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Cloak and Dagger no longer works during Shadow Dance


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#61 Shawir

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:24 PM

really hope this change is real so all the dogshit rogues go back 1600 to where they belong. remove mind numbing and shroud while they are at it

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#62 Bloódx

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:28 PM

View Postmimmick, on 03 May 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

Or remove faerie fire from game dumb ability that only shits on rogues

Basically this....

Good Rdruid or feral can basically fuck up any rogue team by just mashing his head on faeri fire button - its BEYOND retarded -

This is going to throw rogues back into the mud again due to the fact of 8 second dispell - its hitting rogues the hardest, if you remove 8 sec dispell cd rogues would be soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo OP compared to any other class.


1. Remove faeri fire
2. Remove dispell cd if faeri fire isnt removed
3. OR just keep it as it is now, - rogues are gna be even more unstable now ggs


Only fixes rogues need is mby a little nerf to Deadly Throw and Shuriken - and maybe do like they did to warriors s9 no BLADES/DANCE together.
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#63 Hyuru

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:29 PM

View Postaveruki, on 03 May 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

It was pretty annoying. You see a rogue dancing you root him, gain some distance , jk he cloaks/ gets dispelled and is instantly back on you.
Faerie Fire should be changed and its duration is way too long. Esp now that dispels have 8 sec cd. Maybe reduce FF duration to 8 sec?
[13:54:48] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): I tweetet holinka
[13:54:54] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): lets hope he answers!
[13:55:14] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): Harald Vinje ‏@noteveneu 8m
@holinka Any plans on looking at faerie fire? The ability is old and outdated, and it's stupid that one ability alone should counter rogues.
[13:55:40] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): if it was like an 8 second duration
[13:55:41] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): or sth
[13:55:43] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): i wouldt mind
[13:55:51] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): like 8 sec duration with a 30 second cd
[13:55:59] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): so it had some "skill element" to it
[13:56:02] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): where u could predict
[13:56:07] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): when he was going for a restealth
[13:56:11] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): but it last for like a fucking minnute
[13:56:18] Harald Vinje (Hyuru): or sth bs like that

great minds think alike.

Edited by Hyuru, 03 May 2013 - 12:29 PM.


#64 Hyuru

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:30 PM

View PostShawir, on 03 May 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

really hope this change is real so all the dogshit rogues go back 1600 to where they belong. remove mind numbing and shroud while they are at it
harsh, still +repped you, love u bbycakes <3

Edited by Hyuru, 03 May 2013 - 12:30 PM.


#65 mirox

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:36 PM

Shroud,demonic gateway,symbiosis granting game changing abilities should all go. Also disc priest denying openers with Spirit shell shouldn't be in game either. Simple fix  for spirit shell being usable only when in combat would do...

#66 djp771133

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:37 PM

Oh no, rogues can't teleport around the map and spam stuns on everyone?  Whatever will you do.  Maybe this will send all the trash tier rogues back to the 1800s where they belong

#67 korzal

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 12:40 PM

what is this, nerf #6 without evaluating the changes on live?  overnerfing and overbuffing every single season is starting to get just a little bit retarded...

#68 Bigpapapump

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 01:03 PM

View Postdjp771133, on 03 May 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

Oh no, rogues can't teleport around the map and spam stuns on everyone?  Whatever will you do.  Maybe this will send all the trash tier rogues back to the 1800s where they belong

