Real men play rogue or priest
Posted 16 October 2012 - 09:29 PM
I think you might be missing something important. The scene needs both but there is a key component in both Ming and other successful games that I'm not sure is being accounted for.
1. TL and Reddit for SC2- the perfect example. TL brings a centralized hub for events and formal thoughts about upcoming elite level events (read: korean) by staff writers. The forums are heavily moderated and such things. Reddit brings other news, discussion, esports news, memes, images, youtube links, stream links (for the unpopular/uncommon streamers) and almost no moderating (outside of down votes etc).
2. AJ + WoM circa WoM existing- People went to WoM for drama and the occasional 1/1000 useful posts and AJ was (relatively more) serious. AJ doesn't equate to TL by any means, but there was still a division in expectations (ofc threads like the MS Paint Rage thread which mostly was there for laughs and silent class battles).
Both examples obviously use two different exclusive hubs and I think that is important to note, Hilde. I first read your post and thought it was actually funny how it could be so blatantly biased, but I realized that AJ =/= Old AJ =/= TL. I think this is also demonstrated in all the "what happened to this site posts,"- clearly AJ must not be what it used to be. Additionally, it doesn't really seem like AJ has formally said what its direction is. Things are slow moving and the site doesn't progress to fast or with much direction (probably attributed to the state of the scene and the dev's shitty way of developing pvp).
As a last thought, although your journalistic points are valid, I'm not convinced that AJ can really do a mix of both drama and serious content. The points made before are valid- a front page post with shots being fired etc while also providing content traffic for a well known player. Yes, it brings traffic. And yes it is confusing for the many people who have been here forever, who have been used to this site as being a forum for game discussion and thoughts, not random fanboying by staff members. The journalistic viewpoint/arguments you gave are true- drama brings traffic etc, but I'm not sure if AJ wants to try and be the only central hub for pvp, as well as the hub for all of its drama. If it does, I think it should be made more clear that a transition in direction of the site was/has been made, as I don't ever recall AJ being as bad as it is currently (little game discussion with large increases of traffic for s11 drama threads).
tl;dr: Not sure if one website being the drama + news/game discussion is what AJ wants (is? is going for? w/e fuck.)
Good post. Like it. The point was to combine something provoking with solid content. The video is pretty decent and the rest simply worked. I understand the points very well and I like them. But I think there is a huge difference for what people are flamed and I think attacking whining is a valid choice.
Now regarding the community. I actually talked about that with Hotted in the unreleased interview. There are a lot of content creators that avoid AJ for the fact that they are flamed here. The scene is build on bragging rights and denying bragging rights of others in the mid-tier of players that never really got to the top. In SC2 there is one simple fact: If you lose, you are worse. In WoW it's Blizzard, the team-mates, lag, the overpowered enemy comp etc. Players rarely take responsibility (something that separates good from top players in my opinion). In addition to that the mid-tier of the scene is full of pay-to-win-boosted chars. This corruption in which basically every top player takes part takes away true competition and it's very hard for new players to get to the top. If you look around there are basically no top-end players that started with Cataclysm.
Calling people out on these things causes drama. It causes flames. But I think it is absolutely important to call out whining, to attack boosters for their shitty corruption, to name wintraders, DDOSers and all the other shit that is used to destroy competition. In my opinion only tournaments can bring back the scene. Why I posted this is video is a simple message: Stop whining and try to win despite the odds. Winning as underdog is the simple most exciting thing in any competitive game or sport. Disc priests and rogues are the underdogs right now and Khuna showed to some degree that winning is still possible.
You can flame me, tell AJ to kick me, hate on me, but you won't change my drive to make the WoW PvP community better, more competitive and closer to the SC2 community than it currently is. Right now we are working on tournaments. You can see the first result with Vadrak's tournament UI on Friday during the King of the Hill tournament. I don't know what could be more constructive than organizing a tournament team, creating the UI, looking for sponsors, writing guides and promoting this here and on other places in the web.
Posted 17 October 2012 - 03:34 AM
Posted 17 October 2012 - 06:39 AM
Edited by Aniroxlol, 17 October 2012 - 07:24 AM.
Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:32 AM
Your "fight" is right Hilde, and what you're trying to achieve is a great hope for WoW PvP community.
I think that's why we both reacted : the content is good, the style is wrong (and it's not only the news itself but also the whole behaviour behind what you're trying to achieve).
By flaming people (even if they're whiners or you think they diserve it and it's not that important), you're taking the wrong way.
You're siding with "fighting fire with fire". That could be relevant in another context.
If a newspaper flames readers someday, or goes sarcastic one day, how can you trust news the day after ? That's the exact same thing here imo.
You made a metaphor with football / soccer. And I'll wrong-foot you :
There's a difference between fan drunk wars in bars and the show I watch on TV every monday. When I argue with friends or random people in a bar, I know everything is subjective. It's fun, passionate, entertaining, but not accurate.
That's the exact same difference I'd like to find somewhere on the internet regarding WoW PvP. Blizzard (in fact GC) has the always same annoying answer "PvP is all about subjectivity, we can't read what you say". I hope some website on planet earth can show him how much he is wrong. And I think this starts with everyone's effort. Introducing this video as you did in comments "Watch how you can succeed as an underdog, 'cause everyone agrees disc is broken" is a good way to start showing Blizzard "Hi, we're there ! If you don't care about PvP, WE do".
If I was GC (god I hope not) I wouldn't take that news seriously because of its sarcastic tone. And that's imho, a pity.
Posted 17 October 2012 - 07:50 PM
Posted 17 October 2012 - 10:14 PM
I wanna make a quick shoutout to Ghostcrawler. Thank you, you are doing a great job, I never thought I would be able to play BM again, atleast on tr.
Posted 18 October 2012 - 04:00 PM
Tell me the reason why Khuna can't comparing himself to Reckful, just because he don't have fucking 2mil view ? Or because he doesn't have 7k viewers ? As a players perspective Khuna is twice better than him but w/e fucking blind people it's so disgusting
Posted 18 October 2012 - 09:53 PM
Posted 18 October 2012 - 10:04 PM
Its not like hes doing something when hes pointing at some rogues complaining about life, and sharing someone ealse work.
Also its good to be objective about what you see/read!
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Posted 19 October 2012 - 07:43 AM
I would like to say I enjoyed watching this video - even if posted in wrong section, it's not like useful content is flooding on these forums.
I have played some 2s with a mage so I usually die really fast, alot faster than I used to before so it surely takes some time to learn new routines etc. Never tried paralytic poison yet so thanks for showing it!
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