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mutilate rogue switch from sub

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#1 AcerMVP

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 08:45 PM

How to play Mutilate rogue in 5.3

There are a few of you asking me questions in my inbox, in-game and here on AJ. These questions include: "What rotations do you do?, What poisons do you use? Why this over this?" And so on. Here is a general guide on how I, Mvp the rogue plays mutilate. You may change any of the suggestions I have made to better fit your play style or hear your responses in regards to my guide. I understand a lot of you think that Sub is the best for PVP because of all the control you have. While this is some what true, Mut also has it's amazing advantages.

A lot of players haven't played mutilate in arenas because they have not figured out on how to play it. Here are the main points I will be making in this guide:

1) Talent Specialization
2) Glyphs
3) Poisons
4) Gems/Reforging/Enchanting
5) Rotations



1) Talent Specialization:
Talent Specialization is something that anybody can make up to their own style/spec. It gives you the freedom of changing what is needed before the arena starts due to certain comps. Here is a quick talent tree of what I am using: http://www.wowhead.c...talent#r!md|Isu

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The first tier for rogues gives you special abilities in your stealth. As assassination, I used to go with Shadow Focus due to the energy regen for assassination is terrible, but I realized how to fix this. Most sub players use this and I would like for more assassination rogues to as well. The reason why I went with Subterfuge is because it allows you to be able to use more stealth abilities after your initial opener (We all already know this, since most of us already play with it).

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The second tier is more or less to take in less damage/stopping damage. I chose Combat Readiness because of it's utilities against melee/dps teams creating a "Wall" for us rogues. If you were facing caster teams, of course you would use Deadly Throw.

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Almost the same as the second tier. Takes in less damage/gives health. I prefer elusiveness because who wouldn't want 30% less damage all around.

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Now comes the real fun, this talent with Subterfuge is one of the most used talent tiers in the game as a rogue at the moment. If you already know how to play this as a Sub rogue, then assassination openers will be a breeze for you. This is probably the best thing that has happened for assassination. Cloak and Dagger allows you to be able to use your abilities 25 yards away. Which makes Shadowstep useless and burst of speed. Especially with how assassination works. Assassination is all about bleeds/poisons. I will get into the rotations a bit later, but the reason why you pick this over ShS or Burst of Speed is because of the freedom you have to CC/Bleed up your opponents. This ability alone will bring back the necessary CC that you need from Sub into Assassination.

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This tier really depends on what you're playing. For 2's/duels, I prefer playing with Dirty Tricks over Prey because of the ability of being able to blind over your DoTs. Also, gouge is now 0 energy, which allows you to spam one mutilate the very most, but for threes, I still prefer of Prey on the Weak combined with Tricks, it does a large amount of damage boost to your partners.

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This last tier is all based on the kind of opponents you are facing. I see a lot of rogues using Marked for Death, while it is a good talent, it's terrible for Assassination. Reasons? Marked for death may give you an instant 5 combo points, but assassination generates combo points fairly easy. You may want to save these combo points for your Recup/Ruptures. Which is why Anticipation is amazing. Allows the use of your combo points where it's needed. I mostly use anticipation for melee/dps teams. I usually choose ST for caster teams because it's a troll move and it hits harder than icelances which mages usually cry about.

2) Glyphs:
I use a rotation of these five:

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Glyph of CoS: dmg reduction vs Melee Cleaves

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Glyph of Stealth: For quicker stealth's to be able to restart my openers/cc's), people ask why Stealth? In arena's it does help a lot because as soon as you use your first ability, stealth goes on CD meaning you have 3 seconds to try and get behind a wall and with this glyph, it allows you to be able to get that re-stealth quicker. So you can Vanish, open, hide and gain the stealth quicker rather than being Faerie Fired through the fucking walls while waiting for stealth to come off cooldown.

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Glyph Of Garrote: That extra silence helps, especially since you will be mass spamming garrote anyways.

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Glype of Shadow Walk: Against other rogues. Assassination will destroy a sub rogue if he gets the opener.

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Glyph Of Feint: Against caster teams. Most caster teams will try and kite you, so having this will help with damage reduction.

