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Random esoteric discussion about syke's moderation policy


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#21 Breadstick

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:29 AM

View PostReliuna, on 18 April 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

wanna link me ur moderator guidelines for when things are "a one time thing"?

nah it's pretty much a common sense thing
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#22 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:36 AM

View PostBreadstick, on 18 April 2013 - 03:29 AM, said:

nah it's pretty much a common sense thing

I edited my last post to explain why I don't even accept that. I didn't break any rules.


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#23 Breadstick

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:37 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:36 AM, said:

I edited my last post to explain why I don't even accept that. I didn't break any rules.

i meant it was common sense that it'd be a one time thing
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#24 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:40 AM

View PostBreadstick, on 18 April 2013 - 03:37 AM, said:

i meant it was common sense that it'd be a one time thing

Why was it even a one time thing, this just means that after this infraction today we're all giving Syke the go ahead to pick and choose posts he doesn't like. My post didn't violate the rules, I just read them over and even quoted parts of the rules which were violated.

You guys are Moderators because you are entrusted to be fair and unbiased. You can't infract a person because they told a joke you didn't laugh at.


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#25 Breadstick

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:44 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:40 AM, said:

Why was it even a one time thing, this just means that after this infraction today we're all giving Syke the go ahead to pick and choose posts he doesn't like. My post didn't violate the rules, I just read them over and even quoted parts of the rules which were violated.

You guys are Moderators because you are entrusted to be fair and unbiased. You can't infract a person because they told a joke you didn't laugh at.

i'm not really commenting on that part, just that i wouldn't expect it to happen again based on OT's history of being fairly unmoderated
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#26 Duckers

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:05 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:40 AM, said:

after this infraction today we're all giving Syke the go ahead to pick and choose posts he doesn't like. My post didn't violate the rules, I just read them over and even quoted parts of the rules which were violated.
The rules aren't really stone set "this is what's wrong and only what's wrong," and are typically a simple guideline to follow. Obvious rulebreaks are obviously handled as such, but often it's left to the moderators discretion.

It's not my place to say whether you or Syke is right. I probably would've just edited it out and left it at that. But if a mod feels it's infraction worthy, it's their call. It's not really a huge deal considering a warning is simply just that - and the odd arguable call doesn't really matter in the long run.

This is a bit of a fuss over something minor, but shrug. You have every right as a user to contact an admin and have it reviewed if you feel like it went the wrong way.

#27 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:06 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:24 AM, said:

I know it's nothing serious, it's more that I'm upset that Syke would infract me for expressing myself in a way he didn't approve of. I didn't break any rules.

I love this forum and I really did like the Moderation. Having you as a Moderator is great because you keep a level head and don't get upset at every post you deem trivial or inappropriate. I enjoyed Syke's posts before he got promoted and he was honestly one of my favorite posters behind you and that's about it. Now, no. I have literally nothing against Syke personally and I support him being a Moderator but jesus man, what happened?

I just want to forget this whole thing ever happened and let AJ be what it used to be. Get off your high horse and let other people have fun. I understand you guys are all good friends and most of AJOT's content is carryover from private Skype conversations but that doesn't mean that AJ is yours to control because things don't match the mood you intend.

Yeah dude.  I'm on a high horse because I moderated one thread in almost a year.  One thread in one year.  "High horse, power trip, abuse, etc." Get your shit together.  If acting on a joke in poor taste one time in one year constitutes the usage of the aforementioned words then you might wanna lower your threshold for what bothers you or life is gonna be real rough for you.  Let me reiterate since you keep throwing things out like "you don't get upset at every post you deem trivial or inappropriate."  Really take the time to read what I'm saying.  Think about it.  I don't moderate posts I disagree with, ones I find trivial or inappropriate.  That's the thing.  You're literally just saying shit without facts, without examples, without any attempt to back up what you're saying.  You're attacking my character (which I honestly don't give a shit about but it's worth saying to convey a point to you) based on what?  Because you're upset you received an infraction and your post was hidden?  One time?  Then you go on to assume that because one thing happened in one year this is some predecessor to the downfall of a "fun and carefree OT" and the birth of a "no fun allowed OT" -- It is absolutely ridiculous.  From a statistical significance point of view, this wouldn't register in the timeline of my modship.