So spamming stuns on everyone eh? Lets say they use shd which is an 8 second ability. You cheap shot 3 people (costing you 120 out of 130 total energy and using 3 of those 8 seconds). You regenerate 10-11 energy per second + 8 / 2s via SnD so timed perfect you get around 140 energy regained during the shadow dance. Follow me still? I know logic is uncommon to mouthbreathers, so I can slow down for you. So 3 seconds into my dance, I have 5 seconds left -- I've used 120 energy to cs your whole team, and regained approximately 56 energy so Im hovering around 65 energy right now. I have 5 seconds to perform this supposedly swifty 1 shot-esque burst, so lets do a best cast scenario (assuming just shd though because people seem to think SHD is all of rogue's burst). So lets assume that I cs'd the 2 other people first, before cs'ing the kill target (that hopefully has a bleed up to account for the 10% damage). I Cs the kill target with premed (4 cp, we'll say someone else crit so I have 5) for an evis which costs a net of 10 energy to use. Then what, maybe 2 ambushes total if I get lucky with perfect energy management (at 60 energy a piece) into another evis. But CS lasts 5 seconds, 1 for premed, 1 for evis, 1 for each ambush and the 5th for a 2nd evis if I have perfect timing, none of your partners use any cds, no one has any stun breakers. Man, its a good thing to know that if I play perfectly I can cs your whole team and tear through 40% of his health with my supposed amazing burst, and assuming of course that no one has any cds, stun breaker or has the cognitive abilities to use any kind of cc or cd's when the rogue first pops shadow dance. Thanks for that enlightening post.

Edit -- Oh and this is assuming hes not using a retarded PvE Trinket that procs 65% bonus agility because that is its own problem not an inherent rogue class imbalance.
And edited for typo --

"varellol, on 03 May 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

ambush energie cost is reduced by 20 while dancing and rupture gives 20% bonusdmg not 10%"

Good point, forgot the 20 energy and meant 20% but typos suck. So after the premed evis Im sitting at 55 energy (assuming someone crit or 4cp triggered the 25+ elsewise Im at 35. So 55 energy, I get one ambush then have to wait approximately 1.6 seconds to get another one, which means you still are hardpressed to get a second evis off before the cs ends.

Edited by Bigpapapump, 03 May 2013 - 01:21 PM.


#69 varellz

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 01:15 PM

ambush energie cost is reduced by 20 while dancing and rupture gives 20% bonusdmg not 10%

#70 Silhin

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 01:15 PM

ok w/e i give up

Guess next patch will be summer time give me a chance to go out more and be social

Just maybe a Girl will touch my D ryer sheets :D

#71 Bigpapapump

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 01:19 PM

View Postvarellol, on 03 May 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

ambush energie cost is reduced by 20 while dancing and rupture gives 20% bonusdmg not 10%

Good point, forgot the 20 energy and meant 20% but typos suck. So after the premed evis Im sitting at 55 energy (assuming someone crit or 4cp triggered the 25+ elsewise Im at 35. So 55 energy, I get one ambush then have to wait approximately 1.6 seconds to get another one, which means you still are hardpressed to get a second evis off before the cs ends.

#72 ohnoes

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 02:13 PM

so when are the buffs coming to compensate for all these nerfs?

didn't this holinka guy state he did not want rogues to back to what they were in 5.1 or am i missing something

#73 samuser1234

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 02:20 PM

View PostBigpapapump, on 03 May 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

But CS lasts 5 seconds, 1 for premed, 1 for evis, 1 for each ambush and the 5th for a 2nd evis if I have perfect timing, none of your partners use any cds,

View PostBigpapapump, on 03 May 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

But CS lasts 5 seconds, 1 for premed

View PostBigpapapump, on 03 May 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

1 for premed

Have u ever played a rogue?
#1 rogue trip deepz USA, u mad bro?

#74 Mirionx

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 02:21 PM

Maybe rogues can stop complaining about mobility and take step then to fix the mobility issue (=

#75 djp771133

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 03:08 PM

View PostBigpapapump, on 03 May 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

