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Rogue Nerfs

Was it too much?

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#41 Jaadyn

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 03:50 AM

View PostVirral, on 02 September 2012 - 02:43 AM, said:

But then they'd nerf the cooldown or raise the energy cost of ShS because root break is really the only reason people take burst of speed over step, not sure if it would be worth it.


Actually, it didn't break roots in TBC. I don't think, anyways.. it's been a long ass time now. It was just usable while rooted. So it'll allow that kick or gouge or kidney, or stepping to safety to a friendly target, albeit still being in the root.

Dunno. To be honest, people can say "We'll wait until 90 to see how it is before we whine" all they want to, but the way it is now, rogues truly do need some work. Backstab/mute specs suffer a lot to since the crippling nerf, and herpderp  shiv cooldown.

...by the way, are we now the only class who had a spammable snare, that's no longer able to be used on demand any longer? Weee.

#42 Pootius_6592477

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:45 AM

View PostJaadyn, on 30 August 2012 - 02:07 AM, said:

I'll say one thing for certain. I feel like rogues are faced with the toughest tier of talents between Prep/ShS/BoS.  For a few reasons.

We all can agree that rogues are one of the best control classes in the game, but this mainly comes from our utility as subtlety (dance, prep, ShS, HaT procs and deadly throw, throw proccing poisons, and previously no CD on shiv, and, well, our prior 70% snare from crip). A lot of that is gone now. We can't take both prep and step anymore. Burst of speed is AMAAAAZING... except for the fact that it cost half our energy bar and rogues are much less bursty than most other classes. Casters are extremely strong right now for a few reasons. They got huge survivability CDs, more tools to kite and hard CC with, and most of all, defensive dispels have an 8 second cooldown. That also hurts rogues.

^ So why is the 8sec dispel CD hurtful? Double fear from priest, million mage novas, multi fears from locks, etc. Rogues don't and won't put out more damage than those classes especially due to the amount of control they have and when we're forced into countless amounts of CC unable to control our character, derp derp. We have to take prep or burst of speed. I dunno... I just don't like it.

Give me 1 minute cloak back pl0x. Or reduce the energy cost on BoS. AND GIVE DEADLY THROW BACK AS A BASELINE ABILITY.   -_-

JK Dead in a dance

#43 infectionx

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 07:13 AM

View PostHyrmine, on 30 August 2012 - 01:11 PM, said:

Don't cry so much. Rogues have never been bad for long, wait and see. (and level until MoP)
This is wrong in so many levels,it;s not just about rogues but every class and specc that is meant to be playable in pvp.
Should anyone be forced to be considerably weaker than others just because it's the way things used to be?

I will not try out mop ulti i hear good things and/or have friend's to play with,regardless i would not like to find my favourite class in the state resto druid's have been forced for nearly a year.
p.s:the first 2sentences have never been true for mages and locks :D.
Restoration shamans in season 11 According to
Felic:
And yeah they can survive for more than 30 seconds without casting. You have partners in 3v3 you know? SURPRISE

#44 infectionx

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 07:18 AM

View PostSlower, on 01 September 2012 - 01:36 AM, said:

... so your comparing mages to rogues last season?
Are you actually serious?
Please tell me you are not,by no means rogues were not broken-especially in pve gear(everyone in hc pve gear was disgusting to be fair).
Frost mages were a top notch specc but fire mages,FUCK fire mages.
Rng at it's best,macestun on demand,aoe cc who does not break on dot dmg on 20sec cd and the possibility to solo an entire team,all this while jumping around casting scorch and instant spells only and still being top damage anyway.

Fuck fire mages xd.
Restoration shamans in season 11 According to
Felic:
And yeah they can survive for more than 30 seconds without casting. You have partners in 3v3 you know? SURPRISE

#45 sharkoulolz

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 07:36 AM

Quote

i think waiting until MoP before whining is the best thing to do, rogue were always shit in every patch before expansion (be4 wotlk + cata ) damage wise at least, more than other classes

^ this

stop whining and wait for mop, also rogue is really good playable atm u just have to play right stop spamming this backstab shit.

#46 Tsx

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 08:35 AM

View Postinfectionx, on 02 September 2012 - 07:18 AM, said:

Are you actually serious?
Please tell me you are not,by no means rogues were not broken-especially in pve gear(everyone in hc pve gear was disgusting to be fair).
Frost mages were a top notch specc but fire mages,FUCK fire mages.
Rng at it's best,macestun on demand,aoe cc who does not break on dot dmg on 20sec cd and the possibility to solo an entire team,all this while jumping around casting scorch and instant spells only and still being top damage anyway.

Fuck fire mages xd.
take a look at ladders and tell me what u see , wow all rogues think that their class was fine in s11, is this real life???

#47 infectionx

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:20 PM

View PostYarmyxx, on 03 September 2012 - 08:35 AM, said:

take a look at ladders and tell me what u see , wow all rogues think that their class was fine in s11, is this real life???
You don't know how to read, do you ?
Check again.

View Postinfectionx, on 02 September 2012 - 07:18 AM, said:

Are you actually serious?
Please tell me you are not,by no means rogues were not broken-especially in pve gear(everyone in hc pve gear was disgusting to be fair).
Frost mages were a top notch specc but fire mages,FUCK fire mages.
Rng at it's best,macestun on demand,aoe cc who does not break on dot dmg on 20sec cd and the possibility to solo an entire team,all this while jumping around casting scorch and instant spells only and still being top damage anyway.

