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#21 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:00 AM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

its only me that think that hunter dispel's are too good?

Yes. It also has a lot to do with BM having huge focus returns from pets, lower focus costs during Bestial Wrath, and just a lower average focus cost of abilities in general when compared to MM or Survival.

If you play against a MM hunter, they aren't going to have the focus to just spam dispel.

#22

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:12 AM

View PostKettu, on 17 February 2013 - 10:12 PM, said:

You should've added a clip where powershot would've actually critted : P

Next patch will be dumb if blizzard doesn't reduce powershot damage.

Posted Image

Posted Image
(screenshots are without skull banner / tricks of trade)


AND they said frostbomb was OP xD?

#23 dionim

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:18 AM

View PostNitric, on 18 February 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:

Yes. It also has a lot to do with BM having huge focus returns from pets, lower focus costs during Bestial Wrath, and just a lower average focus cost of abilities in general when compared to MM or Survival.

If you play against a MM hunter, they aren't going to have the focus to just spam dispel.

as a disc priest it ofc hurts me alot more than other healers, and my bg is full of kfcs (thats my win/loss ratio is bad and we still have 2200+ as ret disc war)

but what i saw was, hunter spamming shots like a ak47 even when my buffs were already gone, also how it is soo  amazing together with BM, the hunter is doing nothing but traping/dispeling and my partner are already at 60%~ hp without tanking any damaging shot from the hunter.

hunter cc is very good but was always there, what pisses me off is that they dont even lose damage while cc'ing anymore =\
bm with all those tools ruined hunter class imo, they should bring back mm/surv for pvp =\

edit. sry for off topic

Edited by dionim, 18 February 2013 - 01:05 PM.


#24 Mindsmoothie

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 12:00 PM

Imagine the damage with this http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=96409

#25 Jacquelol

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 01:02 PM

This makes me wnna play my hunter again =)
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Shout out too Hyuru the most amazing, friendly and nice person ive met on AJ
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#26 Mirionx

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 01:51 PM

View PostZerlog, on 18 February 2013 - 11:12 AM, said:

AND they said frostbomb was OP xD?

Well, it was (sun)

#27 Shadowtiger

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 02:16 PM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 11:18 AM, said:

as a disc priest it ofc hurts me alot more than other healers, and my bg is full of kfcs (thats my win/loss ratio is bad and we still have 2200+ as ret disc war)

but what i saw was, hunter spamming shots like a ak47 even when my buffs were already gone, also how it is soo  amazing together with BM, the hunter is doing nothing but traping/dispeling and my partner are already at 60%~ hp without tanking any damaging shot from the hunter.

hunter cc is very good but was always there, what pisses me off is that they dont even lose damage while cc'ing anymore =\
bm with all those tools ruined hunter class imo, they should bring back mm/surv for pvp =\

edit. sry for off topic


Fun fact, we want MM/surv back as much as everyone else.... There simply is no point in going it atm since 1 min CD trinket (+ readiness on it) is too good to give up.

#28 Kettu

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 02:37 PM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 11:18 AM, said:

but what i saw was, hunter spamming shots like a ak47 even when my buffs were already gone, also how it is soo  amazing together with BM, the hunter is doing nothing but traping/dispeling and my partner are already at 60%~ hp without tanking any damaging shot from the hunter.
Posted Image

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 11:18 AM, said:

hunter cc is very good but was always there, what pisses me off is that they dont even lose damage while cc'ing anymore =\
Could you please clarify how hunter cc has changed recently as you are implying it used to lower the hunter's damage before, but doesn't anymore?

#29 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:25 PM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 11:18 AM, said:

as a disc priest it ofc hurts me alot more than other healers, and my bg is full of kfcs (thats my win/loss ratio is bad and we still have 2200+ as ret disc war)

hunter cc is very good but was always there, what pisses me off is that they dont even lose damage while cc'ing anymore =\

The only CC that has really changed is the addition of the Shale Spider's/Crane's non-casted CC (vs. the old Monkey blind that had a .5? second cast). We lose the same amount of damage as everyone else, arguably more if we have to use Scatter to trap (another global).

