65 replies to this topic

[Alphatier]

Ctuhlu, on 29 December 2012 - 05:34 PM, said:

You're right that hots do take time. But the kind of metagame that is encouraged by someone being safe with a full row of hots is bad: it means that if you are facing a resto druid team, you NEED to be able to kill someone in 4 seconds. And burst is already out of hand. Resto druids would (again) become a hard counter to any comp that doesn't thrive on bursting something down in a stun (just like they were in S8). Furthermore the fact that you can pre-hot with no consequence means that in the hands of a good druid your whole team becomes unkillable if hots are enough to keep something alive indefinitely. Again, just flash back to S8 LSD and you'll remember how detrimental that was to the game. If you remember, at that time EVERY tournament team had a resto druid healer, and EVERY team relied on randomly bursting something down in 2 seconds (LSD, When the Stars Align, ATC, etc).

Yes the hot-rolling playstyle might be unique in a game that has largely been homogenized, but it's also detrimental to the metagame.

with the amount of CC in the game right now, just CC him once or twice for let's say 8-12 seconds then add to that 5 globals for hotting up, that's a solid window to "burst" someone down. Generally, damage right now is high enough to do just that. It would require thinking though instead of the mindless meleeing taking place nowadays

[Hendie]

Isumi, on 29 December 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

actually i play atm ele/shadow/rdruid at 2,4mmr and my druid can keep up the ele against every cleave except of kfc who pop everything, don't know why all of you thing druid healing is so weak. just have to play a lot at pillars and ccing enemies.....

Its like you are too stupid to even realise why your own comp is working.

Druid heals are subpar - Nps throw in 2 off healers + druid heals.
Druids are susceptible to fears - Np tremor totem + mass dispell
Druids are susceptible to cc - Np mass dispell or 2x off heals when druid cc'd.
Also a life swap when needed. and/or solarbeam/life grip x2

Now it takes pretty much all of the above to be 2.3k with 75% win lose.

[averagepriestz]

Shear normally repentance is followed after some kind of stun or CC, otherwise you are right, it will probably be locked. I think most classes lost their specialty. Paladins had no manaregen at all except Blessing of Wisdom (which you had to tradeoff with Kings, that actually gave you that extra crit and sp). We had a large manapool and low manacost. It was fun, I liked it. We were the underdogs, but in 5v5 we were very viable. Now everyone has the same buffs, same tools (dispel) and similar heals. Game is being severly dumbed down. Back then 5v5 was not about bursting someone down in a global. You could actually run the healers out of mana. I'd like to see it go back to what it was. I think manadrain was fine, it just had to be toned down, not being spammable and Hunters not having a pet to stack Viper sting with.

But druids are really weak in the current game, very much due to all the damage flying around. We need stronger direct heals.

[Isumi]

Hendie, on 29 December 2012 - 05:52 PM, said:

Its like you are too stupid to even realise why your own comp is working.

Druid heals are subpar - Nps throw in 2 off healers + druid heals.
Druids are susceptible to fears - Np tremor totem + mass dispell
Druids are susceptible to cc - Np mass dispell or 2x off heals when druid cc'd.
Also a life swap when needed. and/or solarbeam/life grip x2

Now it takes pretty much all of the above to be 2.3k with 75% win lose.

i think you don't get the point, druids in this thread crying about healing ist so hard against cleaves.

you are right we have so much tools to survive against castercomps, but we have like no peels against cleaves (no stuns/roots every 30 seconds) and playing with an ele who has no defensive cds for kfc burst. so pls don't talking shit its easy for shadow/ele/druid against meelecomps, actually it's very hard but druid can keep his mates up if played right, so stop crying that druid healers are so weak

[averagepriestz]

2 casters is better than a melee vs. meleecleaves, what are you on about? You have a shitton of pressure and knocks, a druid to CC and strong burst.

I'm sorry Isumilol but it is you that need to wake up and smell the coffee. Rdruid healing is in general weak.

[TteSPORTSDoomsen]

Isumi, on 29 December 2012 - 06:59 PM, said:

i think you don't get the point, druids in this thread crying about healing ist so hard against cleaves.

you are right we have so much tools to survive against castercomps, but we have like no peels against cleaves (no stuns/roots every 30 seconds) and playing with an ele who has no defensive cds for kfc burst. so pls don't talking shit its easy for shadow/ele/druid against meelecomps, actually it's very hard but druid can keep his mates up if played right, so stop crying that druid healers are so weak

I somehow have a feeling that you were not able to fully understand what Hendie actually wanted to say.. ..

[Aldrainíl]

The only cleave that's really a problem for resto druids is kfc, all other double melee are easily dealt with imo by just using treeform to counter their cooldowns
also feelin like most people in this thread are talking like 5.2 is already here and we dont have cyclone to stop some damage?

[gbubbah]

*this just in*


THIS GAME IS SO AWFUL

[xendrius]

Guys, please take a step back and re-think your opinions. I honestly believe that the only reason rDruids will be bad this expansion because of the turn that the game has taken.

Rdruids have always been the sustained healers that can handle multiple targets being nuked, the slow-paced state of arena in TBC made rdruids the perfect healer.

