Jump to content

  • Curse Sites
Help

Affli, Mage and holy pally changes incoming?

asd

  • Please log in to reply
157 replies to this topic

#121 DamnBlackCap

DamnBlackCap
  • Junkies
  • Undeadclass_name
  • EU-Eredar
  • Blutdurst
  • Posts: 28
  • Talents: Frost

Posted 09 May 2013 - 07:19 PM

8 second lockout on a kick-cd is ridicilous, its like disarming melees up to twice every 15 seconds, or nerfing the amount of interrupts back to wotlk at least.

#122 Pritchard

Pritchard
  • Junkies
  • Night Elfclass_name
  • US-Kel'Thuzad
  • Nightfall
  • Posts: 617
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/0

Posted 09 May 2013 - 08:46 PM

Just a reminder, when you think of changes, you have to think with pve in the best interest.  So for example,in most cases,nerfing damage won't really be possible unless its heavily effecting pve.  And if they do nerf damage it has some crazy workaround and other addition to make it not nerf pve.  Its best to think more of the utility spells, or proc wise.  For example, you can't take the damage away from frozen orb because its a big part of pve, even though its grossly overpowered in pvp.  I think the best thing to do is to put more FoF procs on frostbolt and take them away from pet nova all together.  Wouldn't effect PvE much at all, with the increased proc chance you can also slightly lower damage so the DPS stays  ~same, which will also help out pve.  And in PvP situations, you can still deep off of pet nova without a FoF proc.

#123 Alexandrius

Alexandrius

Posted 09 May 2013 - 08:48 PM

View PostDamnBlackCap, on 09 May 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

8 second lockout on a kick-cd is ridicilous, its like disarming melees up to twice every 15 seconds, or nerfing the amount of interrupts back to wotlk at least.
. Yes, like I said would require more changes to make sense.  Other than that, the only way I enjoy playing frost Mage now is frost bomb.  I've found that if I play bomb vs a good rogue who abuses shuriken toss and deadly throw, I take aprox 700 less dmg per attack by stacking int like a Mongol because of flame glow.  It adds up over time I feel, especially with a resto Druid and the nature of hots.  On top of that nice feature, because I am geared full offensive, the few frost bombs I do get off almost always have the potential to global the rogue and force some kind of cool down, like trinket or cloak.  Otherwise if I gear resil, sure I will tank his eviscerates better ( like -10k off a 110k crit?) but when I get my frostbomb off, if it doesn't put the fear of god into him to cloak or be one shot, I have achieved nothing and can enjoy being deadly throw locked for my next attempts at casting frostbomb.  If I want to play boring and have an easier time vs a deadly throw spec rogue or a feral or enhance, I equip my resil gear and spec nether tempest and hop around spamming instants.  This worked very well versus comps like Fps vs top tier players but requires even less effort.  If I was asking for Mage nerfs I would really be more looking to game changes in general.  I think Mage absurdity is a sign of flawed design for the meta of arena, not of just frost mages.   If I get a frostbomb off once every four casts against a dt rogue it has to be scary and force some kind of cd or I am ineffective.  I think that is lame play style for both the Mage and the opponents.

#124 Eveny

Eveny
  • Junkies
  • Night Elfclass_name
  • EU-Outland
  • Misery
  • Posts: 236
  • Talents: Shadow 1/0/0/1/2/1
  • LocationBelgium

Posted 09 May 2013 - 09:21 PM

spamming poly / fear with the dispel cd should be looked at...
If you have problems understanding my post, don't assume something and hit the reply button but read it again.

#125 Deadscumlord

Deadscumlord
  • Drjakethomas
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Kel'Thuzad
  • Nightfall
  • Posts: 462
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 1954

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:11 PM

View PostEveny, on 09 May 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

spamming poly / fear with the dispel cd should be looked at...

