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5.4 druid changes

5.4 druid changes updated that shiz

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#141 fearco

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Posted 14 September 2013 - 07:30 AM

View PostDruidking, on 14 September 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

After playing a lot of wargames, I definitely still prefer HotW over DoC. DoC just feels too clunky, and heart gives that amazing life-saving utility that can completely change a game. I feel the loss of damage reduction, but the gain in resil + getting cenarion ward is at least something to help make up for it.

My complaint so far is that I actually do the worst damage right now. I know that everyone is doing reduced damage because of the resil increase, but even relative to other classes I am finding that I am the lowest damage dealt in almost all arena matches that I have played. To be fair, a lot of my arenas played so far in 5.4 have been against a dk or warrior team (or both) that trained me for most of the game, but that probably won't be different with live queues.

I have about 25% crit with the 5273 haste breakpoint and I feel like I am never getting any procs, and even when I do they don't hit hard enough to matter. Are other moonkins having this problem right now? I know gear scaling will help us a lot, but gear scaling is going to improve damage across the board for every other class too and right now it feels like we are near the bottom of the totem pole. Last week I felt like I had enough damage to solo an enemy team, and now it feels like I can't provide enough damage to get a kill even with another dps going all out on the same target.

Also, what do you guys think about glyph of guided stars vs glyph of omens? I'm pretty locked in to barskin/cyclone but I'm not sure how i feel about the 3rd. I feel like omens is pointless, but I'm not really sure that guided stars is any better if I'm dotting multiple targets.
I feel the same about hotw/doc.

I have a lot of procs tho. But they do hit small, starsurge can HIT as low as 20k without eclipse, thats laughable. In an 1v1 situation it's really difficult to bring a warrior from 20% to 0%, they heal more than we damage.

I can't say anything about guided stars. I was already thinking of Fae silence instaed of that if there's a caster. Or nature's grasp, but i love treants too much and with them its just pointless.

I'd love to see what others think as the 3rd glyph after cyclone/barkskin, i have no idea what to pick yet, there arent a lot of options, and none of them seems so awesome for me.

#142 Pandalol

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Posted 14 September 2013 - 11:35 AM

Damage feels fine. I do pretty good damage, and I don't even wear pve trinkets. As far as 3rd glyph is concerned, I use glyph of stampeding roar (the 30 yard range one) as I like to play with Warrior's or Rogues.

#143 Udderly

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Posted 15 September 2013 - 09:18 PM

Glyphs I like to run NG against melee cleaves (still can use trees for cc'ing healer if you like without DR issues), FF vs rogues, and no real good ones otherwise.  Probably fae silence if no rogue or priest.  

About the HOTW vs DoC debate - I'm not saying they aren't both viable options.  But keep in mind more damage overall because of more spell power is not what matters in PvP.  Burst does.  Once we are in full gear, it might make DoC burst much better overall.  I do love HOTW healing, don't get me wrong.  But I also like the idea of not sitting around like a ret paladin waiting for my wings to come back up, which is the current playstyle with celstial alignment =/  Just my way of playing.

#144 fearco

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 07:19 AM

View PostUdderly, on 15 September 2013 - 09:18 PM, said:

Glyphs I like to run NG against melee cleaves (still can use trees for cc'ing healer if you like without DR issues), FF vs rogues, and no real good ones otherwise.  Probably fae silence if no rogue or priest.  

About the HOTW vs DoC debate - I'm not saying they aren't both viable options.  But keep in mind more damage overall because of more spell power is not what matters in PvP.  Burst does.  Once we are in full gear, it might make DoC burst much better overall.  I do love HOTW healing, don't get me wrong.  But I also like the idea of not sitting around like a ret paladin waiting for my wings to come back up, which is the current playstyle with celstial alignment =/  Just my way of playing.
Burst matters, so does getting back your whole party to 100% in just a few seconds, i'd go with the second one. DoC is only 10% more dmg than hotw due the stats on hotw - and only in eclipse, and you don't have HotW's on use either.
I'm not saying its impossible to play with it, i just feel hotw more comfy and worthy.

#145 Udderly

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 04:15 AM

View Postfearco, on 16 September 2013 - 07:19 AM, said:

Burst matters, so does getting back your whole party to 100% in just a few seconds, i'd go with the second one. DoC is only 10% more dmg than hotw due the stats on hotw - and only in eclipse, and you don't have HotW's on use either.
I'm not saying its impossible to play with it, i just feel hotw more comfy and worthy.

I agree, I'm just saying its not so "pick HOTW and forget it anymore".  It's a viable alternative.  Depends on what you play and how much you need the burst off heals - in long game, HOTW will only save you once anyway, and the next set of cds from enemy its worthless.  pluses and minuses to both.