Fuck fire mages xd.

Restoration shamans in season 11 According to
Felic:
And yeah they can survive for more than 30 seconds without casting. You have partners in 3v3 you know? SURPRISE

#48 Pmotion

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:30 PM

i dont know if anyone else has looked at the pvp 4 set bonus for rogues, but whenever you apply any poison you also apply crippling. So theere goes that crippling issue : P

Edited by Pmotion, 03 September 2012 - 01:30 PM.


#49 Warrlokk

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:37 PM

View PostPmotion, on 03 September 2012 - 01:30 PM, said:

i dont know if anyone else has looked at the pvp 4 set bonus for rogues, but whenever you apply any poison you also apply crippling. So theere goes that crippling issue : P

Crippling hasn't been an issue to me so far, to me its been the lack of deadly throw as a baseline ability. Having to pick CR over DT has absurd and I personally think an interesting change would be to swap CR and BoS in the talent tree. So you have to chose whether you want BoS or DT as a gap closer and Prep vs CR for a defensive
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#50 infectionx

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:56 PM

Crippling idd has never been a real issue but honestly shadowstep should have been a baseline ability for rogues, one can only dream i guess :(.
Restoration shamans in season 11 According to
Felic:
And yeah they can survive for more than 30 seconds without casting. You have partners in 3v3 you know? SURPRISE

#51 Enteyjin

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 02:36 PM

time for payback :deathknight: }===D --> ( ( ) :rogue:

#52 Secksonlegs

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 02:41 PM

Well I don't think any class deserves to be subpar, but let's get something straight. Several posts on this thread were about rogues being OP only when in PvE gear which was just not true. Try to be unbiased here and just look at the control, peels, damage and survivability of  rogues last season even with normal PvP gear and you'll understand why they needed toning down. If it's too far - I'm sure they will fix it, but don't kid yourselves that only PvE gear made you OP. In fact you were allowed to wear that much PvE gear BECAUSE you were overpowered no the other way around.

Also what Enteyjin said :D

#53 infectionx

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 03:03 PM

Rogue survivibility seemd fine to me but that has to be because i could solo other rogues with ease xD
Restoration shamans in season 11 According to
Felic:
And yeah they can survive for more than 30 seconds without casting. You have partners in 3v3 you know? SURPRISE

#54 Redefined

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:25 PM

View PostSecksonlegs, on 03 September 2012 - 02:41 PM, said:

Well I don't think any class deserves to be subpar, but let's get something straight. Several posts on this thread were about rogues being OP only when in PvE gear which was just not true. Try to be unbiased here and just look at the control, peels, damage and survivability of  rogues last season even with normal PvP gear and you'll understand why they needed toning down. If it's too far - I'm sure they will fix it, but don't kid yourselves that only PvE gear made you OP. In fact you were allowed to wear that much PvE gear BECAUSE you were overpowered no the other way around.

Also what Enteyjin said :D

No, it's still the PvE gear that made us overpowered. Without it, we were very good still, but not propelled into the next tier/level.
------------------------------

Kzrs said:

I've never seen Redefined post anything dumb. +1

View PostXandyn, on 27 May 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

best Rogue on US

#55 Enteyjin

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:38 PM

View PostRedefined, on 03 September 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

No, it's still the PvE gear that made us overpowered. Without it, we were very good still, but not propelled into the next tier/level.

do u mean the pve gear which was hard to get? dude ive seen more rogues with orange than without

#56 flannelsoff

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:39 PM

i might cry

#57 Redefined

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 05:19 PM

View PostEnteyjin, on 03 September 2012 - 04:38 PM, said:

do u mean the pve gear which was hard to get? dude ive seen more rogues with orange than without

Agreed, It was too easy to get. And it was overpowered for those who had it. I'm saying without it, we were in a good spot.
------------------------------

Kzrs said:

I've never seen Redefined post anything dumb. +1

View PostXandyn, on 27 May 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

best Rogue on US

#58 Bigpapapump

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 06:37 PM

ITT retard mages callling rogues overpowered. Lol, irony anyone? Rogues were fine in full pvp gear, albeit not many ran it esp without legendaries, but fire mages were just disgusting. Please don't speak mages that just hit 2400 last season, do you really think it was because of your amazing skill you got your first? :duckers:

#59 Warrlokk

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 02:34 AM

View PostBigpapapump, on 03 September 2012 - 06:37 PM, said:

ITT retard mages callling rogues overpowered. Lol, irony anyone? Rogues were fine in full pvp gear, albeit not many ran it esp without legendaries, but fire mages were just disgusting. Please don't speak mages that just hit 2400 last season, do you really think it was because of your amazing skill you got your first? :duckers:

Don't forget :deathknight: running vanguards cleave, tunnelling the healer all game
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#60 Secksonlegs

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 06:57 AM


View PostRedefined, on 03 September 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

No, it's still the PvE gear that made us overpowered. Without it, we were very good still, but not propelled into the next tier/level.
Well yes, ok, you were in a good spot but still needed some slight nerfs on some mechanics. Maybe I exaggerated with the word OP :)  But I don't think they will leave rogues in a bad spot as that's almost never really happened, even when it did they got buffed later on. As much as I hate rogues (I'm a DK can't be helped) I hope they are not useless as this would just mean Blizzard is doing a shit job with balancing again and ruin my hopes of MoP new beginnings

Edited by Secksonlegs, 04 September 2012 - 07:14 AM.





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