A lot of the problem with KFC is the amount of pressure a warrior can do. Hunter's just mesh well with warriors (what doesn't mesh well with warriors right now?). A lot of people complain about hunter CC, but it hasn't changed much over the past 6 years (aside from the addition of Trap Launcher and pet abilities).

Scatter - 4s disorient, breaks on damage. 30s CD. On the GCD.
Trap - 8 second incapacitate, breaks on damage. 28s CD w/ glove bonus. On the GCD.
Silencing Shot - 4 second blanket silence, 20s CD. NOT on the GCD.
Shale Spider (Crane) - 3 second stun (4 second sleep), 31.5s CD (42s CD / breaks on damage). NOT on the GCD.

I guess I'm biased though, but when I compare hunter CC to mage CC, it seems pretty even, yet I rarely see people complaining about mage CC. I'll probably get flamed for this, but oh well. The amount of CC that the game currently has is pretty ridiculous. I'd gladly trade some hunter CC for the removal of other class's CC as well.

Quote

the hunter is doing nothing but traping/dispeling and my partner are already at 60%~ hp without tanking any damaging shot from the hunter.

That's a problem with hunters? If the hunter is only CCing, your partners should be eating the CC. Traps are probably one of the easier CCs to stop.

Quote

bm with all those tools ruined hunter class imo, they should bring back mm/surv for pvp =\

I think every (good) hunter wants MM back. The BM playstyle is boring, but the utility that BM has over MM is astounding, so much that it isn't even really worth playing MM.

Edited by Nitric, 18 February 2013 - 04:30 PM.


#30 dionim

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:47 PM

View PostKettu, on 18 February 2013 - 02:37 PM, said:

Posted Image


Could you please clarify how hunter cc has changed recently as you are implying it used to lower the hunter's damage before, but doesn't anymore?

those new pet habilitys

mm you fuck up your positioning to cc, you lose 3 GCD doing ZERO DAMAGE
BM you dont really care about your positioning because you can always trinket (disengage rooting for 8 seconds and cant be dispel'd helps too) you still do 60% of your normal damage while you are spends those 3 gcds because your pet is still doing RWARRWARRRWARRR at somone, when you have stamped up you can probably almost kill someone when using those 3 gcds and would have done ZERO DAMAGE as MM.

#31 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:51 PM

You do realize that Stampede does pitiful damage, right? Most hunters don't even use it for damage, but rather to buff their teammates with pet buffs. And pet's auto attacks don't do 60% of our damage - a lot of pet damage comes from Kill Command and Blink Strike (both on the GCD).

#32 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:58 PM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:

those new pet habilitys

mm you fuck up your positioning to cc, you lose 2 GCD doing ~10% damage,
BM you dont really care about your positioning because you can always trinket  You always care about positioning, regardless of spec. (disengage rooting for 8 seconds and cant be dispel'd helps too. This is a talent - you choose it depnding on what you're playing against. Marks has it too. you still do ~15-20% of your normal damage while you are spends those 2 gcds because your pet is still doing RWARRWARRRWARR decent auto-attack damage at somone, when you have stampede (in total does 125% of pet damage - it's hardly enough to kill someone) up you can probably almost kill someone when using those 2 gcds and would have done ZERO DAMAGE as MM.

fixed.

Edited by Nitric, 18 February 2013 - 04:58 PM.


#33 Crawthz

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:03 PM

View PostNitric, on 18 February 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

That's a problem with hunters? If the hunter is only CCing, your partners should be eating the CC. Traps are probably one of the easier CCs to stop.