So spamming stuns on everyone eh? Lets say they use shd which is an 8 second ability. You cheap shot 3 people (costing you 120 out of 130 total energy and using 3 of those 8 seconds). You regenerate 10-11 energy per second + 8 / 2s via SnD so timed perfect you get around 140 energy regained during the shadow dance. Follow me still? I know logic is uncommon to mouthbreathers, so I can slow down for you. So 3 seconds into my dance, I have 5 seconds left -- I've used 120 energy to cs your whole team, and regained approximately 56 energy so Im hovering around 65 energy right now. I have 5 seconds to perform this supposedly swifty 1 shot-esque burst, so lets do a best cast scenario (assuming just shd though because people seem to think SHD is all of rogue's burst). So lets assume that I cs'd the 2 other people first, before cs'ing the kill target (that hopefully has a bleed up to account for the 10% damage). I Cs the kill target with premed (4 cp, we'll say someone else crit so I have 5) for an evis which costs a net of 10 energy to use. Then what, maybe 2 ambushes total if I get lucky with perfect energy management (at 60 energy a piece) into another evis. But CS lasts 5 seconds, 1 for premed, 1 for evis, 1 for each ambush and the 5th for a 2nd evis if I have perfect timing, none of your partners use any cds, no one has any stun breakers. Man, its a good thing to know that if I play perfectly I can cs your whole team and tear through 40% of his health with my supposed amazing burst, and assuming of course that no one has any cds, stun breaker or has the cognitive abilities to use any kind of cc or cd's when the rogue first pops shadow dance. Thanks for that enlightening post.

Edit -- Oh and this is assuming hes not using a retarded PvE Trinket that procs 65% bonus agility because that is its own problem not an inherent rogue class imbalance.
And edited for typo --

"varellol, on 03 May 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

ambush energie cost is reduced by 20 while dancing and rupture gives 20% bonusdmg not 10%"

Good point, forgot the 20 energy and meant 20% but typos suck. So after the premed evis Im sitting at 55 energy (assuming someone crit or 4cp triggered the 25+ elsewise Im at 35. So 55 energy, I get one ambush then have to wait approximately 1.6 seconds to get another one, which means you still are hardpressed to get a second evis off before the cs ends.

So you can only get 1 80-100k evis instead of 2, what a tragedy...

#76 Ayume

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 03:56 PM

I'm personally fine with CnD being nerfed as it was pretty faceroll, however, nerfing find weakness and cnd while buffing every other class is going to put rogues much further down the totem pole than people realize.

Rogues are going to need some sustain damage buffs before this PTR ends if nerfs like these keep coming. I would prefer not to be forced into 5.1 rogue again.

edit: Faerie fire is an outdated ability that should be looked at, seems incredibly griefy considering the current state of the game. It's essentially pre nerf mind numbing for rogues that has a 40 yard range and 40 second duration.

Edited by Ayume, 03 May 2013 - 04:09 PM.

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#77 Conviqx

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:08 PM

View PostAyume, on 03 May 2013 - 03:56 PM, said:

Faerie fire is an outdated ability that should be looked at, seems incredibly griefy considering the current state of the game. It's essentially pre nerf mind numbing for rogues that has a 40 yard range.

0cd spell massive range + dispell has cd + 45s duration so much fun

if dispell didnt have a cd it would be somewhat fine, but yeah
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#78 Shiqra

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:16 PM

Now buff Shs to 18-20 Sec CD with Rootbreak and buff maybe burst of speed (mobility is really shit)
Buff Hemo / Backstab
Nerf / remove Mind Numbing
Bring back 70% slow with Shiv (without cripp or change bonus)

Edited by Shiqra, 03 May 2013 - 04:19 PM.


#79 AndrewB

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:18 PM

View Postvarellol, on 03 May 2013 - 11:19 AM, said:

maybe with berserk buff , pve trinket up, pvp proc trinket and ingigloves.

Watchmeblink got evisc'd for 166k today on his stream lol...

#80 Elorxo

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Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:20 PM

View PostAndrewB, on 03 May 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

Watchmeblink got evisc'd for 166k today on his stream lol...

doesn't he play with like no resilience?
rogue must have been stacking pvp power etc. i'm human fully geared and i've never crit higher than 120k eviscs and that was when the retarded pve trinket was around. the highest i crit now is 100-110k with evisc

still waiting for these long needed dk nerfs and hunter 50000 trinkets per game nerf

Edited by Elorxo, 03 May 2013 - 04:24 PM.





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