious and recognizable graphic as well, so people can predict when rets will go ape shit, and counter accordingly with defensives. It's not that ret mobility is bad, it's actually pretty balanced, I just think that the mechanics might be a little outdated.

Realistically, rets play style has had to change majorly in a few ways, while the abilities themselves haven't changed at all really. Bubble has basically been useless for a few expacs now, with literally no change to its overall function, just duration. It was actually better in BC, tbh. Ret's utility spells have been countered by an offensive purge effect since the dawn of man. They have never had a *good* passive dmg reduction ability. Have always been easily countered during cd's. And correct me if i'm wrong here, but they have never even been seen at blizzcon, let alone had a chance in any tourney.

Why am I posting in this thread?

#104 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:29 PM

View PostSynchrone, on 09 November 2013 - 03:22 AM, said:

One fact is that no one want to play with ret any more.


true .. remind me in MoP how many LF ret for 3s? it's always the ret who LF Hunter/priest..

#105 Mirionx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:33 PM

Remove holy power and paladins might be fun to play again

#106 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:37 PM

View PostCptparasret, on 19 November 2013 - 05:25 PM, said:

I personally cba tryhard vs every fucking warrior team i play against. Just face it nothing will happen for loong time :I

Cpt you droped from 2.3 to noidea wut this season + ur not streaming anymore ..? ur skills dropped? .. hell no just say it ret sucked in arena so hard that u can't go 2.2 agaon tho u did glad last season .. just face it man its not warriors only..





View PostLimpspoon_USA, on 19 November 2013 - 10:57 PM, said:

honestly rets have it nice have you never heard true blue. rule #1 always true blue kill the shaman.
shamans and rets are in the same boat with shamans pulling ahead slightly.
lucky u have burst on 2 mins enh is 3 mins.

you are not srsly makung enh in the same boat with rets?!!

dude enh "don't fuckng die" .. cds? 3mins? at least your CDS YOU WILL ONLY USE IT ONCE coz u killed with it.. so man ye enh in a boat and ret in hell..

#107 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:41 PM

View PostFeliclandelo, on 20 November 2013 - 10:09 PM, said:

Ret's have always had dogshit survivability, the only survivability we had was from wearing plate, but that era is long gone. The only real thing we had going on and off seasons ever since TBC when arenas came out was our burst and defensive dispel. Atleast defensive dispels made up for our poo survivability so that the healer could actually keep us up.

Rep for saying the "unsaid" .. never saw a ret going blizzcon "not like into it but its like saying never saw a high ret won there?

#108 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:42 PM

Once again am looking for ideas to fix this....

#109 Rhee

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 03:59 PM

View PostHankx, on 19 November 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

am not talking shit about vanguards being carried .. i respect the man and his real good ret thank to his "only ret guide lots of rets know what to use" .. but tell me is there alot of rets in his rating atm? none mate

Luminant is at the same rating..... and other rets could also be there if they just play well and stop whining

#110 Cptparasret

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 04:31 PM

I was 2.4k this season :o in the first few weeks, playing comps like ele,ret,priest,ret,dk,priest etc above 2.3k winning good teams when i could feel like ret were much better than last season. I have no idea what changed so much after people got weapons but it felt like a total different game after that. And i don't remember what rating im atm like 2.2k? not rly playing the game atm so no point streaming. Ret is still alright but definately not as good as last season. It is just boring to play the game when u have to do much more every game than a warrior team has to.

#111 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 04:56 PM

View PostRhee, on 22 November 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

Luminant is at the same rating..... and other rets could also be there if they just play well and stop whining

u named one with vanguards .. there is maybe 1000 pvp rets out there in worldwide .. so its like ur saying %0.2 rets there got ratings guys u need to play good like them? are you that ass?

#112 Hankx

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 04:56 PM

View PostCptparasret, on 22 November 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

I was 2.4k this season :o in the first few weeks, playing comps like ele,ret,priest,ret,dk,priest etc above 2.3k winning good teams when i could feel like ret were much better than last season. I have no idea what changed so much after people got weapons but it felt like a total different game after that. And i don't remember what rating im atm like 2.2k? not rly playing the game atm so no point streaming. Ret is still alright but definately not as good as last season. It is just boring to play the game when u have to do much more every game than a warrior team has to.


well said ... but what do you think ret needs?

#113 Feliclandelo

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 04:58 PM

I don't think the skill cap for a Ret is higher than for a Warrior though. Both classes can be played relatively easily with quite large success when both specs are viable.

I think the main problem is how to balance Rets without improving us too much. It has been the same for all seasons. We have so many wierd niches from previous expansions that I honestly feel they should just remove some of it in total. We used to have zero healing capabilities and we were just fine like that and we didn't even have defensive dispels. Then we suddenly gained offhealing and we gained defensive dispels, we kept our burst and we kept our mobility. That was when we really peaked in WotLK. Then every class could defensive and offensive dispels, and they no longer needed us.

