214 replies to this topic

[Djandawg]

I was pretty sure you wouldn't be able to process the rest of the post and focus/stuck on that, I wrote anyway
Yeah it's hypocrisy because hunters two months ago were the same as shadowpriests now, right?

Edited by Djandawg, 11 December 2012 - 06:28 AM.

[Regent]

Djandawg, on 11 December 2012 - 06:24 AM, said:

I was pretty sure you wouldn't be able to process the rest of the post and focus/stuck on that, I wrote anyway

Get rid of Mass dispel, give them more sustained damage. Problem solved.

[Djandawg]

Go read again and reply to points I have made or don't reply please.

[ROKMODE]

Ughhh you're one of those morons that causes blizzard to continuously remove tools from classes. I was very upset when they removed dispel magic from shadowpriest in cata since it seemed like a cheap fix. Yeah, it worked, but its longterm effect was shitty. I wouldn't want to see them remove mass dispel because it's essentially removing one of the unique things that has existed alongside shadowpriests that made them a hybrid since their inception. (I could be wrong about that since I didn't play vanilla) If anything, why not start with the added MOP bs rather than removing core utility.

When I say mass dispel has existed since the inception of shadowpriests, I mean dispels from them in general

Edited by ROKMODE, 11 December 2012 - 08:06 AM.

[Hakasa]

Regent, on 11 December 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

started playing tonight at 2375 mmr

Lol you were 2k mmr at like 10 pm cst

gg's tho! xD

[hairpiece]

Mass dispel shouldn't be removed.   There are a lot of things in the game that need fixing, pretty much too many things to fix at once unless they decide to literally just do an entire patch dedicated to PvP changes.  In my opinion, the shadow priest damage I've seen is pretty sub par, so if you nerf their utility they become a pretty lackluster class.  The only real problem I have with shadow priests is life swap, although a lot of times it can be prevented with cc when someone is low, sometimes it just happens that you can't cc them in time, and I just kind of find it a sloppy ability in general.


I still think hybrid healing is too much across the board, even including hunters (game earlier where hunter did 700k damage, 500k healing...like...what is this?), and burst damage is fucked across the board, this leads to ridiculous burst healing, and unfortunately Paladin healing is mostly instant cast and unstoppable outside of CC, also an annoying thing that this game seems to lean more forward to now.  One of the reasons blanket silences have become so good now is because of the large amount of instant casts (I would rather blanket a pally than sit around and wait 2 minutes trying to lock him on the one cast).  Nerf instant casts/instant heals/instant cc and actually make casting a thing again, and along with that would need to come some interrupt nerfs (mage 20 second counterspell is ridiculous, double melee train etc, all silly).


Sustained damage should be buffed on so many classes, while having their burst damage drastically reduced (for example, as a mage, I would love to see my cast actually not base everything around frost bomb, and would love to see frostbolt actually usable again).  With burst damage reductions/sustained damage buffs can come healing nerfs so that the game would be played in a wounded state like planned years ago.  


Tl;dr, none of this will ever happen, PvE game, and PvE is fine.

Edited by hairpiece, 11 December 2012 - 07:58 AM.

[Chazzwozzer]

Regent, on 11 December 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

Every shadow priest in this thread is literally every hunter 2 months ago. Welcome to hypocrisy at its finest.

Attempting to compare shadow priests in their current state to hunters pre-stampede fix is simply laughable.  Everyone who looks at the game objectively understands that pre-fix stampede damage was out of control.  Making statements like these leads me to agree with Djanqt's assessment that you have a shallow understanding of the game.

Coming from a shaman's perspective (overpowered healer I know), spriest cc is far from some of the best in the game.  With totemic restoration, I can negate pretty much every psychic scream, unless the priest is casting them immediately off cooldown.  I think spriest damage is in a good place right now - they can do good pressure, but they don't just randomly one shot players in the middle of a match.  The same statement is not true when talking about warriors/mages/prenerf hunters/prenerf locks, and to a lesser extent classes like ferals.  

I'm currently also playing a resto druid, and again I wouldn't say that spriests are overpowered from a druid perspective.  Psychic scream and psyfiend are both relatively easy to avoid with travel form, not to mention displace beast if it is absolutely necessary.

I agree that spriest healing was way too good before 5.1, but now it doesn't seem like it is too much of a problem.  It feels the same as it did in cata - if you go for a kill on a non spriest, then you wan't to cc the spriest at the same time to avoid off heals.  Yes life swap is an extremely strong spell, but I think it should be given that it has a 6 minute cooldown. Mass dispel is very strong as well, but I feel like it is part of the priest identity, and it also has a 15 second cd with an exorbitant mana cost.

Also, you bring up in your first post that you played an excessive amount of spriests when you queued 3's.  However, stats currently show holy paladins easily exceeding priests in representation at high ratings, especially when factoring the global percent representation.  The stats pretty much represent what is already obvious, warriors and mages are by far the best dps classes in the game.  Shamans and paladins are represented as the best healers, however I feel that resto druids will start having higher representation now that locks are significantly nerfed.  So if anything, people should be clamoring to have your class nerfed before spriests, along with warriors (a class you play with),mages and shamans (shamans already did receive a rather significant nerf with the totem change).

Note: I do not personally feel that paladins need a nerf because they have higher representation than most classes. I'm only pointing out that just because you queued into a number of spriests in a single night of queuing, it does not stand as a valid proof that a class is overpowered or fotm.

