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Why Warriors will suck in s13 5.2 ptr footage


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#1 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:49 AM

This is sad, but is the truth here is a video from the ptr, and a link to my forum post on blizzard ptr forums  Please post shortly after you watch the video, or try out the ptr lets attempt to make a difference blizzard has shown signs of looking at pvp much more this expansion.
Turn on 720 in video

http://us.battle.net...opic/7708262002

I ended up posting this later in the thread, but I figured I would readdress it here at the start,

The thing you all don't realize is that we are complaining about this for a reason.

If you didn't know warriors were op because of 5 things last season.
Shockwave short cd
defensive stance 25% op
dmg cd stacking
warbringer stun op swaps
other classes were not on par

5 huge things are happening this patch
shockwave 40sec cd up from 20
defensive stance to 15% balanced
warbringer dr's with normal stuns rendering it useless
other classes are getting buffed while we get NERFED
overpower costs 10 rage causing us to go to battle stance and take 25% more damage this patch

So we are plee'ing for 1 of the 5 changes because we don't want to be useless in arenas if those points don't make since to you think about why you died to a warrior team it is because of warbringer/shockwave/dmg cds/ and warrior was not a target to kill not only because of d stance but in conjunction with second wind, and shockwaves at low hp it made us amazing, and another reason you lost is because that kill slipped away because warrior shockwaved again 20sec later. WITH ALL THE CHANGES COMBINED IF WE HAVE TO TAKE 25% more DAMAGE while we are trying to do anything with all those nerfs combined with other class buffs you can call us useless in arena.

We are not plee'ing for 25% d stance a nerf to 15% is good, but overpower basically f's us makes us have to go battle to do any dmg, but we literally will take to much damage to be viable.

Edited by Duncan, 23 January 2013 - 09:14 PM.


#2 Deonto

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:57 AM

I have posted quite a bit about this. Keeping up TC and hamstring..and maybe an op here and there is all you can do in Dstance as arms now.

Fury, while more proc/rng based, can do decently well while in Dstance though.
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#3 Hoodzx

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:30 PM

So fury might be better is that what you say ?

This overpower change seems really brutal too, i don't know why they did that Oo

#4 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:34 PM

I havn't even attempted fury this expansion, I don't want to even go there.

#5 dionim

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:40 PM

10% passive damage reduction for battle
25% damage reduction for defensive WHEN YOU HAVE SHIELD EQUIPPED

fix'd

#6 joefernandes

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:42 PM

well this change just prevents us from sitting in one stance all game, which i think is a good / needed change cos sitting D stance all game is too op, im guess you can do a lot more damage in battle stance which is nice though and if u get tunneled time to pick up glyph of mortal strike i guess and sit D for a bit, don't think its that bad but will see i guess

#7 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:43 PM

That could be a solution, but I don't like the fact that you would have to wear a shield, hell I still have a blue shield because it is the last thing warriors buy, and a green main hand, and the season comes to a end here soon.

#8 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:46 PM

View Postjoefernandes, on 22 January 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

well this change just prevents us from sitting in one stance all game, which i think is a good / needed change cos sitting D stance all game is too op, im guess you can do a lot more damage in battle stance which is nice though and if u get tunneled time to pick up glyph of mortal strike i guess and sit D for a bit, don't think its that bad but will see i guess
It is literally that bad, defensive stance is a huge reason warriors that are trained can be offensive to attempt the same thing in battle stance while being trained would mean, be ready to run out after a ms/hs combo because your healer won't be able to keep you up for long. Defensive stance is more then keeping us alive it is what allows us to be offensive when being attacked.  There is a reason why full geared warriors gem full resil, and sit in d stance because if they are pvp power they are too squishy to stay in, or get globaled even in d stance. Battle stance would be like running around with a derp on my face sign on it the moment warriors start doing in. A warrior without a trinket in d stance dies in a bomb what do you think will happen to a warrior without a trinket in battle lol

Edited by Duncan, 22 January 2013 - 12:50 PM.


#9 Icekingx

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:47 PM

After watching this video and just lvled my alt warrior to 90 last week getting him full dreadful with a wep from 5 man heroic...you just killed my only hope of having fun on my alt T_T. I do see where you are coming from about being rage starved most of the time I really loved playing a warrior back in BC/wrath stance dancing and having sword/mace/axe specs that was really fun. Oh and the crazy shit that bladestorm gave us in S6 after enough bitching in S5 on how that talent was DOGSHIT.

Edited by Icekingx, 22 January 2013 - 12:48 PM.

Rawrbertlol, on 14 June 2013 - 08:41 AM, said:

Best signatures on entire website.
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#10 Deonto

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:52 PM

View PostHoodzx, on 22 January 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

So fury might be better is that what you say ?

This overpower change seems really brutal too, i don't know why they did that Oo

I assume the change was mainly done for pve. Trying to make sure slam>HS+OP(sad thing is, HS+OP is still better even with the rage cost on op). And I doubt they put much thought into what it would do to pvp.

And I am 100% sure that if OP keeps..any rage cost then fury will be the spec to play.
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#11 Guest_Talbadar_*

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:52 PM

What they tried to address with the changes was to give a reason to change stances more often. They threw 2 brutal changes to Defensive Stance which maybe should have just been one (reduce your damage AND reduces less damage taken) to force you into Battle Stance when you want to do damage. I don't fully understand how the changes will work, but do you end up doing more damage in Battle Stance next patch then you would this patch? I agree Warriors may be unjustly too squishy after this change, but their damage would still keep them in high rated arena.

#12 watchmepwn

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:55 PM

This basicly allways happens after every expansion.