Then for obvious reasons things got out of hand and triple DPS comps where you had no choice but to kill the Ret came around and we've been stuck ever since. They need to remove some of our old leftovers such as talents that increase healing on partners and provide us with a larger toolset to take on the role as the phyiscal dps'er/melee in a 3v3 team. We have barely any synergy with any casters.

Edited by Feliclandelo, 22 November 2013 - 04:59 PM.


#114 Cptparasret

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 05:30 PM

View PostFeliclandelo, on 22 November 2013 - 04:58 PM, said:

I don't think the skill cap for a Ret is higher than for a Warrior though. Both classes can be played relatively easily with quite large success when both specs are viable.

I think the main problem is how to balance Rets without improving us too much. It has been the same for all seasons. We have so many wierd niches from previous expansions that I honestly feel they should just remove some of it in total. We used to have zero healing capabilities and we were just fine like that and we didn't even have defensive dispels. Then we suddenly gained offhealing and we gained defensive dispels, we kept our burst and we kept our mobility. That was when we really peaked in WotLK. Then every class could defensive and offensive dispels, and they no longer needed us.

Then for obvious reasons things got out of hand and triple DPS comps where you had no choice but to kill the Ret came around and we've been stuck ever since. They need to remove some of our old leftovers such as talents that increase healing on partners and provide us with a larger toolset to take on the role as the phyiscal dps'er/melee in a 3v3 team. We have barely any synergy with any casters.
this is pretty much all true :) nothing to add

#115 Feliclandelo

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 05:35 PM

Point is we're too easily replaced or substitued by other classes since the utility we bring is no longer unique, and we were never compensated.

Our survivability is down the gutter and always have been. Meanwhile ferals, elementals etc. have gotten more and more utility such as leaps, slows, dispels, cc etc.

#116 Udderly

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 06:56 PM

View PostHankx, on 22 November 2013 - 04:56 PM, said:

u named one with vanguards .. there is maybe 1000 pvp rets out there in worldwide .. so its like ur saying %0.2 rets there got ratings guys u need to play good like them? are you that ass?

Not saying anything about the validity of your point, but let's not just make up statistics.

#117 Hankx

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Posted 23 November 2013 - 03:55 AM

View PostFeliclandelo, on 22 November 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

Point is we're too easily replaced or substitued by other classes since the utility we bring is no longer unique, and we were never compensated.

Our survivability is down the gutter and always have been. Meanwhile ferals, elementals etc. have gotten more and more utility such as leaps, slows, dispels, cc etc.

well said mate .. i hope blizz replace u with whoever making rets :P it will be better for us

View PostUdderly, on 22 November 2013 - 06:56 PM, said:

Not saying anything about the validity of your point, but let's not just make up statistics.

sorry man for calling "ass" .. but the point is there few got it and lot more good rets don't can't say its "L2p' issue

#118 Luminant

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Posted 23 November 2013 - 04:15 AM

View PostFeliclandelo, on 22 November 2013 - 04:58 PM, said:

I don't think the skill cap for a Ret is higher than for a Warrior though. Both classes can be played relatively easily with quite large success when both specs are viable.

I think the main problem is how to balance Rets without improving us too much. It has been the same for all seasons. We have so many wierd niches from previous expansions that I honestly feel they should just remove some of it in total. We used to have zero healing capabilities and we were just fine like that and we didn't even have defensive dispels. Then we suddenly gained offhealing and we gained defensive dispels, we kept our burst and we kept our mobility. That was when we really peaked in WotLK. Then every class could defensive and offensive dispels, and they no longer needed us.

Then for obvious reasons things got out of hand and triple DPS comps where you had no choice but to kill the Ret came around and we've been stuck ever since. They need to remove some of our old leftovers such as talents that increase healing on partners and provide us with a larger toolset to take on the role as the phyiscal dps'er/melee in a 3v3 team. We have barely any synergy with any casters.
Don't you dare call ret as easy as warrior.

#119 Hankx

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Posted 23 November 2013 - 04:25 AM

ret easy like warriors.... same skillcap? warrior only see the red targets and smash brainless class train style..

ret is about watching hole game heal there cc there kill there and kite here freedom there again .. same skillcap? i mean come on am 2.4 now with my warrior and for god sake its the first season i play warrior!!!


PS; with my main "ret" i didn't achiv 2.2 :3 this season

#120 Voidbringer

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 09:33 AM

I am not too bothered at this point but just to add insult to injury...

I watched Vanguards stream two days ago (him obviously playing enh shammy) and  this is almost exactly what he said (cba checking word for word):

"Retri is okay with mage or hunter. Other than that every other comp is bad. Not even decent or ok...just really bad" - That says a lot

Also, I had a 3s session with my buddies just for fun. Won some, lost some (won all games that were against a Retri lol), but the best part was at the end:

Friend A: Your dispels and off-heals are ok, but they always go for you and your survi is really shit
Friend B: Yeah man, to be honest - why do you even play a Retri?
Friend A: Why don't you level up your warrior - I'll help!
Friend B: Yeah! That would be so much better!

...level 86 atm

Edit: "Bring the player, not the class" is really working out great. GJ Blizz!;]
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Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Paladin, Balance, OP, Nerf, Ret, Pally, Underpower

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