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Totemic Restoration vs Psychic Scream


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#1 Eltekk

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 12:27 AM

I honestly don't understand this, 30 second cooldown on tremor totem and 27 second CD on priest fear, also with blood fear gone next patch this makes it even more OP. And still I barely see anyone complaining about this.

No change to totemic restoration seen in patch notes so far.

So my question is: Why hasn't anyone else been complaining about this lately? Something needs to be done before the patch hits.

#2 Djandawg

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 12:39 AM

There is a good chance that people gave up on disc and decided to wait for next expansion. I know I did.
As for shadowpriests , they play with stuff that kill shamans, so it's not that bad for them lol. But this is a valid concern, tremor should not be 30 seconds, it's disgusting.

#3 Psychic1

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 01:32 AM

I feel like right now its needed to counter the instant fears that are in the game, but with the blood fear change it should probably go. One thing to note tho is that nerfing totemic restoration is an indirect buff to shadow priests which they do NOT need at all.

Edit: Destroying the totem with the use of a macro is pretty retarded, if it would atleast require the use of Totem Recall which triggers a global it would be acceptable

Edited by Psychic1, 12 January 2013 - 01:33 AM.


#4 dnaiel

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 01:51 AM

View PostPsychic1, on 12 January 2013 - 01:32 AM, said:

I feel like right now its needed to counter the instant fears that are in the game, but with the blood fear change it should probably go. One thing to note tho is that nerfing totemic restoration is an indirect buff to shadow priests which they do NOT need at all.

Edit: Destroying the totem with the use of a macro is pretty retarded, if it would atleast require the use of Totem Recall which triggers a global it would be acceptable

I think that was actually the plan since the old macro got blocked, but someone found a different macro.

#5 Athená

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:11 AM

Even with recall it would only add 8 seconds more, imo it should only work when destroyed considering healing tide and mana tide are the main concern for this talent.
Tremor on a 1 min cd worked for an entire expansion, why wouldn't it now.
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#6 Psychic1

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:17 AM

View PostAthená, on 12 January 2013 - 02:11 AM, said:

Even with recall it would only add 8 seconds more, imo it should only work when destroyed considering healing tide and mana tide are the main concern for this talent.
Tremor on a 1 min cd worked for an entire expansion, why wouldn't it now.

Because now there is a whole lot less dispelling and a whole lot more fears that are more or less unavoidable. CC should be something you actually have to make an effort to get off, and if it's to be broken it shouldnt be as easy as the tremor currently is. With the way fears work now tho they kinda equal eachother out.

TLDR: Both fears and tremor should be reworked from how they work now.

Edited by Psychic1, 12 January 2013 - 02:18 AM.


#7 Athená

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:26 AM

View PostPsychic1, on 12 January 2013 - 02:17 AM, said:

Because now there is a whole lot less dispelling and a whole lot more fears that are more or less unavoidable. CC should be something you actually have to make an effort to get off, and if it's to be broken it shouldnt be as easy as the tremor currently is. With the way fears work now tho they kinda equal eachother out.

TLDR: Both fears and tremor should be reworked from how they work now.

1 minute cd is more than generous, other healers have no way to get out of fear.

Edited by Athená, 12 January 2013 - 02:34 AM.

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#8 wambafat

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:31 AM

View PostPsychic1, on 12 January 2013 - 02:17 AM, said:

Because now there is a whole lot less dispelling and a whole lot more fears that are more or less unavoidable. CC should be something you actually have to make an effort to get off, and if it's to be broken it shouldnt be as easy as the tremor currently is. With the way fears work now tho they kinda equal eachother out.

TLDR: Both fears and tremor should be reworked from how they work now.
So for every other healer who sits in those full fears... fuckem?

#9 Armagedon

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:39 AM

30 second tremor is the dumbest thing in the game, even at 1 minute it's too good after blood fear nerf. There's no way that the talent was intended to work by killing your own totems.

#10 Surel

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 03:03 AM

When they changed tremor mechanic from Lich kIng to 1 minute cooldown usable while feared in Cataclysm i seriously nerdraged and wanted to quit the game. Who in their right mind would be so fucking retarded to come up with stuff you can used while cc to get out of cc. Bad game design, you should use stuff to avoid cc. Like inner focus sacrifice etc. Either way, somehow i learend to live with shamans having a one minute cooldown on it. AND NOW THIS, ARE YOU FUCKING JOKKING ME? you guys can say what you want about spriest being the best casters this season and all but arena for me has never been more boring on my shadowpriest.

