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Elemental 5.2


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#1 Jontex

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:05 AM


Edited by Jontex, 22 December 2012 - 10:10 AM.

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#2 Jontex

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:05 AM

bye bye purge glyph hellooo flameshock glyph
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#3 Mageic

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 05:34 PM

View PostJontex, on 22 December 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

bye bye purge glyph hellooo flameshock glyph

Purge glyph will remain better, I'm hoping they will make GW baseline to take that glyph.

My overall impression is that these are nice changes but aren't enough to make elemental top tier viable. The largest changes being Shamanistic Rage for obvious reasons, EM which is a very nice talent buff which should line up with the new trinket cooldown and the blanket silence nerf making our lockout seem better by comparison. Additional changes will be needed to offset onset of nerfs directed at restoration like the totem silence and likely a tremor nerf in the near future(it needs to be done, I have a few ideas if anyone is interested)

From here elemental needs two things to become top tier viable, passive defenses and a control/utility buff.

For passive defense this could be anything like a reduction like shadow/moonkin form (my suggestion being 2% damage reduction for every stack of lightning shield) or a short cooldown to get ourselves out of bad situations similar to fade talent or safeguard(bad examples, they're obviously too strong but you get the idea)

As for control/utility buff I mean they need one or the other. Elemental needs something to help set up a controlled kill (as opposed to just throwing damage out and hoping for a random burst  or your team setting up a kill for you). My suggestion would be to make the stun totem better for elemental, more reliable so it can act as a cooldown stun similar to deep freeze. I would like to be able to drop the totem as an AOE and have it placed exactly in the center of the AOE location(which totemic projection does not do), passively the range will be 5 yards but with totemic projection it would be increased to 40 yards. The charge time should be reduced by 1 second to 4 seconds (2 with glyph) and when the totem is killed it will also detonate.

Alternatively (or maybe additionally?) they should buff elemental utility. In past seasons elemental was used as an anti CC machine for their healers which provided great utility. Over cataclysm and MoP though we lost nearly all of that utility: Inital tremor nerf, grounding totem cooldown, shear cooldown, root nerf and potentially future tremor nerf. Also, our heals are terrible now. No suggestions come to mind at the moment but if you compare our utility to shadowpriests, or even moonkins, rets and other dps its simply terrible.

Don't touch our damage.

Edited by Mageic, 22 December 2012 - 05:53 PM.


#4 Jontex

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 06:08 PM

agree with everything pretty much, I believe the flame shock change is a step in the right direction to passive defence. shamanistic rage for ele is HUUUUGE and the new elemental mastery is pretty good aswell since ns is pretty bad after the nerf to 1,5 min cd. problem with our utility is that no1 casts and theres a " delay " on grounding.
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#5 Zeiyo

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 08:39 PM

I disagree tbh, i feel our damage is already abit out of control with 1 min EM its going to be insane, with stone bulwark buff i think taking that and rotating between stone bulwark / shamanistic rage when being trained is enough, i havent had a problem setting up kills at all this expansion i feel you need to rely on team synergy more than just yourself but i like that.
The only thing im literally loosing against right now is warrior comps and i feel with those survivability buffs + dmg buffs + warrior nerfs, ele will have the tools to be top tier, im not saying it will literally be a top tier spec like spriest but it will have more tools for higher potential to be top tier again like it was at the start of the season.
I agree our totem needs to be fixxed, i love the way it works apart from how easily it is killed, i think it should be 2 second charge time glyphed like you said and i think it should be unkillable. i disagree with it landing on the exact center of the AoE target location though, i think it seperates good and bad shamans knowing what totems need to be placed in what position for it to end up where you want it.

Edited by Zeiyo, 22 December 2012 - 09:06 PM.


#6 Mageic

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 09:55 PM

Ele damage is good, but with everyone going resil at this point in the season I wouldn't say its insane. That totem is garbage simply due to being an earth totem and being forced to twist it between tremor and roots would be terrible( stoneclaw totem you could drop and change the totem to keep the buff, this you cannot and you would lose the pulse effect ). Unless the shield is seriously crazy I can't see myself taking it, natures guardian is so much better.

I don't see why you think being reliant on your team to set up kills for you is a good thing, from playing other classes that have better setup mechanics it only takes more team synergy to use them all correctly rather than simply waiting for one person to do it. That's a huge reason elemental can't play with many classes.

The mechanic is too clunky, not only does any good player simply kill it or take 2 steps away from it but it takes the placement is a big issue. It doesn't drop based where your totem would normally drop beside you, it just moves based on where it was dropped, different terrains also mess with how it is placed. I would be happy if they made the air totem always drop in the center.

#7 Zeiyo

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:26 PM

yeah stonebulwark should just act as a undispellable buff i think, so you are able to freely tremor/root ect after dropping it

#8 Enaina

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:27 PM

On a player Flame Shock deals 33k(63% resil) including the initial hit and one dot being a crit

33k / 23,27 = 1,4k DPS

On 3 targets that would be 4,2k DPS.

So with the glyph and Flame Shock on 3 targets that is a 2,1k HPS 'hot'.

In comparison, Gift of the Naaru is around 4,6k HPS.
Second Wind is 10-12k HPS
Healing Stream is 4.2k HPS

I'd say it's quite decent. Gift of the Naaru and Healing Stream do quite some healing, so a 50% perm version of those should be okay. Not sure if worth a glyph spot though.

Edited by Enaina, 29 December 2012 - 08:05 AM.


#9 Mageic

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:48 PM

you're not factoring in battle fatigue and MS

#10 Enaina

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 11:23 PM

View PostMageic, on 22 December 2012 - 10:48 PM, said:

you're not factoring in battle fatigue and MS

'Comparison wise' it doesn't matter. I was making numbers to compare it to other heals, not to damage.

#11 Ahlaundoh

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 11:33 PM

I think Ele really needs two things in addition to the changes: 1) a reliable cc to kill someone 2) thunderstorm needs to be changed, or they need something in addition to it. Thunderstorm is nearly worthless vs melee because they have so many gap closers.

And holy shit remove shocks from the same CD.
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pve the best

#12 hearthadinlol

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 05:45 PM

will glyph of sham rage be worth it?

atm only thing shamans can use while silenced is astral shift but if youre stunned you cant use it.. would be nice if you could astral shift while stunned or silenced + giving totems hp or resil or something would be cool any half decent team just rapes healing tide

Edited by hearthadinlol, 23 December 2012 - 05:49 PM.

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#13 Enaina

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:01 PM

So what comb will be the strongest as elemental in 5.2, I'm thinking ele/rogue/healer will be good?

#14 Jontex

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 02:18 PM

hpala ele with anything pretty much
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#15 Mirionx

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 04:25 PM

jk jonte never tremor

#16 Raak

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 04:39 PM

Any opinions about dk/hpala/elemental? Pretty trainable choice, I can see that much, but can pull off pretty impressive burst if allowed.
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#17 Jontex

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 04:40 PM

mirion never bops
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#18 Mirionx

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 05:05 PM

m8 i just bop in the starting zone, only time i ever have to bop

#19 Jontex

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 05:21 PM

bay x lyfe
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#20 Shiv00x

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 09:09 PM

View PostMirionx, on 25 December 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

jk jonte never tremor





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