I don't know if it's just me or is Scatter the best CC in the world, because if you don't take the trap you force alot of cooldowns or if you do try to take it, the hunter has CC'd 2 players with 1 CC (stopping 1 guy from what he's doing and try to hit the trap on ground and the scatter on the healer)? Don't get me wrong, the scatter-trap minigame is quite fun but frustrating when you have plate mongoloid on your ass.
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#34 Kettu

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:12 PM

View Postdionim, on 18 February 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:

those new pet habilitys

mm you fuck up your positioning to cc, you lose 3 GCD doing ZERO DAMAGE
BM you dont really care about your positioning because you can always trinket (disengage rooting for 8 seconds and cant be dispel'd helps too) you still do 60% of your normal damage while you are spends those 3 gcds because your pet is still doing RWARRWARRRWARRR at somone, when you have stamped up you can probably almost kill someone when using those 3 gcds and would have done ZERO DAMAGE as MM.

Please tell us why exactly you need to ruin your positioning when you want to cc as MM but not as BM?

I would also like to know why a MM hunter would lose 3 GCDs when he wants to cc.

And last question, how much experience do you have playing as a hunter, you sound like an expert of this particular class.

#35 savvasp

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:18 PM

View PostIcekingx, on 17 February 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

Powershot the new Chaostbolt from S6. Going to really hate all the PHD/Thugcleave/Ret hunter X

People in S6: CC that nvm chaostbolt
people in S13: CC that nvm powershot

Chaos Bolt was like 1.5 sec cast time, did more damage and went through absorbs.  I don't see the correlation between these two.

#36 dionim

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:28 PM

isnt scatter 20 yards range (pretty much you must run into the other team if the healer positioning is good)? isnt being capable to trinket 3 times a row op?
also as far as i rembember hunters before mop, they did really good damage, had really good cc, but always had problems with LoS/positioning, why it isnt happening that much now? they all got better at the game?

answer me one last question please and i will stop

MM is a bad spec? or BM is to fucking good and solved all hunters problems at once ?

#37 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:56 PM

Yes, Scatter Shot is a 20 yard range. Trinketing 3 times is OP, sure, but you also have to realize that it's one of our main damage abilities (20% personal damage buff), so saving it just to get out of CC isn't necessarily always the best choice.

Quote

MM is a bad spec? or BM is to fucking good and solved all hunters problems at once ?

MM isn't a bad spec. Blizzard just took all of MM's unique abilities (Silencing Shot, Scatter Shot, etc.) and gave them to BM. That paired with Bestial Wrath being a get-out-of-CC button is too good to pass up. MM doesn't really have anything unique anymore.

#38 Tsx

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:10 PM

inb4 hunters playing thug powershotting through bomb knocking opponents out hahhaha gna be n1

#39 Broxxy

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:57 PM

View PostNitric, on 18 February 2013 - 05:56 PM, said:

Yes, Scatter Shot is a 20 yard range. Trinketing 3 times is OP, sure, but you also have to realize that it's one of our main damage abilities (20% personal damage buff), so saving it just to get out of CC isn't necessarily always the best choice.



MM isn't a bad spec. Blizzard just took all of MM's unique abilities (Silencing Shot, Scatter Shot, etc.) and gave them to BM. That paired with Bestial Wrath being a get-out-of-CC button is too good to pass up. MM doesn't really have anything unique anymore.

Exactly that, everything from a tool standpoint that made one spec different from another was packed into one. BW by itself is strong enough in this expac to warrant not being able to get silence or readiness in the same spec. Instead it gets both along with scatter and intimidate. Sorry there is no defending this , even with the fix to stampede.  I have no idea how Blizz would even begin to make the other specs attractive when breaking cc 3 times by itself is the deal breaker.

#40 Nitric

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 08:24 PM

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 February 2013 - 07:10 PM, said:

inb4 hunters playing thug powershotting through bomb knocking opponents out hahhaha gna be n1

View PostYarmyxx, on 18 February 2013 - 07:10 PM, said:

inb4 hunters playing thug powershotting through bomb knocking opponents out hahhaha gna be n1

Open w/ Powershot. Cheapshop once the target is knocked back. Smoke Bomb. Readiness -> Camo -> Powershot.

Awwwwwww yeah...





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