Goodbye warriors; you are fun for 1 season.

It seems Blizzard can't find a solution; how to not make them TO strong and TO weak.
Basicly warriors get overlapped by rogues in every comb next season, so yeh. Thanks for this season.

#13 Häxantutto

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:57 PM

season 9 warriors -> s10 / s11 , nice repeat
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#14 Deonto

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 12:59 PM

View PostTalbadar, on 22 January 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

What they tried to address with the changes was to give a reason to change stances more often. They threw 2 brutal changes to Defensive Stance which maybe should have just been one (reduce your damage AND reduces less damage taken) to force you into Battle Stance when you want to do damage. I don't fully understand how the changes will work, but do you end up doing more damage in Battle Stance next patch then you would this patch? I agree Warriors may be unjustly too squishy after this change, but their damage would still keep them in high rated arena.

Arms warriors will end up with more damage regardless. As they need a buff in pve. As well, all this change will do is put fury as the favored spec(pretty much w/e spec will allow you to do more damage while in Dstance will be the favored one).
Fury isn't too far behind arms atm on live. With the buff to Bloodsurge(wild strike will cost no rage when proc'd) it will be by far the favored spec.

I don't think blizzard really takes this into consideration at all. And still, I doubt the rage cost on OP had anything to do with pvp(well, I really doubt they took it into consideration when they first implemented the change)..

Edited by Deonto, 22 January 2013 - 01:05 PM.

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#15 Hoodzx

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:00 PM

View Postwatchmepwn, on 22 January 2013 - 12:55 PM, said:

This basicly allways happens after every expansion.

Goodbye warriors; you are fun for 1 season.

It seems Blizzard can't find a solution; how to not make them TO strong and TO weak.
Basicly warriors get overlapped by rogues in every comb next season, so yeh. Thanks for this season.

Damn now i miss so much S6-S7-S8... Hello AT !

#16 dionim

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:04 PM

i get it now, nerf arms rage, buff fury rage cost of spells, buff bladestorm...

#17 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:10 PM

View PostTalbadar, on 22 January 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

What they tried to address with the changes was to give a reason to change stances more often. They threw 2 brutal changes to Defensive Stance which maybe should have just been one (reduce your damage AND reduces less damage taken) to force you into Battle Stance when you want to do damage. I don't fully understand how the changes will work, but do you end up doing more damage in Battle Stance next patch then you would this patch? I agree Warriors may be unjustly too squishy after this change, but their damage would still keep them in high rated arena.

The damage a warrior can do is similar to last patch in battle stance it feels natural in a rotation, most likely a slight decrease being that most wars used mainly heroic strike. Also with the 30% damage buff to slam to compensate for the 100% lost to heroic strike from TfB. I assume you would think that would make things okay, but slam is a really inconvenient use of gcd being that hamstring is necessary every few globals. However with cds Slam is ridiculous, without them it is meh low crit high rage and a gcd that we don't want.  Blizz mentioned having rage feel more like part of a warrior again I feel this change was mostly meant to bring back rage into skills which I like, but the simple fact of the matter without passive damage reduction in battle stance it is extremely dangerous even more so then the old school recklessness if counter pressured when used, and it will be necessary to attempt to use it more, but when teams begin to punish warriors it will be scary also there is like a 3/4 second window to change stances there is no /cancelaura recklessness.

Edited by Duncan, 22 January 2013 - 01:38 PM.


#18 Rylexcamel

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:10 PM

View Postwatchmepwn, on 22 January 2013 - 12:55 PM, said:

This basicly allways happens after every expansion.

Goodbye warriors; you are fun for 1 season.

It seems Blizzard can't find a solution; how to not make them TO strong and TO weak.
Basicly warriors get overlapped by rogues in every comb next season, so yeh. Thanks for this season.
exactly... warr this patch are too good but next season i can't see any reason to pick a warr over any other dk or rogue

Edited by Rylexcamel, 22 January 2013 - 01:11 PM.


#19 Korzul

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:11 PM

Have you tried:

Glyph of Bull Rush - Juggernaught - Charge on CD etc.
Plus i'm assuming noone will use heroic strike anymore and it'll all be MS/OP then slam when trying to burst etc.

Also i know getting caught in battle is crap but you can't completely ignore the option of using it when your on stun dr's or when you set up cc on people into burst.

#20 Duncan

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:20 PM

View PostKorzul, on 22 January 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

Have you tried:

Glyph of Bull Rush - Juggernaught - Charge on CD etc.
Plus i'm assuming noone will use heroic strike anymore and it'll all be MS/OP then slam when trying to burst etc.

Also i know getting caught in battle is crap but you can't completely ignore the option of using it when your on stun dr's or when you set up cc on people into burst.




Glyph of Bull Rush is awesome, and very good in my opinion it will be  necessity if this goes live. Charging on cd seems unrealistic at times to me.

I was not suggesting ignoring it completely as that would be irresponsible I use it on live already it is just that it is not a miracle drug to infinite rage it is merely something to stabilize your rage for the use of abilities. Even if you are not stunned the amount of pressure it puts on your healer is extremely easy to notice, and the rate raw damage will drop you will make you fly back to your healer low hp in d stance cutting your pressure. It can quickly turn into a very counter-productive ability which doesn't seem like it should be something for the warrior class.  It would be like telling a warrior back in the day well if you take to much damage just kill people with a 1h/shield which quickly would turn into too little damage for your team which would put you behind very quickly that is how I feel about bstance currently the reward does not fit the price once people are accustomed to how warriors must play to do steady pressure.




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