3) Poisons:
Deadly and Mind Numbing: Why? Deadly causes a lot of damage with Mastery, you'll learn why in the next section. Mind Numbing? You as a rogue should already know. No reason to explain this one.


4) Gems/Reforging/Enchanting:

Wraithaur did some math on where we should stop chasing after mastery. 79.5% seems to be the cutoff.

View Postwraithaur, on 06 June 2013 - 03:34 AM, said:

Did some more calcs with a certain level of assumption considering i don't have damage sources % so i did it just based on poison damage only. Worked out the sweet spot for Mastery being 79.5% before you start loosing too much AP and Crit from your agility gems\enchants.

Gems:

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Wondering what you should gem as an assassination rogue? There are three main gems for an assassination rogue. I've been messing around with how it works and I've come to realize that Agility/Mastery are the main gems needed. I am also gemming for socket bonuses.

Red slots: 80 Agility + 160 Mastery
Blue slots: 80 PvP Power + 160 Mastery
Yellow Slots: +320 Mastery


Why so much mastery you may be asking? Well, mastery affects your poison damage as assassination. At the moment, I am running with 71% mastery:

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That is 71% more damage that I am doing with my poisons on other players. I am usually seeing between 20k - 50k deadly poison ticks. Now add this damage to mutilate, dispatch, envenom and your garrote/rupture ticks. It's a lot of damage.

Reforging:

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I normally reforge anything that is not needed. These three, are the main ones and I'm still over capped with them being reforged. If your gear already has mastery on it, reforge to crit; if it doesn't have mastery, reforge to mastery. Remember to always stay at the hit cap and expertise cap for PVP. Haste doesn't have much affect unless you have SnD up.

Enchanting:

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Helm - Trololo, Blizzard removed helm enchants.

Neck - ^

Back - Superior Critical Strike

Chest - Super Stats or Resil (I prefer resil, at high rating arenas, that extra bit of resil will help)

Shirt - Nude

Tabard - It has to be pink for assassination to work.

Armwraps (Bracers) - You can either do 140 Agil or 170 Mastery. You really don't notice much of a difference in damage wise, but I see Mastery affect my poisons more of course. I usually choose mastery for my multi dotting.

Hands - Superior Mastery

Legs - Shadowleather Leg Armor

Boots - You can go either Blurred Speed (180 Agil + Speed) or Pandaren Step (170 Mastery + Speed); I choose Agil to help the damage output from Mutilate and Dispatch.

5) Rotations:

I won't be giving away all my secrets, but I will teach a few for the newer rogues that just recently changed to mutilate. I have two main keybinds/macros in my stealth bar. These two are what will  make the game a bit life changing and will make or break you playing assassination rogue.

Macros:

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#showtooltip
/cast [@Arena1] Garrote

#showtooltip
/cast [@Arena2] Garrote

#showtooltip
/cast [@Arena3] Garrote


3's

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Normally in three's it's a bit different, sap one, and garrote the other two. Why? Because garrote automatically applies Venomous Wounds and Deadly Poison. This gives you +10 energy every Nature damage tick(Deadly Poison tick). So now you have two targets that have Dots, you're now gaining +20 energy every tick (This does not work if the person with bleeds have an asorb on them), but you're also causing huge damage by DoTs because of your mastery being so high. So you're now basically a Shadow Priest, Afflicition Warlock and all other DoT classes. Only difference is, you have three DoTs( Rupture and/or Garotte, Deadly Poison and any extra damage that comes out of Venemous Wounds).  Now you have damage all over the map.

You only need to put 1 combo point into Slice and Dice because after you envenom for the first time, your Slice and Dice automatically gets renewed.

Your opener is important because assassination openers have really nice pressure output. You can literally bring any class from 100% - 20% within the opener (No Burst). So you have to be mindful of how you play assassination and pay attention to your energy because you will run out fast with Mutilate being 55 energy. Normally openers in 3's look like this:

Sap > Arena1, Garrote > Arena2/3, CS > Kill target, SnD, Mutilate > Mutilate > Rupture. After this opening rotation, you can do anything you like, either refresh your Dots across the map or CC through out the map. Vanish > Garrote all the map or CS all the map. Depending how the game is going. Now you have the necessary CC from Sub in Mutilate because of Subterfuge/CnD.

