100 replies to this topic

[bl00dlust]

how are dks?  frost or UH.  i havent really done much arena in mop yet besides capping in 2s.  and that seems like its just bm hunters or warriors.  but are dks good now?  ive only seen a few and didnt really notice if they were good or not

[Covlol]

Dks seem balanced, they are just in the shadow of warriors atm. I think with 5.1 some fotm warrior rerollers will drop warrior and dk will be seen more again.

[Zander]

Damage is great, survivability is shit, mobility is bad but it doesn't matter because you have good ranged now. The ability to offensively dispel and a 30 second dark sim was a really nice change.

[Knox556]

Zander, on 30 October 2012 - 10:56 PM, said:

Damage is great, survivability is shit, mobility is bad but it doesn't matter because you have good ranged now. The ability to offensively dispel and a 30 second dark sim was a really nice change.

Agreed, except for the survivability part.

Compared to other classes that just get globaled through all CD's, you can generally tank damage with your cds. With spam deathstrike, ice-bound, a really accessible blood presence, pet sac, and lichborne stacking with pvp power we do well.

I can't tell you how many times KFC's try to go on me and almost always fail to get a kill.

[Zander]

Knox556, on 31 October 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

Agreed, except for the survivability part.

Compared to other classes that just get globaled through all CD's, you can generally tank damage with your cds. With spam deathstrike, ice-bound, a really accessible blood presence, pet sac, and lichborne stacking with pvp power we do well.

I can't tell you how many times KFC's try to go on me and almost always fail to get a kill.

Have you had any issues with lichborne not allowing you to heal for the entire duration? I feel like death pact is 1 global of damage on me and even spamming death strike I just fall over.

[bl00dlust]

Knox556, on 31 October 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

Agreed, except for the survivability part.

Compared to other classes that just get globaled through all CD's, you can generally tank damage with your cds. With spam deathstrike, ice-bound, a really accessible blood presence, pet sac, and lichborne stacking with pvp power we do well.

I can't tell you how many times KFC's try to go on me and almost always fail to get a kill.

how is the change to death strike going to work?  can we just not do it ever or is it going to just give the 7% minimum back or whatever and just not go all the way up to 20%?

[originn]

Knox556, on 31 October 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

Agreed, except for the survivability part.

Compared to other classes that just get globaled through all CD's, you can generally tank damage with your cds. With spam deathstrike, ice-bound, a really accessible blood presence, pet sac, and lichborne stacking with pvp power we do well.

I can't tell you how many times KFC's try to go on me and almost always fail to get a kill.

HAIL TRAVELER

[Knox556]

Zander, on 31 October 2012 - 01:36 AM, said:

Have you had any issues with lichborne not allowing you to heal for the entire duration? I feel like death pact is 1 global of damage on me and even spamming death strike I just fall over.

lichborne is bugged, some abilities make it so you can't heal yourself, I know horn of winter is one of those abilities.

Death pact is more like 1 global of damage on you with like warrior/bm CD's, don't under rate it.

It's honestly not that hard to tell when you should be popping cds, icebound when stampede/avatar is up etc.

bl00dlust, on 31 October 2012 - 01:38 AM, said:

how is the change to death strike going to work?  can we just not do it ever or is it going to just give the 7% minimum back or whatever and just not go all the way up to 20%?

If they take that 7% minimum out of the game then I have lost all hope in this game, from what I understand though it looks like the 20% is being taken out.

originn, on 31 October 2012 - 03:24 AM, said:

HAIL TRAVELER

hai qtpi

[originn]

Knox556, on 31 October 2012 - 03:36 AM, said:

lichborne is bugged, some abilities make it so you can't heal yourself, I know horn of winter is one of those abilities.

Death pact is more like 1 global of damage on you with like warrior/bm CD's, don't under rate it.

It's honestly not that hard to tell when you should be popping cds, icebound when stampede/avatar is up etc.




If they take that 7% minimum out of the game then I have lost all hope in this game, from what I understand though it looks like the 20% is being taken out.

hai qtpi

+rep couse qt

[Vanguards]

I really feel like death knights main lack of success and representation is their lack of real peels / ccs or some kind of real compensation for it.

There's a few death knights finding success with Hunter / Death Knight / Healer and Warrior / Death Knight / Healer, but I think it's not exactly hard to see that the real strength behind those compositions isn't the Death Knight.

Sure they have deathgrip, strangulate on a 2minute cooldown, and possibly a stun on a 1 minute cooldown but if you compare that to other classes who are successful at the moment those abilities are a joke (Ring of Frost, Psyfiend). While I think there are far too many CCs in this game to add more, it also means that every class that doesn't have consistent CCs (Shockwave, Cyclone) either need a compensation or something else to make them competitive at top ladders. Ret paladins for example have good hybrid heals. Enhance shamans have a double purge, tremor, and other totems.