#146 fearco

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 06:43 AM

View PostUdderly, on 17 September 2013 - 04:15 AM, said:

I agree, I'm just saying its not so "pick HOTW and forget it anymore".  It's a viable alternative.  Depends on what you play and how much you need the burst off heals - in long game, HOTW will only save you once anyway, and the next set of cds from enemy its worthless.  pluses and minuses to both.
I'm saying its pick hotw and forget it :)
You're right, it saves you once, BUT DoC doesn't save you even once.
With doc you get ~10-12% damage after casting a healing touch, you lose 6% stamina, and you don't have a lifesaver.
I really think that there's no team setup(not players, classes) which prefers a DoC over a HotW, a lifesaver is a lifesaver, hotw can keep your team alive when your healer is controlled, DoC can't, really, it just can't.
This is from my point of view, this is what i've learned from the past years as moonkin, raw damage isn't enough for arenas.

#147 Udderly

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 04:13 PM

View Postfearco, on 17 September 2013 - 06:43 AM, said:

I'm saying its pick hotw and forget it :)
You're right, it saves you once, BUT DoC doesn't save you even once.
With doc you get ~10-12% damage after casting a healing touch, you lose 6% stamina, and you don't have a lifesaver.
I really think that there's no team setup(not players, classes) which prefers a DoC over a HotW, a lifesaver is a lifesaver, hotw can keep your team alive when your healer is controlled, DoC can't, really, it just can't.
This is from my point of view, this is what i've learned from the past years as moonkin, raw damage isn't enough for arenas.

If raw damage wasn't enough in arenas, then non-hybrid classes (especially warriors and dks) wouldn't be able to be viable since they can't heal.  We'll have to agree to disagree - I fully think there will be situations where DoC is a viable option, especially if you are playing a triple healer comp, where you don't need the extra off heals as much.

#148 fearco

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 01:59 PM

View PostUdderly, on 17 September 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

If raw damage wasn't enough in arenas, then non-hybrid classes (especially warriors and dks) wouldn't be able to be viable since they can't heal.  We'll have to agree to disagree - I fully think there will be situations where DoC is a viable option, especially if you are playing a triple healer comp, where you don't need the extra off heals as much.
I wasn't really talking about warriors/dks, but moonkins :)
DoC is a viable option, its just not as good as HotW - for me at least, personal preferences might and do differ.. i agree with you on that :)
Also, everyone else finds Ysera's gift pretty crap ? Or its just me ? 10k/5s, seriously ?

#149 MrCer

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 02:19 PM

I almost always use Ysera's Gift, especially when I fight rogues.

If I sit in bear form while I'm getting sat on, Ysera's Gift seems to be healing me for more than Cenarion Ward. and Once it stops scaling with battle fatigue and our gear gets better, it'll heal for even more.

Another reason I use Ysera's Gift is when I fight rogues, they can't get resaps off on me even if I'm getting CC chained. Ysera's Gift keeps me in combat even during CC chains.



but just because I use it doesn't make it better. most ppl argue cenarion ward is better. I see Cenarion Ward as another GCD Heal while ysera's Gift heals with no GCD. One less GCD heal sounds like a winner in my books.

#150 Udderly

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 06:06 PM

View PostMrCer, on 18 September 2013 - 02:19 PM, said:

I almost always use Ysera's Gift, especially when I fight rogues.

If I sit in bear form while I'm getting sat on, Ysera's Gift seems to be healing me for more than Cenarion Ward. and Once it stops scaling with battle fatigue and our gear gets better, it'll heal for even more.

Another reason I use Ysera's Gift is when I fight rogues, they can't get resaps off on me even if I'm getting CC chained. Ysera's Gift keeps me in combat even during CC chains.



but just because I use it doesn't make it better. most ppl argue cenarion ward is better. I see Cenarion Ward as another GCD Heal while ysera's Gift heals with no GCD. One less GCD heal sounds like a winner in my books.

Ysera's keeping you in combat might be worth it, but using the 'no gcd used' as a reason doesn't really hold water with the massive difference in healing potential.  Ysera's is a drop in the bucket, so much so that many of my PvE friends aren't happy with it either.  CW can actually contribute to saving you vs. real dmg.

#151 fearco

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 07:38 PM

Ysera is not going to help you to be alive in a bursty enviroment like Arena.
Cenarion Ward might be helping more vs a burst, not to mention that you can actually apply that on your partners.

#152 Izirak

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Posted 20 September 2013 - 01:41 AM

Best thing about CW is using it while silenced. It def seems like the best tier 2 talent for every spec, just like NS was >.<. WTB NS back as feral.





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