Edited by Surel, 12 January 2013 - 03:09 AM.


#11 Keiret

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 05:14 AM

Totemic restoration has to go. I can't think of any solution to nerfing it without making it too weak compared to the other options. If you simply remove the ability to destroy totems no shaman will ever pick totemic restoration. I agree though that it is way too good in its current state. That said, I play both a shaman and a priest and I don't think it's that big of a deal. Just have to use fear differently.

Edited by Keiret, 12 January 2013 - 05:15 AM.


#12 ROKMODE

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 06:15 AM

Cata tremor redesign was a bad change, but it was a bad design in wrath as well. Every other global was tremor totem vs good locks. It's a hard spell to fix. By straight-up removing it, you would have to compensate in a lot of areas.
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#13 CGK

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 08:34 AM

tremor is 34 sec, not 30 when you're using restoration.  but i do agree its op and needs to be removed when blood fear is taken out.
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#14 hekumzx

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 09:37 AM

Plenty of people bitch about it in game and online all the time, it's just not at the top of anyone's bitching list.  Warlocks have instant fear and are mad at warriors.  Spriests are really good and are mad at warriors.  Disc is bad and are mad at blizzard.

View PostSurel, on 12 January 2013 - 03:03 AM, said:

When they changed tremor mechanic from Lich kIng to 1 minute cooldown usable while feared in Cataclysm i seriously nerdraged and wanted to quit the game. Who in their right mind would be so fucking retarded to come up with stuff you can used while cc to get out of cc. Bad game design, you should use stuff to avoid cc. Like inner focus sacrifice etc. Either way, somehow i learend to live with shamans having a one minute cooldown on it. AND NOW THIS, ARE YOU FUCKING JOKKING ME? you guys can say what you want about spriest being the best casters this season and all but arena for me has never been more boring on my shadowpriest.

You must be trolling.  I played disc and rsham in wrath and I can tell you that tremor was the most absurd, boring, short sighted and bullshit class mechanic in the game and I literally quit shaman because of it.  Most of the other teams globals were killing tremor.  And half of my fears weren't broken because it took seconds to pulse and would be killed anyway.

Obv, plenty of shaman were good and did fine with it, some liked it, I was too impatient.  Point is, one minute tremor is fine.  Resto shamans don't have life swaps, bubbles, bops and shield walls.  So, not sure 1 minute tremor is OP.  I played til 5.1 with projection almost every game because I liked it over 2400 mmr in 3s and 2500 in 5s.  After 5.1 though, I think it's nearly impossible to play versus spriests and blood fear without it.

Edited by Hektiik, 12 January 2013 - 09:38 AM.

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#15 Surel

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 02:59 PM

Im not trolling, i dont mind shamans having niches to get out off cc with, i just thinck that if you can use them during the cc its a horrible game design. That being said i have no idea how tremor was from shaman ponint of view in wraith, a lot of the shamans i talk with thinck that it was a lot better. For example id rather berserker rage being 20 seconds - 30 seconds duration immunity to fear than that you can break fears with it and remain immune for 6 seconds.If you thinck one minute tremor totem mechanic is fine then maybe we should make paladins be able to sacrifice while cced, priest fearward on one minute cooldown and usable while feared (and it would put fear on DR like tremor). Obviously this is not the game design i want. The argument would probably be that i cant compare classes, but i thinck this comparission is legit. Druids where immune to sheep but you could sleep them and you could stun or fear them into sheep. But tremor is braindead. However i do agree blood fear is extremely strong but psyfiend is countered, most classes just oneshot it before the 2 second cast. Honestly the only way to fear a healer with it is horror and psyfiend him and the same time. Regardless, cc needs to be towned down in the game and psyfiend should be removed with it along with other instant cc.

Edited by Surel, 12 January 2013 - 05:36 PM.


#16 vomite

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 03:04 PM

Then can we get a fix to Psyfiend too? I dont like totemic restoration cause it makes the class even more retard friendly, but blood fear and psyfiend are just as retarded

#17 Eltekk

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 05:46 PM

View Postvomite, on 12 January 2013 - 03:04 PM, said:

Then can we get a fix to Psyfiend too? I dont like totemic restoration cause it makes the class even more retard friendly, but blood fear and psyfiend are just as retarded

I totally agree, I wouldn't mind having psyfiend removed and replaced with something.