My posts/personality didn't change on this forum; the user base changed.  That's not because of my behavior, people come and go all the time.  People came and went before me, and should AJ remain around once I leave, people will continue to come and go.  Sarzith, Iosys, Cutie, etc were way before "my time."  Other users have emerged since I've been around.  A forum user base will always come and go and paradigms will shift.  That being said, the current user base happens to be a lot of the people I talk to, nearly every day in Skype.  My posts might change relative to that, at most.  My post towards Raux and Kelustu are going to be different than my posts towards people I talk to everyday (considering I didn't get on Raux/Kelustu).  You don't see everything (though you'd like to pretend you do given the content of your posts); you don't see a lot of things I say (that I used? to) because they go to Skype chat and subsequently I don't care enough to repeat a lot of the shit I say in Skype chat to this forum considering its user base.  It's redundant and I don't care enough to do it at this point; I've got other ways I prefer to spend my time.

Again, all of that is based off your narrow, tunneled perception.  You're not taking the time to back up, and look at a bigger picture.  If you did, you might feel differently.  It's human nature to focus (and overly focus at that) on negative shit.  If you took the time to go through my posting history (why would you? who actually cares?) you'd see I still have a serious argument now and then, still give people shit and still post stupid shit.  I also post more infrequently than I used to, so again the negative weighs heavier in your mind.


View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:24 AM, said:

I don't want it to be Moderated that way, you don't have to delete a post just because you don't like its content personally. I support deleting posts which are overtly trolling but then we'd have a lot of members banned. Why does treeqt get away with "fuck off" every single time someone new posts?

I didn't break a rule and I don't think it was right of you to infract me, that's all. I don't want to keep this conversation going, let's just be men about it and remove it and forget the whole thing happened. You and I both know that if I went to the Adminstrators of this site about how much is let slide here we'd basically end up without an AJOT because you'd see more intervention on the part of people who actually want people to visit this site. AJOT has ads, AJOT makes Curse money.

Let's just drop it and forget this entire thing happened. Delete the thread, delete my posts, I don't care. I've got screenshots of it all anyway just in case you decide to ban me for speaking up.

Big thing.  Why does he get away with "fuck off"?  CONTEXT.  Context is everything.  CONTEXT.  You think him posting "fuck off" to Baklivax posting a "gym slut" in the hottest girl thread is even remotely comparable to what I infracted you for here? Really, that's your example?  That's analogous to like sitting in a classroom while a guest speaker gives a presentation and you talking to your friends mid presentation and getting in trouble and then being annoyed you got in trouble for that when you talk to your friends loudly while the class settles in 5 minutes before lecture.  The action might be the same but the context isn't.

You know why he gets away with it.  I already responded to that.  You acknowledged it.  OT is largely not moderated and free forum.  You're getting bent out of shape and sending me long ass replies because 1 thing happened, in almost 1 year.  And that's including the ENTIRE user base.  Good grief, are you high?  You think I'm out to attack you or something? Like I've got some fuckin' vendetta against you? Get real dude.  You've got screenshots "of it all" in case I decide to ban you for speaking up.  For fucks sake.  The last 2 sentences in your post should speak volumes about how little you know about me, how little you pay attention to how I moderate OT and/or the content of my posts.  Again you're literally just attacking my character without any real examples, facts, cases, ANYTHING.  What the hell is the point of this?  So you can say yours, and I can say mine and then we'll just let people (or ourselves) decide whose word was right based on nothing at all?  At least I can factually sit here and say that I don't go around deleting shit I disagree with on a regular basis and the discussions/disagreements I have with people back that up, time and time again.

--

And you can drop the whole, "it wasn't against the rules."  The site rules were written in a manner with which moderators/administrators are given leeway to carry out action based on subjective terms.  Since you wanted to quote the site rules, I'll do you one better and include the part you left out.

Quote

Site Rules

These rules are simple. Be helpful and informative and don't be a jackass. Since that is subjective though, here is explicitly what is forbidden.


The shit you list afterwards is just what's explicitly forbidden.  The rules are written to let moderators operate in a manner where some things are left up to interpretation.

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#28 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:08 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 03:40 AM, said:

Why was it even a one time thing, this just means that after this infraction today we're all giving Syke the go ahead to pick and choose posts he doesn't like. My post didn't violate the rules, I just read them over and even quoted parts of the rules which were violated.

You guys are Moderators because you are entrusted to be fair and unbiased. You can't infract a person because they told a joke you didn't laugh at.

It doesn't mean this at all.  You're exaggerating and speculating.  It's annoying, false and wrong.  It's not based on anything logical, at all.

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#29 Kelustu

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:11 AM

View PostVengeânce1296684277, on 16 April 2013 - 02:09 AM, said:

Do they have any idea who might've been involved yet?

No.

View PostSykeasaurus, on 18 April 2013 - 03:24 AM, said:

Hope you realize this thread and the infractions contained here within are like the only things I've moderated in OT in almost a year?  You're taking this way too seriously.  The one person who always backs this is Emmune.  Things were a lot worse when other moderators frequented OT.  I'm not gonna name names, but I'm sure Emmune would if he caught this thread.

