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CC in arenas


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#21

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 08:39 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 08:19 PM, said:

Since MoP there has been an increase in cc, simply because every class gets new spells each addon and the new talent tree also provide cc options. Also in Wotlk there was a cd on dispell, making sheep and fear weaker.

Also that doesnt mean it cant be changed now.
stop talking generally and say which have been added, psyfiend which no1 ever kills?oh ye that.The only cc im thinking about is the hunter pets , but even in wrath they had the crabs that could immobilize u .+ in wrath some healers didnt even have dispel , just to remind u .so what u basically saying about the dispell system counts only for hpalas and discs priest , cuz rest healers didnt have a dispel back then ( atleast not magical)

#22 Enim

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 08:54 PM

Too many different CC isn't REALLY the issue, even though id agree on removing last DR and possibly adding 2-5 seconds to DR timer.

CC in general is fine by me. But when a pet fears me even though I LOS or if some random meleecleave just overwrites stuns and silences it's frustrating. I'd like to see most of the instant CC removed. Most of the stuns would have to stay, but lowering the duration of for example hammer of justice from 6 to 4-5 seconds. Removing Psyfiend would also be a clever move.

Possibly some kind of penalty of using too many ccs in a short period of time so you can't just pop everything you got completely random and at the same time as your partner and still get away with it. Possibly a buff to DR so that when you get immune to one DR you get a 50% reduction on the next cc timer within 2-8 seconds.

Edited by Enim, 18 April 2013 - 08:55 PM.


#23 Conviqx

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 08:56 PM

When is psyfiend gonna be fixed so that when i vanish or stealth the thing actually can't target me in stealth and fear me, happends with every stealth in the game
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#24

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 08:58 PM

the only thing they should do about ccs is to break instantly from fears when getting dmged

#25 Pawzz

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:03 PM

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 April 2013 - 08:39 PM, said:

stop talking generally and say which have been added, psyfiend which no1 ever kills?oh ye that.The only cc im thinking about is the hunter pets , but even in wrath they had the crabs that could immobilize u .+ in wrath some healers didnt even have dispel , just to remind u .so what u basically saying about the dispell system counts only for hpalas and discs priest , cuz rest healers didnt have a dispel back then ( atleast not magical)
Shaman totem, Bash on resto druids and boomkin, Silencing Shot on BM hunters, Paralytic Poison, PoM Poly on all Mages, Rep and Blinding Light on Holy Palas, Shockwave on Arms Warrior, Asphyxiate on DKs and Monks.
Just a few I can think of that have been added since Cata.

#26

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:18 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

Shaman totem, Bash on resto druids and boomkin, Silencing Shot on BM hunters, Paralytic Poison, PoM Poly on all Mages, Rep and Blinding Light on Holy Palas, Shockwave on Arms Warrior, Asphyxiate on DKs and Monks.
Just a few I can think of that have been added since Cata.
half of those u said had these spells since cata.

#27 Pawzz

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:20 PM

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 April 2013 - 09:18 PM, said:

half of those u said had these spells since cata.
Im pretty sure thats not true, but that isnt even the point of the topic.

#28 Hackattack3

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:26 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

Shaman totem, Bash on resto druids and boomkin, Silencing Shot on BM hunters, Paralytic Poison, PoM Poly on all Mages, Rep and Blinding Light on Holy Palas, Shockwave on Arms Warrior, Asphyxiate on DKs and Monks.
Just a few I can think of that have been added since Cata.

Druids have had bash, roots, and cyclone since TBC.  It was removed from a baseline bear form ability with introduction of MOP.  Just from a healer perspective it almost feels like resto druids LOST cc because all other healers gained cc with MOP.

Druids - no change, still have cyclone, roots and need to spec into bash.  Some resto druids spec bash, others spec disorient so they can actually get a cyclone off.  Boomers do not spec bash b/c they like to beam + vortex.

Shammys - +stun totem added in MOP

Priests - +psyfiend added MOP

Pallys - +blind +repent

#29

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:29 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

Im pretty sure thats not true, but that isnt even the point of the topic.
it is the point of the topic wtf u talking about. U saying to remove so much cc from game while almost all have been since wrath. I only recall asphyxiate which if im right is getting replaced by strang, which is basically the same, while that paralyse thing that monks have ok its a new class it needs to have smthing. What else , shockwave.In cata wars had throwdown so its similar.What else mmm....pom poly, mages had that whole tbc and wrath and now u find the time to qq about it,.What else mmm.........resto druids and boomkins had the bash since when?always.They just had to swap forms in order to do that which became an outdated mechanic.
The only ccs i can atleast think of that have been added is bliding light or w/e its pronounced ,paralyse and paralytic poison(which no1 uses cuz mind numbing is 100 times better).