#18 hekumzx

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 06:55 PM

View PostSurel, on 12 January 2013 - 02:59 PM, said:

Im not trolling, i dont mind shamans having niches to get out off cc with, i just thinck that if you can use them during the cc its a horrible game design. That being said i have no idea how tremor was from shaman ponint of view in wraith, a lot of the shamans i talk with thinck that it was a lot better. For example id rather berserker rage being 20 seconds - 30 seconds duration immunity to fear than that you can break fears with it and remain immune for 6 seconds.If you thinck one minute tremor totem mechanic is fine then maybe we should make paladins be able to sacrifice while cced, priest fearward on one minute cooldown and usable while feared (and it would put fear on DR like tremor). Obviously this is not the game design i want. The argument would probably be that i cant compare classes, but i thinck this comparission is legit. Druids where immune to sheep but you could sleep them and you could stun or fear them into sheep. But tremor is braindead. However i do agree blood fear is extremely strong but psyfiend is countered, most classes just oneshot it before the 2 second cast. Honestly the only way to fear a healer with it is horror and psyfiend him and the same time. Regardless, cc needs to be towned down in the game and psyfiend should be removed with it along with other instant cc.

Paladins now have as much CC as a hunter, they have two sacs, two freedoms, two bops, a bubble, a shield wall, a guardian immortality raid heal and the best burst/instant healing in the game.  
A paladin can come out of a fear and lay on hands teammates.  Shaman mastery is overtuned in pvp situations but atleast it requires you to cast a full spell after CC, not to mention using a global for a riptide if you need tidal waves and an unleash to really burst with the OP mastery if you want/can.  Not taking into consideration earthshield insta dispels.  In those two globals, you can be CC'd again.  And again.
If earth shield was 9 stacks, purges were all 1 per global, tremor gave 6-8 second fear immunity on a 1 minute cooldown.  Seems balanced.  Your paladin to shaman comparison though, far from realistic.

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#19 Nightmonkey

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:23 PM

View PostHektiik, on 12 January 2013 - 06:55 PM, said:

Paladins now have as much CC as a hunter, they have two sacs, two freedoms, two bops, a bubble, a shield wall, a guardian immortality raid heal and the best burst/instant healing in the game.  
A paladin can come out of a fear and lay on hands teammates.  Shaman mastery is overtuned in pvp situations but atleast it requires you to cast a full spell after CC, not to mention using a global for a riptide if you need tidal waves and an unleash to really burst with the OP mastery if you want/can.  Not taking into consideration earthshield insta dispels.  In those two globals, you can be CC'd again.  And again.
If earth shield was 9 stacks, purges were all 1 per global, tremor gave 6-8 second fear immunity on a 1 minute cooldown.  Seems balanced.  Your paladin to shaman comparison though, far from realistic.

Did I miss the part where they made lay on hands usable in arena, or are you just using that spell as an exaggeration to describe how strong their instant heals are?

Tremor is just an exercise in poor game design.  It's never really been balanced, either too strong (now) or really dependent on the situation (wrath).  If I remember correctly, the design in wrath basically made a shaman's team mates immune to fear, but left the shaman vulnerable to fear if you were good at totem stomping.

I think leaving it on a 1 min cd and allowing it to be dropped while feared would probably be about as balanced as the ability could ever get.  It's just one of those things where the original idea behind it just doesn't work very good in practice.  When I play my shaman I don't like having to destroy the totem in order to get the reduced cooldown, when I play my warlock it basically takes 20 seconds and 80k of my own hp just to fear against a shaman team for half duration.

If you want to talk about something overpowered flying under the radar, though, let's talk shadow priests.  I think it's about time they take a hard look at the glpyh that lets you cast like 2 or 3 different heals in shadow form with no penalty other than a major glyph slot used up.

#20 Djandawg

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 08:28 AM

Why is this still in the game? Psychic scream is not shadow only you know.
Some classes can break fear, some people can use will of the forsaken and the remaining ones are by design not fearable if they play with a shaman.
I am wondering how people would feel if they gave a class an aoe  15 sec cd incapacitate break, so that holy paladins can never land a repentance. Tremor totem is an amazing ability, I believe that 1 min cd that can be used when feared is already gross,  How are they allowing 34 second tremor to be part of wow pvp? Especially now that they nerfed blood fear.

Edited by Djandawg, 02 February 2013 - 08:29 AM.





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