I normally just redirect > rupture to refresh DoTs because it's just much simpler and use my vanish for their opening burst which allows me to open all over again and apply dots all over again. Assassination also has a lot of pressure output. Now with having damage scattered across the map, you can focus on your kill target.

Kill target/Burst: Vendetta/Trinket First > Shadow Blades after. Burst should only be used when you're about to do a kill. Why? Because Assassination does a lot of damage outside of it's burst anyways. On top of it, Vendetta is 2min's long and Shadow Blades is 3mins. You can trinket every minute if you want. I have these three cooldowns in a cast sequence/reset of 40 macro. Trinket being the first cast in the cast sequence.

The use of Dispatch, when dispatch does that bright thingy, use it after you use a Combo Point Quencher, it will give you a free combo point/no energy used/dmg. Spam dispatch after the person is 30% less health. Very low in energy (20) and it hits like an ambush. It will also generate quick combo points for those nice 5point envenoms that hit like a truck.


2's

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Remember when I said I use different tiers for different brackets? This is why garrote the entire map and start on the kill target, blind the other, blind won't break because of "Dirty Tricks" Which in the end of the blind, your bleeds may have already done about 15% damage extra to the "blinded" target, which already backs him up from healing his partner/himself, but you get the picture.

Kill target/Burst: Vendetta/Trinket First > Shadow Blades after. Burst should only be used when you're about to do a kill. Why? Because Assassination does a lot of damage outside of it's burst anyways. On top of it, Vendetta is 2min's long and Shadow Blades is 3mins. You can trinket every minute if you want. I have these three cooldowns in a cast sequence/reset of 40 macro. Trinket being the first cast in the cast sequence.

The use of Dispatch, when dispatch does that bright thingy, use it after you use a Combo Point Quencher, it will give you a free combo point/no energy used/dmg. Spam dispatch after the person is 30% less health. Very low in energy (20) and it hits like an ambush. It will also generate quick combo points for those nice 5point envenoms that hit like a truck.

Well, it was a quick and short guide on how to play assassination in my eyes, but so far it's been the best playstyle(2300 in 3's, but I barely play the team and I'm trying to find a new comp to play for shits and giggles). You can take this guide and change anything you like to your playstyle, but this is mostly for more beginner mutilate players. I've played Sub and Mutilate during most of my seasons, but I prefer to just stick to Mut these next few seasons. Kind of tired of playing Sub, but if you have any questions, please feel free to ask. I hope I make sense, I normally visit AJ during work, so this guide was written during my work hours ^^;

Edited by AcerMVP, 06 June 2013 - 03:50 AM.


#2 Kyparnxoxo

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:10 PM

Awesome guide dude! +1 rep

#3 AcerMVP

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:16 PM

View Posthairpiece, on 28 May 2013 - 09:08 PM, said:

you must be stuck in wrath.


How is the current assasination playstyle (a lot more involved mind you) more boring than restealthing as sub all game, and doing nothing outside of dance.


rofl



Also, great guide.  Easy to read.

The playstyle of assassination is way more fun than sub, because you actually do damage. Even with out having to burst all the time, the amount of damage pressure you can do is amazing.

#4 Eazymothafukne

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:34 PM

So you want 0 mobility outside of stealth?
http://i.imgur.com/L60huZm.png
150k Shield slam avatar crit. ^

Real gamers unite

#5 AcerMVP

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:45 PM

View PostEazymothafukne, on 28 May 2013 - 09:34 PM, said:

So you want 0 mobility outside of stealth?

You have plenty of mobility, Sprint, CoS, Vanish, Prep? Not only that, you also have your healer which usually can dispel any kind of anti-mobility. It's easy, ask for a dispel, if you're not asking or saying things to your partner, then why are you playing arena? Arena is all about communicating with your partners as well.

Edited by AcerMVP, 28 May 2013 - 09:45 PM.


#6 Saru93

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:47 PM

Never thought Mutilate would be a thing in MoP. Great guide !

#7 Galaleo

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 09:59 PM

View PostEazymothafukne, on 28 May 2013 - 09:34 PM, said:

So you want 0 mobility outside of stealth?