#30 Redboww

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:35 PM

They should remove anything that changes your position, or make it keep you still. There should be no knockbacks, no deathgrip,  in the game and fear should keep you still. At least without these mechanics, you can keep good position and avoid much CC. As soon as you get feared into the open, all hell breaks loose. Players should be able to maintain a position of their choosing. That wouldn't completely fix everything but it would certainly help.

PS, remove BM please. ty blizz

#31 Pawzz

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:39 PM

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 April 2013 - 09:29 PM, said:

it is the point of the topic wtf u talking about. U saying to remove so much cc from game while almost all have been since wrath. I only recall asphyxiate which if im right is getting replaced by strang, which is basically the same, while that paralyse thing that monks have ok its a new class it needs to have smthing. What else , shockwave.In cata wars had throwdown so its similar.What else mmm....pom poly, mages had that whole tbc and wrath and now u find the time to qq about it,.What else mmm.........resto druids and boomkins had the bash since when?always.They just had to swap forms in order to do that which became an outdated mechanic.
The only ccs i can atleast think of that have been added is bliding light or w/e its pronounced ,paralyse and paralytic poison(which no1 uses cuz mind numbing is 100 times better).
Its so hard to read your posts...

Asphyxiat is on a short cd than strang
Blinding light and rep are new
Shockwave is on a short cd than throwdown (or atleast was last season)
etc etc
But like I said that isnt even the topic, I didnt ask if there was more cc than in wotlk or cata. Is there too much NOW.


Im not qqing about anything, I dont see why you are so upset. Since you are attacking me, you find that cc in arenas atm are ok? Explain your pov and dont on criticise other peoples opinions,

#32 Pawzz

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:45 PM

View PostRedboww, on 18 April 2013 - 09:35 PM, said:

They should remove anything that changes your position, or make it keep you still. There should be no knockbacks, no deathgrip,  in the game and fear should keep you still. At least without these mechanics, you can keep good position and avoid much CC. As soon as you get feared into the open, all hell breaks loose. Players should be able to maintain a position of their choosing. That wouldn't completely fix everything but it would certainly help.

PS, remove BM please. ty blizz
This is also a good point.
The amount of knockbacks has also increased. But Blizzard said they will change the arena maps accordingly afaik.

#33 averuki

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 09:53 PM

I don't mind CC as long as it's not instant so can be interrupted/lined

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:03 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 09:39 PM, said:

Its so hard to read your posts...

Asphyxiat is on a short cd than strang
Blinding light and rep are new
Shockwave is on a short cd than throwdown (or atleast was last season)
etc etc
But like I said that isnt even the topic, I didnt ask if there was more cc than in wotlk or cata. Is there too much NOW.


Im not qqing about anything, I dont see why you are so upset. Since you are attacking me, you find that cc in arenas atm are ok? Explain your pov and dont on criticise other peoples opinions,
im not angry im just having a convertation which i thought u also did.Lets make a list from which new ccs each class has gotten.
Paladins:
retri:repetance got nerfed cuz its castable or more like talent.
holy:got repetance and bliding light.
Shamans:
they got capacitor totem.
Priests:
they got psyfiend which can get 1 shotted but nobody kills it for some weird reason.
Mages:
Got pom which was in game for 2 whole expansions.
Locks:
They actually got nerfed on their ccs since they have to choose between howl and coil.W
Wars:
The throwdown got replaced by shockwave which is similar,
Rogues:
They got paralytic which no1 uses.
Druids:
They have the same cc if not nerfed cuz of the cd of cyclone.
Hunters:
The extra cc they got is the pet cc which was similar back in cata or wrath.
Dks:
Got asphyxiate instead of strangulate.
In my opinion the cc isnt too much because of the amount of things that every single  class has to get out of it.What is needed to be nerfed/removed is the knockback from arenas and the kill shots(thats what pisses me off the most.Kill shots r the worst mechanic in pvp and should'nt exist.Its like ur 20% of ur hp is basically gone cuz u die insta vs dks or locks .

#35 Synkz

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:34 PM

I think if Blizzard wants to change something about CC in PvP at this point in the expansion, it would be to mess with Diminishing Returns.  DRs have no effect on PvE (correct me if I'm wrong), so they could adjust them completely based on PvP.