And all that aside, you do realize OT isn't RR, right?  OT is supposed to be moderated like the rest of the website sans RR.  However, between the 2 moderators that frequently browse OT (myself and Breadstick) and the 1 who browses more infrequently relative to us 2 (Pharaun), the 3 of us generally let this forum flow freeform.

Kelustu used to make this argument up and no one really ever understood it (that's where Emmune "has my back", in those threads).

I've explained multiple times that I don't think you guys do enough.
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#30 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:12 AM

View PostDuckers, on 18 April 2013 - 04:05 AM, said:

The rules aren't really stone set "this is what's wrong and only what's wrong," and are typically a simple guideline to follow. Obvious rulebreaks are obviously handled as such, but often it's left to the moderators discretion.

It's not my place to say whether you or Syke is right. I probably would've just edited it out and left it at that. But if a mod feels it's infraction worthy, it's their call. It's not really a huge deal considering a warning is simply just that - and the odd arguable call doesn't really matter in the long run.

This is a bit of a fuss over something minor, but shrug. You have every right as a user to contact an admin and have it reviewed if you feel like it went the wrong way.

Yeah and yeah.  The first part is in the long winded, novel I wrote.  The 2nd part is typically true in any administration.

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#31 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:15 AM

View PostKelustu, on 18 April 2013 - 04:11 AM, said:

I've explained multiple times that I don't think you guys do enough.

What am I thinking of then?  I know it involves moderation and the "OT circlejerk" or something.  You used (I assume past tense) to think that I was gonna ban you because I was a mod and we don't always get on!

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#32 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:23 AM

I'm sorry I posted what I did since clearly it was out of place but you didn't have to infract me. I don't want to have to look at that stupid thing every time I log on AJ and remember "Oh hey, Syke didn't like what I posted so now I have an infraction level"

I don't break rules.

Why is it such a big deal to remove the infraction when even you say it's a drop in the bucket? I did nothing that is "explicitly" against the rules just like everyone else does things that aren't "explicitly" against the rules.

Also, if you feel that way about AJOT why not just keep it to Skype? You don't like people joining your clique, I understand that completely but you have to allow it when it's on a forum like this.

I really don't want to have a problem like this ever again, you know full well that I have a long track record of not trolling hence the reason that since I joined this website I have only received one infraction other than this. I accepted the first because I actually did break the rules and I was just generally an asshole. I saw the error in my ways and it has literally been years since that happened.

This is not that same case. I did nothing wrong in my opinion and in the future I will take more caution when I post something that doesn't match the mood of a thread but saying that I don't have the right to do so is like saying you can't talk to your friends while you're at the Zoo because it violates the zoological education you might otherwise receive from visiting the Zoo.

AJOT is not a lecture hall and we are not esteemed speakers, we swear and we all troll from time to time. I wasn't attacking anyone and ultimately all I did was tell a joke at the Zoo when a lion killed a zebra. Don't kick me out of the Zoo just because I don't cry over a zebra. I am still upset about the bombing but I have enough of a handle of myself to understand how much is too much for the forum and I thought I was safe to post something less serious.


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#33 Matisse

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:27 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 04:23 AM, said:

I don't break rules.

...

since I joined this website I have only received one infraction other than this. I accepted the first because I actually did break the rules

Your sig is too big btw.

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View PostBreadstick, on 07 September 2012 - 03:32 AM, said:

some pickles are really good


#34 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:30 AM

View PostMatisse, on 18 April 2013 - 04:27 AM, said:

Your sig is too big btw.

I will change it then lol, I don't even like Hopsin anymore


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#35 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:36 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 04:23 AM, said:

I'm sorry I posted what I did since clearly it was out of place but you didn't have to infract me. I don't want to have to look at that stupid thing every time I log on AJ and remember "Oh hey, Syke didn't like what I posted so now I have an infraction level"

I don't break rules.

Why is it such a big deal to remove the infraction when even you say it's a drop in the bucket? I did nothing that is "explicitly" against the rules just like everyone else does things that aren't "explicitly" against the rules.

Also, if you feel that way about AJOT why not just keep it to Skype? You don't like people joining your clique, I understand that completely but you have to allow it when it's on a forum like this.

I really don't want to have a problem like this ever again, you know full well that I have a long track record of not trolling hence the reason that since I joined this website I have only received one infraction other than this. I accepted the first because I actually did break the rules and I was just generally an asshole. I saw the error in my ways and it has literally been years since that happened.