Are you literally illiterate? He explains how he gets mobility.

P.S. good guide

#8 dreschnuu99

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 10:33 PM

good guide, would love to see some mutilate 3's gamsplay
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#9 Bigpapapump

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 11:07 PM

Nice thread, but do you spread dots even vs priest teams? Just curious as I havent tried it -- I wondered how it would function with pom bouncing to the last tick. I was just wondering if that healing was negligible in the grand scheme of the match.

Edited by Bigpapapump, 28 May 2013 - 11:09 PM.


#10

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 12:20 AM

good guide

Edited by Zerlog, 02 June 2013 - 07:02 PM.


#11 TteSPORTSDoomsen

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 12:54 AM

Would have never thought that I would ever read a helpful post from you, you proofed me wrong. good job with this guide.

Edited by TteSPORTSDoomsen, 29 May 2013 - 12:54 AM.


#12 Pritchard

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 01:14 AM

View PostAcerMVP, on 28 May 2013 - 09:16 PM, said:

The playstyle of assassination is way more fun than sub, because you actually do damage. Even with out having to burst all the time, the amount of damage pressure you can do is amazing.

sounds a lot more fun.  I've always liked playstyles that are about damage outside of cd's, etc.  Sustained and setup is so much more fun to me.

#13 AcerMVP

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 04:45 AM

Thanks for all the input; I've had a few more questions in my inbox after this and will update the guide according to the questions. I may have missed a few things that I want to add/edit.

#14 Ralffi

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 07:15 AM

Just wanted to add that the increased poisen proc chance after each Envenom makes Paralytic Poison really superb for mutilate, not to mention that Prey on the Weak is less significant then it would be for Sub seeing as the entire spec is less bursty anyways.

#15 clusky

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 09:31 AM

nicely written guide! this is exactly the type of thread AJ needs more off :)


View PostRalffi, on 29 May 2013 - 07:15 AM, said:

Just wanted to add that the increased poisen proc chance after each Envenom makes Paralytic Poison really superb for mutilate, not to mention that Prey on the Weak is less significant then it would be for Sub seeing as the entire spec is less bursty anyways.

The idea of prey on the weak is for 3s to boost your partners damage, not so much for personal gain, PotW and tricks is quite a substantial damage boost.  Personally I do like Paralytic for muti, the shiv root is great for peeling and you do get a lot of stun procs thanks to the envenom buff.

Clustercluck said:

I'm sure your university doesn't appreciate you bloodlusting on their pianos

Kelarm said:

It's like trying to ride 3 horses with one ass.

#16 akatyrone

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 10:59 AM

View PostGalaleo, on 28 May 2013 - 09:59 PM, said:

Are you literally illiterate? He explains how he gets mobility.

P.S. good guide

while littering a litter of kitty litters and then lighting it with a lighter to make light...

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Spoiler


#17 Elorxo

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:17 AM

View PostZerlog, on 29 May 2013 - 12:20 AM, said:

If a rogue is allowed to do more dmg then an affli lock with dots, this game is broken, nerf rogues again please...

fuck off

#18 WildeHilde

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:20 AM

Great guide. Well done. Will try that soon.

#19 clusky

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:40 AM

Regemmed to full mastery currently sitting on 84.73%, did a few 2s and been spamming BGs with it.

the damage output is insane, with multi rupturing you can keep a whole team pretty low without blowing any major cds, One thing I did notice is that when you garrote several targets from stealth it wont always trigger venomous wounds.  VW only procs on targets that you have poisoned and when garroting several targets in subterfuge deadly poison does not always apply :(

Overall it feels like playing an unholy dk, lots of spread pressure from dots and a big burst cd every 2 mins.  Its pretty good!

Clustercluck said:

I'm sure your university doesn't appreciate you bloodlusting on their pianos

Kelarm said:

It's like trying to ride 3 horses with one ass.

#20 Galaleo

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 12:40 PM

2s was sick with a healer. I feel like a real class playing rogue now. I can see how some teams will shut you down but it is nice to do sustained damage. I think the biggist plus to this is sub was SOOOO boring.





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