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The spec to go come 5.2

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#1 Thilz

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:23 PM

Personally I'm more of a healer type of person.. Playing healer almost all the seasons I have played, but tbh I don't really want to play MW if its going to suck, I'd rather be WW (yeah sure call me fotm idc). Just wanna know if I'll be wasting my time going MW for 5.2 if WW is going to be as good as everyone is talking about. Input is great, thanks!

#2 Heywoods

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:55 PM

I think "suck" is a little exaggerated when describing even the 5.1(live) version of a MW monk, let alone the buffed 5.2(ptr) MW monk. Even after today's nerf to RoP, which we knew was coming, I think MW will gravitate to the #2 or #3 most popular healer in arena and #1 or #2 in RBGs next patch. As for WW... They got a lot of buffs and QoL fixes in 5.2, but nothing substantial enough in my eyes to make it stand out as the 'go to' spec for next patch. I can see a lot of warriors going WW or rogue again and honestly the buffs to rogues might cannibalize from the population that would have switched to WW if it wasn't for the rogue buffs.

tl;dr - MW monk will be more common, but not necessarily because it's the 'best' or most competitive spec.

#3 Mushx

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 12:47 AM

MW will definitely not suck but we won't know for sure how they will be because blizzard keeps changing them on a weekly basis it seems like. If they are to be the way they are now on PTR (with ring of peace nerfed) they will be good healers. I say this mostly because MW monks are extremely tough to train/kill and they deal with melee cleaves pretty well (excluding hunters).

As for WW monks, they seem to do insane amounts of sustained and burst damage. They still take the most damage in stuns but they now have a second trinket and an improved dampen harm to mitigate some of that. The chi wave change also allows them to do a lot more dps and self heals as well.

Either way, you can't go wrong choosing MW or WW. :mellow:

Edited by Mushx, 26 January 2013 - 12:47 AM.

#4 maarko

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 02:55 AM

The change I would like to see for MW is making Enveloping Mist undispellable. I don't think that having our main heal as dispellable is a good design. Spam dispel/purge on our heals destroys our mana. You still need to channel soothing mist to get the full effect of the ability so I don't feel it would be that OP to make it undispellable. I also think MW will be one of the best healers due to the fact we are quite good against rogues comps.

#5 Blackdawn

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 01:58 PM

im not so sure about MW in 5.2 tbh..
- atm it feels like u heal too few while beeing very vulnerable to dispelling, that wont change at all
- chi wave gonna be stronger but half as rare to use, so u gotta cast more on constant preassure
- my biggest concern is the cc thou, any other healer has better cc and the range/undispellable buff is pretty nice here but still with this facing requirement (since u dont wanna put a bad 4sec just to DR someone) and no glyph to remove dots/bleeds, id still rather have hex/hoj+repatance/cyclone/fear, its all better in my eyes
- also the recent ring nerf made it gone as a real cc u could throw on enemy healers, its just defensive now which is nice but not really the problem

MW gonna be better no doubt, but im not sure if they can compete with shaman/hpally and even rdruids

i havent played WW, but from what i see is the dmg very good and burst insane now, survival maybe gonne be okay with nimbe/dampen so i gonna be WW for now

PS: i donk think the population of monks will rise fast in 5.2, so few ppl even have a 90monk that it will take some time

Edited by Blackdawn, 27 January 2013 - 02:01 PM.

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#6 Pradafiend

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 03:16 PM

what do monks even do

#7 Emoeritz

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 10:32 AM

My guess is that WW will be the next warriors, lots of stuns, insane mobility, okay defensive cooldowns. (the mastery change helps a lot)
They look pretty solid.

MW on the other hand have to compete with Shamans and Paladins and to be honest, even if MWs get the buffs they need, the whole skill set is just inferior compared to these two.
I know, that certainly a couple of people will jump at me for such a comment, but that's how it is. Tremor totem alone is more valuable than half of what MWs got.