But now in MoP, a switch is done in 2 seconds and a DR'd scatter-trap can be enough to score a kill 100-0

[averagepriestz]

People died in a few seconds in S8 too. It was because their heals were a lot stronger, 3xblooms was plenty to keep 1 target alive when they procced. Reju->Swiftmend was a huge heal and they never oom'ed. A lot less CC was in the game, so hots were always up and they were easily paired with an Elemental shaman for offhealing.

That is why Resto druids were good but not gods in 3v3 in TBC for example. They were gods in WotlK.

Edited by averagepriestz, 29 December 2012 - 09:28 PM.

[Isumi]

averagepriestz, on 29 December 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

2 casters is better than a melee vs. meleecleaves, what are you on about? You have a shitton of pressure and knocks, a druid to CC and strong burst.

I'm sorry Isumilol but it is you that need to wake up and smell the coffee. Rdruid healing is in general weak.

i don't say its easy as druid, kfc is pretty hard but ele shamy has no defenisve cds and has to tank all thei dmg cd's while every other class has a minor defensive cd which they can pop. druid has problems with healing against cleaves but it's not impossible to heal through their cds like a lot of druids want to describe it in this thread.

agree with superald, too.

[Xhanon]

gbubbah, on 29 December 2012 - 07:40 PM, said:

*this just in*


THIS GAME IS SO AWFUL

Thank you so much for your Constructive feedback

[Hackattack3]

Isumi, on 29 December 2012 - 06:59 PM, said:

i think you don't get the point, druids in this thread crying about healing ist so hard against cleaves.

you are right we have so much tools to survive against castercomps, but we have like no peels against cleaves (no stuns/roots every 30 seconds) and playing with an ele who has no defensive cds for kfc burst. so pls don't talking shit its easy for shadow/ele/druid against meelecomps, actually it's very hard but druid can keep his mates up if played right, so stop crying that druid healers are so weak

You need to open your eyes and consider how your current comp stacks up against melee cleaves.  Hendi tried to point out earlier but I'm going to assume there's a EU language barrier.  

You have 2x knock backs, el shammy having the best one due to positional requirements.  Meaning you can cheeze on Dalaran sewers, Blade's Edge.  Imagine a different comp w/o elemental shammy kickback, if rdruid over-extends and tries kicking the melee, somehow misses b/c it can be glitchy and both melee have trinkets up, they can pop their shit and drop druid in 5 sec b/c can't be peeled.

[Isumi]

Hackattack3, on 30 December 2012 - 07:45 AM, said:

Imagine a different comp w/o elemental shammy kickback, if rdruid over-extends and tries kicking the melee, somehow misses b/c it can be glitchy and both melee have trinkets up, they can pop their shit and drop druid in 5 sec b/c can't be peeled.

it's so funny, in the shamy section eles are crying because they get stomped by ever meelcleave

in the druid section every druid is crying because they say they can't keep their mates up against a meelecleave

and now you want to sy me when ele and druid play together everything is np?

[Hackattack3]

Isumi, on 30 December 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

it's so funny, in the shamy section eles are crying because they get stomped by ever meelcleave

in the druid section every druid is crying because they say they can't keep their mates up against a meelecleave

and now you want to sy me when ele and druid play together everything is np?

Exactly, that's how class synergy works.

Let me give an example from a simpler time in wow, TBC.

Warlocks were the strongest casters in tbc (seasons 1 - 4) but they did not have demonic portal.  With zero ability to get range on melee, they could only sit there and tank.  Warriors and rogues (esp seasons 3-4 b/c of glaives) completely chewed up warlocks and people were bitching about it all the time.  If a lock paired with a priest or rshammy, melee would sit on the lock and ride them till the priest/shammy went OOM.  

Warlocks paired with rdruids were a different story and dominated tbc.

Rdruid was the only healer that could consistently peel melee, giving warlocks range to use CoEx (out of charge range) and kite melee effectively.  Rdruids also had the best poison cleanse to remove crippling poison and free up the warlock.

This was a case where warlocks alone could not handle melee, but with synergy and coordination with rdruids they could kite very effectively.


Kind of like how your team can cheeze melee on z-axis maps with kicks.

[ManaBlomz]

Hendie, on 29 December 2012 - 05:42 PM, said:

Druids are not fun atm

^

[Chancesz]

gbubbah, on 29 December 2012 - 07:40 PM, said:

*this just in*


THIS GAME IS SO AWFUL

whens the last time you actually played competitive arena? resto druids cannot deal with cleaves at all right now.

[Hotted]

Druid
You completly destroyed Rdruid again with 30% healing reduction. We are now unplayable again, congratz...
How would a global healing debuff make one healer weaker than others? (Source)


lol.

Edited by Hotted, 06 January 2013 - 07:57 PM.

[Speedymart]

Hotted, on 06 January 2013 - 07:56 PM, said:

Druid
You completly destroyed Rdruid again with 30% healing reduction. We are now unplayable again, congratz...
How would a global healing debuff make one healer weaker than others? (Source)


lol.

don't question a marine biologist

[xendrius]

hey guys, i reforged mastery its k now