This is not that same case. I did nothing wrong in my opinion and in the future I will take more caution when I post something that doesn't match the mood of a thread but saying that I don't have the right to do so is like saying you can't talk to your friends while you're at the Zoo because it violates the zoological education you might otherwise receive from visiting the Zoo.

AJOT is not a lecture hall and we are not esteemed speakers, we swear and we all troll from time to time. I wasn't attacking anyone and ultimately all I did was tell a joke at the Zoo when a lion killed a zebra. Don't kick me out of the Zoo just because I don't cry over a zebra. I am still upset about the bombing but I have enough of a handle of myself to understand how much is too much for the forum and I thought I was safe to post something less serious.

Why do you even take it to that level?  What are you talking about?  Emmune, Kelustu, Raux, Reliuna (others) have all, jokingly or not, insulted me, gave me shit, whatever.  I don't care.  It's a forum and that's just bullshit between people.  If you don't have the awareness to realize that, "Hey maybe a pun about people's deaths and injuries REALLY SHORTLY after the incident isn't gonna be chill given the tone of the thread" then I don't know what to say.  I don't get why that's so mysterious.  Is the 1 action in ~1 year not sign enough that practically almost anything goes?  Why would you have that concern? Thats absurd.  You're being sensational.

Feel what way about AJOT?  That I don't wanna repeat myself to the people I was just talking to?  Did you read what I said?  I keep a lot of what I say to Skype but post the odd thing to OT now and then, mostly in the baseball, soccer, IRL pic threads.  

What...?  You're making things up, AGAIN, about me.  Can you stop?  Or are you just gonna keep making guesses about my character, have me discount them and keep going until you're satisfied?  10 people have been added to that Skype chat since I joined! It existed before me (Skype chat) and it would exist without me.  This is just all wrong.

You keep saying you didn't break the rules, but myself, Duckers and maybe Breadstick have pointed out that the rules are not set in stone.  I even quoted you that.  Again if you can't tell the context of a thread (especially given Vexo's OP, as Pharaun pointed out), then I can't help you there; you're gonna have to be smart enough to realize that some things probably are better left unsaid.

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#36 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:46 AM

View PostSykeasaurus, on 18 April 2013 - 04:36 AM, said:

Why do you even take it to that level?  What are you talking about?  Emmune, Kelustu, Raux, Reliuna (others) have all, jokingly or not, insulted me, gave me shit, whatever.  I don't care.  It's a forum and that's just bullshit between people.  If you don't have the awareness to realize that, "Hey maybe a pun about people's deaths and injuries REALLY SHORTLY after the incident isn't gonna be chill given the tone of the thread" then I don't know what to say.  I don't get why that's so mysterious.  Is the 1 action in ~1 year not sign enough that practically almost anything goes?  Why would you have that concern? Thats absurd.  You're being sensational.

Feel what way about AJOT?  That I don't wanna repeat myself to the people I was just talking to?  Did you read what I said?  I keep a lot of what I say to Skype but post the odd thing to OT now and then, mostly in the baseball, soccer, IRL pic threads.  

What...?  You're making things up, AGAIN, about me.  Can you stop?  Or are you just gonna keep making guesses about my character, have me discount them and keep going until you're satisfied?  10 people have been added to that Skype chat since I joined! It existed before me (Skype chat) and it would exist without me.  This is just all wrong.

You keep saying you didn't break the rules, but myself, Duckers and maybe Breadstick have pointed out that the rules are not set in stone.  I even quoted you that.  Again if you can't tell the context of a thread (especially given Vexo's OP, as Pharaun pointed out), then I can't help you there; you're gonna have to be smart enough to realize that some things probably are better left unsaid.

Read my last post. I was personally affected by the incident and I wanted to make a joke. You're just being a jerk because you don't want to admit you were AT ALL in the wrong. I'd be happy with an apology even but you clearly don't want to grace me with even that iota of respect.

I am still upset about the bombings and you're only making things worse for me. I won't let you shit on my feelings like that, I have a right to express myself and if joking about something that could have have cost the life of someone I held near and dear makes you upset then so be it. I was joking to make light of the seriousness and grave nature of what happened because the last thing we need is more dark shit going on after all of the shootings and shit happening.


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#37 Sykeasaurus

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:49 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 04:30 AM, said:

My exgirlfriend works as a CVS pharmacist, she happened to be home for the weekend because she went to see her sister in New York nearby where I live instead of being in Boston. She probably would have volunteered to help hand out water or something if not for that and might have been one of the hundreds injured by that twisted and sadistic bastard that set those bombs.