Don't get me wrong, the buffs for this specc in 5.2 will surely help making it more competitive and you can certainly reach high ratings with them, it will just be harder.
Even if they are 'unkillable'/highly mobile, there is not much of a synergy with other classes or any kind of failsave cc (extra conditions on our sap and silence, stuns needs almost melee range).

(I'm only considering arenas here, in RBGs mistweavers could be one of the best healers over all but in arenas...)

Edited by Emoeritz, 28 January 2013 - 10:37 AM.

#8 Heywoods

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 10:29 PM

View PostBlackdawn, on 27 January 2013 - 01:58 PM, said:

im not so sure about MW in 5.2 tbh..
- atm it feels like u heal too few while beeing very vulnerable to dispelling, that wont change at all

I agree that our heals are getting dispelled too frequently. If you look at other classes who rely on DoT or HoT mechanics there is usually some punishment mechanic to the dispeller or a gain to the caster when the spells are dispelled/purged. Sure, MW monks have the pvp 2 piece bonus that gets us a mana tea when RM is dispelled, but that doesn't help when we are trying to handle a spike and Enveloping Mists, our largest heal outside of CD's or procs, gets dispelled right away.

I don't think the Jade Serpent Statue is very interesting in PvP right now. I think a mechanic should be added to it that provides some support to this dispelling issue monks are facing. Something along the lines of:

Summon Jade Serpent Statue 9.0% of base mana 40 yd range Instant 30 sec cooldown Requires Monk (Mistweaver)
Requires level 70
Requires Serpent Stance
Summons a Jade Serpent Statue at the target location. Lasts for 15 min. Only one statue can be active at a time.

Serpent's Vigil (Passive) - New
When the casters Enveloping Mist is dispelled or purged, the summoned Jade Serpent Statue will heal the target for 50% of the dispelled Enveloping Mists value. Target must be within 40 yards of Jade Serpent Statue and effect cannot occur more than once every 15 seconds.

Eminence (Passive)
When the Monk deals non-autoattack damage, the summoned Jade Serpent Statue will heal the lowest health nearby target within 20 yards equal to 50% of the damage done.

Serpent's Accord (Passive)
When you cast Soothing Mist, the Jade Serpent Statue will also cast Soothing Mist on an injured ally within 40 yards.

Edited by Heywoods, 29 January 2013 - 12:34 AM.

#9 Athená

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 10:50 PM

I just wish the mana on mw would be better and that life cocoon would actually live up to its 2 min cd..
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#10 Thilz

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 06:53 AM

I really like the direction that MW monks are going with the buff to chi wave.. I hear it is very, very good.. I'm jut scared of the obvious spam purging on our heals, ability to get CCed easily, and mana issues.

#11 Moreudirl

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:14 AM

i wish lifecocoon and fort brew were redesigned :(

Lifecocoon keeps 12 sec dura, but rather than increase hot healing by 50%. It should take 50% of every hot tick (evelop soothing etc) and add it back to the total absorb. So it keeps increasing so its more of a reactive cooldown... its our main cooldown after all. After 12 seconds any remaining shield will be healed as a hot over 5 seconds or something. Idk i dont see that being too overpowered as opposed to being a fun and interesting mechanic for both pvp and pvp.

I also wish fort brew was different per spec, potentially stronger for brew, shorter CD maybe something else for WW. as well as the option for MW monks to "throw" it to their partners, blizzard said they wanted to add another MW cooldown. Why not rework something already in our toolkit to add more depth, decision making and complexity to the spec.


#12 Athená

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:53 PM

Life Cocoon at its current state may as well be a 1 min cd.
I do not suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.

#13 Thilz

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:58 PM

They definitely *should* do something with life cocoon.. It's just obviously not good enough for a 2 minute CD and how it is designed. Will they change it come 5.2 probably not -.-

The only thing I have to look forward to is the buff to chi wave

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