Def needs to be looked at. I really miss the wrath dispel system.  Hated how it was in Cata. Not much better now

#126 Shizz

Shizz
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Darkspear
  • Cyclone
  • Posts: 32
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 2178

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:23 PM

View PostBraindance, on 08 May 2013 - 10:57 PM, said:

1) I wasn't quiet last season and I was one of the pioneers regarding warrior nerfs
2) If you can't pull what I described you're dog - I mean it takes 2 skills not on the gcd to take 2 ppl out. Maybe watching Venruki's stream will make you better. You can also buy a SkillCapped sub or w/e and get coached

Cy@


Your cute. Again if you let a mage control your whole team and land a kill it is you who needs the subscription. Im pretty sure you can figure how to survive said situation ever 1.5 mins as thats POM's cd and most people dont run POM every game anyway. Play a mage then tell me how easy it is to do what you are saying at 2400 MMR.

#127 Braindance

Braindance
  • Junkies
  • Orcclass_name
  • US-Tichondrius
  • Bloodlust
  • Posts: 3541
  • Talents: Arms 1/1/1/1/1/2
  • 2v2: 1638
  • 3v3: 2172
  • RBG: 576
  • LocationAtlanta

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:25 PM

View PostShizz, on 09 May 2013 - 10:23 PM, said:

Your cute. Again if you let a mage control your whole team and land a kill it is you who needs the subscription. Im pretty sure you can figure how to survive said situation ever 1.5 mins as thats POM's cd and most people dont run POM every game anyway. Play a mage then tell me how easy it is to do what you are saying at 2400 MMR.
I played wld at 2300 mmr and kfc at 2450 mmr this season - it's really easy yes. I am not talking about 3 ppl I am talking about 2 people - not every dps in the game can stop the chain you know.

And I am cute I know tnx.

View PostZerstiren, on 14 August 2011 - 01:21 AM, said:

If you haven't +repped this guy, you are part of the problem.

View PostRenaissance_Man, on 31 July 2013 - 04:31 AM, said:

If I had a gun with two bullets and I was in a room with Hitler, bin Laden, and you, I would shoot you twice.

View Postsimonfra1234, on 25 August 2011 - 08:46 PM, said:

bro you got +rep'd by rapture...

#128 Djandawg

Djandawg
  • Junkies
  • Undeadclass_name
  • EU-Genjuros
  • Raserei / Frenzy
  • Posts: 1033
  • Talents: Shadow

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:28 PM

Dispel cd makes the game worse. Even reducing it to half is not an option.
120k unstable affliction + silence and 3 second drless horror is enough punishment for spam dispellers. I think we can safely say that this dispel cooldown making the game more skillful idea was a fiasco. Poly -> dispel -> full nova, get fucked, so many examples like this happen. It doesn't enforce better decision making since people can spam cc that leads to 4 second(possibly +2seconds)  guaranteed cc.
I can't believe people almost never complain about this. We should spam holinka to bring back cata dispel mechanics(healers only obv)
It is extra painful for healers without freedom.

Edited by Djandawg, 09 May 2013 - 10:30 PM.


#129 Deadscumlord

Deadscumlord
  • Drjakethomas
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Kel'Thuzad
  • Nightfall
  • Posts: 462
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 1954

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:30 PM

View PostDjandawg, on 09 May 2013 - 10:28 PM, said:

Dispel cd makes the game worse. Even reducing it to half is not an option.
120k unstable affliction + silence and 3 second drless horror is enough punishment for spam dispellers. I think we can safely say that this dispel cooldown making the game more skillful idea was a fiasco. Poly -> dispel -> full nova, get fucked, so many examples like this happen. It doesn't enforce better decision making since people can spam cc that leads to 4 second(possibly +2seconds)  guaranteed cc.
I can't believe people almost never complain about this. We should spam holinka to bring back cata dispel mechanics(healers only obv)

Nah bring wrath dispel back.

#130 Shizz

Shizz
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Darkspear
  • Cyclone
  • Posts: 32
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 2178

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:31 PM

View PostPersephones, on 09 May 2013 - 09:32 AM, said:

Mages are just able to force defensive cds on their own due to absurd burst, and they can do it way too often (24 sec). Most defensive cds are 2, 3 or even 5 minutes. I wouldn't be surprised if Deep's cd was increased to like 45 sec.