Also, fuck knockbacks.

Edited by Synkz, 18 April 2013 - 10:35 PM.


#36 Flabbert

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:00 PM

View PostPawzz, on 18 April 2013 - 08:05 PM, said:

I think the cause of the whole CC dilemma is the simultaneous introduction of CD on dispell aswell as the homogenization of the talent trees.
Every hunter can have Silencing Shot, every lock can have SF or Howl, every Pala can have rep, every Druid can have Bash, resulting in more cc across the board + less possible dispells.

I think this guy is closest to the whole problem. Every spec has acces to cc's wich were bound to certain specs in the past.
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#37 hekumzx

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:30 PM

Am I the only healer who doesn't want to be CC'd less?  I mean, the game is based around damage and CC.  Healing wouldn't feel the same with too many nerfs.  As a healer there are three things that make healing completely boring and retarded.

-  First, and this may be personal, being CC'd by something that isn't CC.  In wrath this was thunderstorm.  Really fucking annoying to be interrupted or knocked separate of teammates.  You deal with it because ele functions around it.  Being gripped on a cast, annoying as shit.  Now DKs get two grips like a christmas fucking yam.  In MOP hunters can fucking knockback trap every 30 seconds.  It is the most retarded fucking concept ever introduced to a class with an already abundant amount of CC.

-  Two, the introduction of healer CC in a mass fucking abundance.  Druids used to have to put themselves out of position to get CC for example.  Now bash is instant and castable in all forms and NS doesn't have form requirement.  Priests used to have a fear mechanic that put them out of position.  Now they have psyfiend that tunnels fears into you like neilyos god damned dad.  And can run into you and place an undispellable root on your entire team in a poor position.  Or just you out of LOS, paramount to a fear.  Palas can run at you and repent out of CC, hoj, aoe blind you and repent you again.  Now this has nothing to do with class balance so don't bitch about paladins, just like Shaman still have hex and pretty much gained no new CC.  Capacitor is as far as I can think the most garbo CC in the game as you can kill the CC lol, and you have to expend atleast one talent point and a glyph to even come close to landing it.  I don't give a shit if shamans have CC outside of hex or not, just saying.

-  Lastly, a class having infinity fucking CC and infinity burst.  Hunter is really alone in the fact that it can literally prep every fucking cooldown and use every offensive spell again in conjunction with all of it's CC.  Imagine if snap still gave you a second deep, a new POM for poly and another orb.  This is paramount to hunter right now.  Imagine if warrior could fear you pop swifty and then fear the healer again at the end of reck, saving any stuns and gap closers for the kill target.

Sorry I typed so much shit, most people won't read it anyway lol, that's cool.  This isn't a class balance rant, this isn't some nonsensical bullshit.  In Cata the most annoying shit was the introduction of monkey blind and impact.  Do you remember healing when hunters would pop every CD in the first 20 seconds?  Literally you would get doubled silence scatter trapped by some thug cleaves.  Remember when mages had deep/cs/impact/impact/impact randomly on your heals?

CC is part of healing, long CC chain promotes better teams to be higher rated in their ability to choose when to over extend but also in their ability to deal with 2v3 situations.  But comps should face the risk vs reward scenario of CC similar to WOTLK and even somewhat similar to Cata.  Watch some streams or play some decent teams, you see shamans running at you to hex like druids and priests run at you?  I guess giving a healer a blink, an iceblock, a vanish and a couple sprints makes dog form feel a little outdated.

Edited by Hektiik, 18 April 2013 - 11:32 PM.

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#38 Snuggli

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:51 PM

View PostHektiik, on 18 April 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

-snip-

Actually a really good post. I don't know about other healers, but i'd much rather face a perfectly played MLD who CC me for close to a minute to score a kill than a thugcleave who kill someone in a silencing shot duration.

CC isn't the problem; completely braindead burst, pve proc trinkets and 1shot macros are the problem.

View PostBraindance, on 11 October 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Go listen to some Bieber shit and leave me alone fucko.

#39 Pawzz

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 12:23 AM

View PostHektiik, on 18 April 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

longpost is long

Ye I agree with you on most points,

#40 samuser1234

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 12:36 AM

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 April 2013 - 10:03 PM, said:

Druids:
They have the same cc if not nerfed cuz of the cd of cyclone..
except for you know...  typhoon and the stupid roar that disorients,



Also... Why the hell is faerie fire still 40 seconds with no CD when dispel CDs at 8 seconds
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