[flay117]

holy shit how can people actually be bothered to whine about spriests
I fucking love facing them, especially when I play rmp
You can fuck them over so easy with just a short cc when they have to do their md or life swap to survive
And even if they can get the life swap off you can use it to your advantage for sick pressure

this forum never cease to amaze me with stupidity

[Broxxy]

flay117, on 11 December 2012 - 08:53 AM, said:

holy shit how can people actually be bothered to whine about spriests
I fucking love facing them, especially when I play rmp
You can fuck them over so easy with just a short cc when they have to do their md or life swap to survive
And even if they can get the life swap off you can use it to your advantage for sick pressure

this forum never cease to amaze me with stupidity

Because they are a great spec to play right now , and my marks hunter isnt

[deprivelol]

COVER YOUR HUNTER TRAPS WITH SHOCKWAVE,  SILENCE SHOT ,  OR REPENTANCE LOL WOW SO HARD TO DO jk

Edited by deprivelol, 11 December 2012 - 09:34 AM.

[Justwoo]

you should be able to void shift regentlord so he dies and never comes back

Edited by Justwoo, 11 December 2012 - 09:30 AM.

[deprivelol]

stahp wat r u doin STAHP MDING TRAPS

Edited by deprivelol, 11 December 2012 - 09:44 AM.

[wodeta]

Regent, on 11 December 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

They don't do well at kfc, no one is "doing well", everyone dropped their hunter and got either a feral, mage, spriest, or enh. We started playing tonight at 2375 mmr, and at the end of the night we had over 85 percent of games with spriest in them.

First of all when i said about ur CCs not sharing dr i was talking about you HAVING 3 CCs on diferent DRs, no other class have that.
Second "They don't do well at kfc, no one is "doing well", really? on my BG theres like 5 differents KFC with 2400+ and thats only in my BG, srsly?

[solidarityx]

this guy........

[Nisslol]

Yet another Regent vs World thread, gonna be constructive

[Arnie]

wodeta, on 11 December 2012 - 10:11 AM, said:

First of all when i said about ur CCs not sharing dr i was talking about you HAVING 3 CCs on diferent DRs, no other class have that.
Second "They don't do well at kfc, no one is "doing well", really? on my BG theres like 5 differents KFC with 2400+ and thats only in my BG, srsly?

Not to be an ass, but if you're talking simply cc from classes:
Mage - df, poly / ring, silence, nova
lock - sf / coil, fear, silence
druid - root, disorient, stun, cyclone
SP - horror, fear, silence, potential root
rogue - stuns, garrote, paralytic root, blind, and well sap and gouge (but admitting ignorance to what they DR atm)

Point being plenty of classes have CCs on 3 DRs. Warrs even have with charge stun, shockwave and fear.
This being said, I'm not trying to excuse hoj -> rep -> blind chains, just pointing out other classes have similar shit.

As far as original discussion goes, i hardly think removing mass dispel is a good solution. Perhaps looking into life swap however is better. Plenty of things seem to be somewhat broken atm in this game, my own class' CD stacking being one of them.

[Durotann]

Regent, on 11 December 2012 - 06:26 AM, said:

Get rid of Mass dispel, give them more sustained damage. Problem solved.

Removing utility from the game in exchange for damage isn't really what this game needs right now :x. I very rarely play with shadow priests in 3's and in my opinion MD is completely fine. I actually liked the game a lot more when classes had off utility such as Ret/SP dispel. It added a lot more flavor to the game. And in the end it's not that hard to cross CC, and also MD isn't *that* hard to pummel when you know it's coming, especially with pushback.

[Jarzombek]

We met like 10+ shattreeplays yesterday around 2300 mmr as kittycleave with rshaman, We lost a bunch but started winning against the same teams some hour later. Yes, SPs are very strong!
Then we met two KFCs about 10 times, lost most because the insane(!) amount of CC from the pala and hunter (and ofcourse sick damage on poor feral).

I don't see why you are complaing about their core abilitys when you have almost endless ways of countering it, I'm jsut trying to say that mass dispel is not a problem.

[Cantis]

Lets just remove every unique ability in the game so all classes are the exact same. I feel like we're already half way there.

[saffie]

I hate to agree with regent, and I still disagree with most of the things he is saying in this thread, but I do feel like SP's are op. They aren't warrior or mage op, or pre nerf bm hunter or demo lock op. But they are op nonetheless. People justify it by saying "we can't oneshot" But 120k flash heal crits, mass dispel, shields, life grip, life swap, all that cc makes them such a powerful class in arena. Most of the bad shamans rather play with a sp because if they make a mistake they get punished far less than a shaman in a team without a shadow priest.

Couldn't shock that poly? have a mass dispel. Don't have tremor for this fear? Mass dispel. In a really terrible spot being targetted by a mage who just deep freezed you? Mass dispel. Warrior popping all cds on you? life grip, shield, spam heal while faded so you don't get cced.

Apart from that they have really good damage that isn't cd dependant like most of the classes. In any comp to this date taking a random shadow priest is much better than taking a high skilled warlock for example. It makes the comp 30 times better. On top of it all they have fade and spectral guise so they are literally the worst target for casters. Life swap wouldn't be such a huge problem if shadow priests didn't have amazing abilities to survive on a really low cd.

This also makes shadow priests a very fun class to play, you have so many things you can do both defensively and offensively. I would totally reroll shadow priest right now if I could just for the fun playstyle. Most of the time the game lasts ages vs a shadow priest, even when they are losing you just can't score a kill. Its like playing vs 1,5 healers and 2 dps. SP games are like 3,5 vs 3.

If you defend that SP's are fine, then other classes should get the same sort of utility and support, especially the casters that you don't see in arena often these days like moonkins, ele shamans and warlocks.

TLDR; Sp's have way too many defensive cds, support spells and decent damage, covering up for their healers mistakes easily, but since they don't usually one shot, people let it slide and rather focus on warrior/mage damage, when in reality SP's are almost as OP.

Edited by saffie, 11 December 2012 - 12:20 PM.