Yea those situations are always surreal thinking, "wow I could've died/been seriously injured."  Feel like I read a few of 'em when 9/11 happened.  Some people breaking their normal routine for a really random reason and not ending up on the planes that day, etc.  It's scary a bit

bk said:

I used to beat off alot, and fail all my classes


Insight said:

I figured he's a phony but I was secretly hoping to get pounded by someone famous.

View PostTw1zle, on 07 August 2011 - 11:05 PM, said:

i wasnt aware that america was a country

i guess we learn things every day

#38 Matisse

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:54 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 04:46 AM, said:

Read my last post. I was personally affected by the incident and I wanted to make a joke. You're just being a jerk because you don't want to admit you were AT ALL in the wrong. I'd be happy with an apology even but you clearly don't want to grace me with even that iota of respect.

I am still upset about the bombings and you're only making things worse for me. I won't let you shit on my feelings like that, I have a right to express myself and if joking about something that could have have cost the life of someone I held near and dear makes you upset then so be it. I was joking to make light of the seriousness and grave nature of what happened because the last thing we need is more dark shit going on after all of the shootings and shit happening.

Not to get too in the middle of things here, but demanding respect after making all those baseless claims is a bit contradictory. Also, while you're welcome to express your feelings, keep in mind the context/mood -- do you think that there were people who may not find humor in the situation and your joke? Would you have gone up to anyone who was there that afternoon and said "yeah that race was a blast!!"?

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View PostBreadstick, on 07 September 2012 - 03:32 AM, said:

some pickles are really good


#39 stcolbert

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 05:05 AM

View Postbareblar03, on 18 April 2013 - 02:12 AM, said:

I don't agree with it. I don't think you should infract a person for expressing themselves in the way that they see fit. I was fuming about what happened and I still am. You infracted me for choosing to make light of the situation instead of crying about it.

You can't infract a person for dealing with anger differently because TBH some of the shit you post is banworthy too. The only difference is, you're a Moderator, I'm not. I'm not saying you're abusing your power but please, don't get yourself in a tizzy because someone told a joke when you felt it was inappropriate. You're a Moderator, you don't decide who does what and how we live our lives.

Why isn't Reliuna banned for not understanding why I'm upset? That upsets me, get your infraction stick out and infract him as well for not being as serious as the thread "should be"

also, I don't mind Reliuna. Don't actually ban Reliuna.

[size=4]

You weren't even here when my original post was up and you're quoting it as though that's what I'm referring to. Syke deleted my original post in which I said "You might say they had an explosive finish" because I thought of a quip while I was at the keyboard. I then proceeded to say that despite my hate for Boston I still feel for everyone injured in my own unique way. I don't want to have to spell out every word for you to not get offended but I wasn't even close to trolling.

Also, yes, I'm this serious about this infraction. I want it removed. You want to ban me? Go ahead, I'll screenshot these posts and talk to an Administrator about how you banned me for literally only just what I have said. Expressing myself in a way different than you tolerated in your mindset at the time.
Go have a fucking cry, faggot.

Syke, don't let one of your last redeeming qualities go to shit.

#40 bareblar03

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 05:05 AM

View PostMatisse, on 18 April 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

Not to get too in the middle of things here, but demanding respect after making all those baseless claims is a bit contradictory. Also, while you're welcome to express your feelings, keep in mind the context/mood -- do you think that there were people who may not find humor in the situation and your joke? Would you have gone up to anyone who was there that afternoon and said "yeah that race was a blast!!"?

Point taken. I never said I was right for joking but don't infract me, just remove the post. I get the message either way without an infraction and Syke refusing to remove it is just causing me more heartache on top of the fact that this prompted me to send a really heartfelt text to Courtney to say how glad I am that she's okay. Yeah, I'm a fucking asshole for being upset and wanting to joke about it but an infraction? Are you joking?

I don't care that it's 10% or whatever, it is the principle that counts that I was Syke's first infraction in a year with SO MUCH FUCKING TROLLING IT WOULD MAKE YOUR EYES BLEED on this forum every single day for expressing myself differently. I wasn't acting like an asshole to get people riled up, I was joking around to maybe even cheer someone up - namely MYSELF.




View Poststcolbert, on 18 April 2013 - 05:05 AM, said:

Go have a fucking cry, faggot.

Syke, don't let one of your last redeeming qualities go to shit.

I can't imagine a better example.

I'm not some kid from another country that thinks it's funny when Americans die, I'm an American who was absolutely terrified at the thought of people I knew dying and I feel lucky that no one close to me was killed or injured. I gave my condolences to the victims and those that were actually affected.

Edited by bareblar03, 18 April 2013 - 05:08 AM.


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