Death knights have... more raw damage I suppose. Usually more damage would be great but in a death knight's case their extra damage compared to a warrior for example are just meter padding cleave damage that is easily healable. While more damage is still always good, I don't think it's enough to compensate for the peels / ccs they lack and also their somewhat weaker defenses compared to the better classes.

[Knox556]

couldn't of said it better myself vanguards.

[Another]

Vanguards, on 31 October 2012 - 06:12 AM, said:

I really feel like death knights main lack of success and representation is their lack of real peels / ccs or some kind of real compensation for it.

There's a few death knights finding success with Hunter / Death Knight / Healer and Warrior / Death Knight / Healer, but I think it's not exactly hard to see that the real strength behind those compositions isn't the Death Knight.

Sure they have deathgrip, strangulate on a 2minute cooldown, and possibly a stun on a 1 minute cooldown but if you compare that to other classes who are successful at the moment those abilities are a joke (Ring of Frost, Psyfiend). While I think there are far too many CCs in this game to add more, it also means that every class that doesn't have consistent CCs (Shockwave, Cyclone) either need a compensation or something else to make them competitive at top ladders. Ret paladins for example have good hybrid heals. Enhance shamans have a double purge, tremor, and other totems.

Death knights have... more raw damage I suppose. Usually more damage would be great but in a death knight's case their extra damage compared to a warrior for example are just meter padding cleave damage that is easily healable. While more damage is still always good, I don't think it's enough to compensate for the peels / ccs they lack and also their somewhat weaker defenses compared to the better classes.

This is what I've been saying since MoP came out. Most dks think we are in good state though because they play shit like warr/dk/x or hunter/dk/x and do good with it but in reality they have no clue about this game.

[bighandxyz]

DA should be based line, or make it 100% when talented. I am sick of crawling to places when everyone is just throwing ccs and jumping all over the map

our obliterate dmg is too high though, especially if you're watching your swing timer. but luckily they probably will never nerf it because it would break frost spec in pve

Edited by bighandxyz, 31 October 2012 - 05:39 PM.

[Zander]

Knox556, on 31 October 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

couldn't of said it better myself vanguards.

He said somewhat weaker defenses!

bighandxyz, on 31 October 2012 - 05:37 PM, said:

our obliterate dmg is too high though, especially if you're watching your swing timer. but luckily they probably will never nerf it because it would break frost spec in pve

Nerf damage baseline, give it armor pen in pve, problem solved? Shame that they only do this with warriors.

Edited by Zander, 31 October 2012 - 05:43 PM.

[Knox556]

Zander, on 31 October 2012 - 05:41 PM, said:

He said somewhat weaker defenses!

compared to better classes yes.

they don't compare to a warriors CD's for example

[a1entity]

Well said Vanguards. As anotherx mentioned many DK's are delusional saying dk's are fine..
The only fine thing dks have is frost damage but what about everything else...

[sarma]

Another, on 31 October 2012 - 02:29 PM, said:

This is what I've been saying since MoP came out. Most dks think we are in good state though because they play shit like warr/dk/x or hunter/dk/x and do good with it but in reality they have no clue about this game.

So you are only one who got clue about game and shit?
Im sorry to interupt you but dk's are just fine , Id say lack of desecration and delay on dark sim ruined some fun for me but everything else is perfectly fine.Other classes may have op short cd instant cc aoe or non aoe cc expecially rof , psyfiend , shockwave or insert any op skill introduced in mop.Some classes have retardedly good excape mechanisms. But those will most likely be toned down at some point.So instead of discussing that you want a pony.
If dk had 2-3 spells like that I would 1v3 arenas in most of cases

[a1entity]

sarma, on 05 November 2012 - 07:36 AM, said:

So you are only one who got clue about game and shit?
Im sorry to interupt you but dk's are just fine , Id say lack of desecration and delay on dark sim ruined some fun for me but everything else is perfectly fine.Other classes may have op short cd instant cc aoe or non aoe cc expecially rof , psyfiend , shockwave or insert any op skill introduced in mop.Some classes have retardedly good excape mechanisms. But those will most likely be toned down at some point.So instead of discussing that you want a pony.
If dk had 2-3 spells like that I would 1v3 arenas in most of cases

I guess this is the reason that there are so many DK's on the ladder, because they fine, they have "everything balanced"....... Not like rank1 people know what they are saying, right ?

[Another]

sarma, on 05 November 2012 - 07:36 AM, said:

So you are only one who got clue about game and shit?
Im sorry to interupt you but dk's are just fine , Id say lack of desecration and delay on dark sim ruined some fun for me but everything else is perfectly fine.Other classes may have op short cd instant cc aoe or non aoe cc expecially rof , psyfiend , shockwave or insert any op skill introduced in mop.Some classes have retardedly good excape mechanisms. But those will most likely be toned down at some point.So instead of discussing that you want a pony.
If dk had 2-3 spells like that I would 1v3 arenas in most of cases

dks are not fine, and yea just from your post I can see you dont know shit about the game

[Regent]

Is Undead or Orc better for frost?