You are seriously high if you think a mage can force def cd's every 24 seconds.  If you just bomb deep and lance a fucking riptide will keep you at 50%. Only time def cd's will be forced is BOMB DEEP ORB TRINKET INCANTERS like has been said 1000 times already in this post.  DMG is absurd period and needs to be toned down just like how I LOL when thug opens on someone and they are at 20% before subterfuge is even up.  At least god comp doesnt have 37 seconds of instant CC  All dmg needs to be fixed in order for mages current status to be changed.  KFC last season had random reatards getting glad, I dont see random mages that have never broke 2200 sitting at 2500 right now do you?

#131 Shizz

Shizz
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Darkspear
  • Cyclone
  • Posts: 32
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 2178

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:34 PM

View PostBraindance, on 09 May 2013 - 10:25 PM, said:

I played wld at 2300 mmr and kfc at 2450 mmr this season - it's really easy yes. I am not talking about 3 ppl I am talking about 2 people - not every dps in the game can stop the chain you know.

And I am cute I know tnx.

Not attacking your personal skill im saying play a mage at 2400 MMR and see how fun it is.  It reallllly isnt as easy as you think it is.  Dont get me wrong though I am not advocating the burst damage as I think its fucking horseshit for most games to be over in 30 seconds but thats what WoW is now.  Alot needs to be fixed and mages will get toned down once 5.3 hits for sure

#132 Eveny

Eveny
  • Junkies
  • Night Elfclass_name
  • EU-Outland
  • Misery
  • Posts: 236
  • Talents: Shadow 1/0/0/1/2/1
  • LocationBelgium

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:36 PM

View PostShizz, on 09 May 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

You are seriously high if you think a mage can force def cd's every 24 seconds.  If you just bomb deep and lance a fucking riptide will keep you at 50%. Only time def cd's will be forced is BOMB DEEP ORB TRINKET INCANTERS like has been said 1000 times already in this post.  DMG is absurd period and needs to be toned down just like how I LOL when thug opens on someone and they are at 20% before subterfuge is even up.  At least god comp doesnt have 37 seconds of instant CC  All dmg needs to be fixed in order for mages current status to be changed.  KFC last season had random reatards getting glad, I dont see random mages that have never broke 2200 sitting at 2500 right now do you?

Posted Image
If you have problems understanding my post, don't assume something and hit the reply button but read it again.

#133 Deadscumlord

Deadscumlord
  • Drjakethomas
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Kel'Thuzad
  • Nightfall
  • Posts: 462
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 1954

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:39 PM

View PostShizz, on 09 May 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

You are seriously high if you think a mage can force def cd's every 24 seconds.  If you just bomb deep and lance a fucking riptide will keep you at 50%. Only time def cd's will be forced is BOMB DEEP ORB TRINKET INCANTERS like has been said 1000 times already in this post.  DMG is absurd period and needs to be toned down just like how I LOL when thug opens on someone and they are at 20% before subterfuge is even up.  At least god comp doesnt have 37 seconds of instant CC  All dmg needs to be fixed in order for mages current status to be changed.  KFC last season had random reatards getting glad, I dont see random mages that have never broke 2200 sitting at 2500 right now do you?

When casters get out of control GOOD Casters are out of control.  Like you said, you dont see random 2200 mages at 2500 like you do when Melee specs get over the top, because as a casters you still have to know how to set up and not mindlessly sit on a kill target.

#134 Shizz

Shizz
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Darkspear
  • Cyclone
  • Posts: 32
  • Talents: Frost 0/2/0/2/0/2
  • RBG: 2178

Posted 09 May 2013 - 10:46 PM

View PostChristymarie, on 09 May 2013 - 10:39 PM, said:

When casters get out of control GOOD Casters are out of control.  Like you said, you dont see random 2200 mages at 2500 like you do when Melee specs get over the top, because as a casters you still have to know how to set up and not mindlessly sit on a kill target.

This.  And I spoke incorrectly, yes a mage can force def cd's outside of EVERY cd in the game but this is if you are naked and sitting in the opene like a dummy, but again very easily negated or healed through.

#135 vacantt

vacantt
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • US-Korgath
  • Vengeance
  • Posts: 25
  • Talents: Holy 0/0/1/2/2/0
  • RBG: 384

Posted 11 May 2013 - 05:17 AM

View PostEveny, on 09 May 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

spamming poly / fear with the dispel cd should be looked at...

of my many, many, many gripes as a holy paladin, this one's surprisingly near the top of my list

#136 Violatrix

Violatrix
  • Junkies
  • Curse Premium
  • Draeneiclass_name
  • US-Kel'Thuzad
  • Nightfall
  • Posts: 121
  • Talents: Holy 0/1/1/2/2/0
  • RBG: 1130
  • LocationLos Angeles, California, USA

Posted 11 May 2013 - 06:38 AM

View PostNitric, on 07 May 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

Every single one of your posts is you complaining about how hunters are the god class and can't be CCd.

Yes, BW acting as a second trinket (1m cd) that is reset by readiness (5m cd) is dumb. I don't think any hunter has defended that. The class is hardly immune to CC though, and in fact, probably suffers more to incidental CC (novas, aoe fears, etc. that hit the pet).

Get a fucking clue.

There is no shortage of BM hunters claiming that the BW "second trinket" functionality is needed and that readiness isn't a problem b/c it is on such a long CD.
Lightweight Chastise CD tracker:

http://www.curse.com...ixchastisetimer

#137 Lieto

Lieto
  • Junkies
  • Night Elfclass_name
  • EU-Arthas
  • Glutsturm / Emberstorm
  • Posts: 1940
  • Talents: Subtlety
  • LocationKyiv. Ukraine.

Posted 11 May 2013 - 02:05 PM

I am not sure why FoF / shatter is even there. Rogue lost their crit on ambush long time ago and mages still have their crit chains  Fingers of frost proccing from everything and novas from perma pet, stun, prep, quad damage lance on frozen targets on top of the crit, free fbolts that proc some fof as well. Thats just a little bit beyond my humble understanding.

It wouldnt be as bad if healers didnt loose their spam dispel. But they did.

Edited by Lieto, 11 May 2013 - 02:08 PM.

Shadowmelding since 2007.

#138 affix

affix
  • Junkies
  • Blood Elfclass_name
  • US-Tichondrius
  • Bloodlust
  • Posts: 4313
  • Talents: Frost
  • RBG: 2479

Posted 15 May 2013 - 12:07 AM

View PostLieto, on 11 May 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

I am not sure why FoF / shatter is even there. Rogue lost their crit on ambush long time ago and mages still have their crit chains  Fingers of frost proccing from everything and novas from perma pet, stun, prep, quad damage lance on frozen targets on top of the crit, free fbolts that proc some fof as well. Thats just a little bit beyond my humble understanding.
If you actually want an explanation, it's because the base damage on the spells in question is balanced around the fact that they will be affected by shatter/FoF.  They could just as easily reword the tooltip to say that it does 1/4th damage against non-frozen targets if the semantics bother you that much.

It's less clear that they wanted BF/FoF/Bomb to do so much damage with trinkets and incanter's stacked on top of each other.

#139 Drye

Drye
  • Junkies
  • Orcclass_name
  • EU-Blackrock
  • Glutsturm / Emberstorm
  • Posts: 2852
  • Talents: Retribution 1/0/0/2/2/0
  • RBG: 2176

Posted 17 May 2013 - 11:42 AM

no pala changes, as it is the release candidate? no :(
Posted Image

#140 Conviqx

Conviqx
  • Conviq
  • Junkies
  • Humanclass_name
  • EU-Outland
  • Misery
  • Posts: 263
  • Talents: Subtlety 1/2/2/0/0/1
  • LocationBelgium

Posted 17 May 2013 - 12:06 PM

hpala doesn't need changes other classes just needed massive nerfs like rogues hunters and mages, paladins will be fine

Edited by Conviqx, 17 May 2013 - 12:06 PM.

http://www.twitch.tv/conviq

Dost Thou Even Hoist?




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

<