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Guild Wars 2 Movement

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#1 idevpro

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 01:33 AM

So, i have been checking MMO-Champion and AJ from time to time since i quitted time during Cataclysm, i was checking if the game is going to be any better, then i was going for D3, but no pvp, then i thought to wait for MoP since ppl seems to have some hopes in it to bring back the good wow days, i was going to pre-order it when i saw topic here about GW2 and ppl discussing what they like/dislike in the game, so i thought i should give it a shot, i saw some videos and i liked it, worth the try.

To get to the point, i tried it the 3 stress tests only, and i was confused, the game is cool, the questing is fun, skills are creative and effects are cool, but the game mechanism and character movement, jumping, animation and camera seems clunky and itchy, it is not smooth as WoW, you can't do the cool stuff while fighting anymore, yea there is a roll move which is nice, to dodge things, but i mean it seems to be heavy, the graphics were not as i was expecting too, dunno if its because stress test have lower config or not.

Now i am confused, i bought the game already, but i am not as excited as i was anymore for the release, i am thinking to go back and play the game i know is not so cool anymore, but at least you enjoy how smooth it is when you play..

Give me your thoughts and do you believe this could change in the future, or its more like how the game is structured to be, its engine.

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#2 bookworm438

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 02:03 AM

You played during a stress test when there is a ton of lag. Of course it's going to seem clunky, as they are trying to break what ever they are stress testing. And they are just getting to the point where they are optimizing the engine. BTW have you checked your graphics settings?

What do you mean you can't do "the cool stuff while fighting anymore". You can move and cast at the same time.

Animations seem pretty solid to me. I should remind you that if you are using your number 1 skill on auto-attack, all skills MUST complete the animation of the current skill before the next skill can begin. That's why combat may seem clunky. If the animation for your number one as already begun, it must get to a certain point in the animation for the next skill you queued up to begin. Again, it's not like WoW with the global cool down. A lot of us have found that if you come from a game that uses a GCD, the game does seem clunky. I forget the explanation for it, but we had a long discussion on this over at MMORPG. It has to do with how your perceive your skill bar with a GCD. I'll try to find that thread. (And btw, dodge is integral to the game. If you don't properly use dodge, you will die. ArenaNet didn't just tack it on)


EDIT #1: Turn of auto-attack (ctrl + right click skill number 1). As I said auto-attack causes quite a bit of the perceived clunkiness, as it has to do with how the animations work. The convenience of auto-attack comes at the price of control.

EDIT #2: I found it.
"
In WoW, many of the skills are instant cast, and when you press the key to execute those skills you get instant feedback that the skill did damage (regardless of what the animation is doing), whereas in GW2 when you press the key to execute your skills there's an animation associated with it and the skill doesn't actually land until it visually connects with the target.  So there's a delay between when you start the skill and when you get that feedback of it doing damage.
However, there's a major drawback to the WoW system.  In order to balance that instant gratification responsiveness, they had to interject a false delay between successive skills... the global cooldown (GCD).  GW2 does not use a GCD system but instead each skill has a cast time, even if it's very brief.  So what's happening in the two systems is this: for WoW you get key press, damage, delay... key press, damage, delay; but for GW2 you get key press, delay, damage... key press, delay, damage.
"
Every skill in GW2 has a casting time, even if it's very small. Even melee attacks have a casting time (the animation).  So you are probably experience this, as well as skill queuing (when you press a skill while another is in progress, it goes into a queue).

EDIT #3: If your referring to the sliding effect while running, yeah I know about that :/. It's something I hope they fix in the future.

And you forget the graphics are designed for DX9, and designed to run on 2009 midrange computers. They aren't going to be the best ever. However, their art style is amazing imo.

#3 Guest_Enshadowed_TP_*

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 02:28 AM

Yeah, unlucky to play solely during stress tests. It's the worse time to play performance wise.

#4 Shrouds

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 02:28 AM

I think it's going to suck because they focus on cosmetic rewards which basically don't drive players to do anything. It's just like why WoW sucks now.


#5 bookworm438

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 03:02 AM

View PostShrouds, on 11 August 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

I think it's going to suck because they focus on cosmetic rewards which basically don't drive players to do anything. It's just like why WoW sucks now.

WoW sucks now because it's old. WoW is 7 almost 8 years old. People dislike it now because they are growing bored with it. Think about it, if you played for at least 6 out of those 7 years, that's A LOT of time. Most things will seem boring after 6 years. Not to mention there's really nothing to do other than raiding or PvP. With the way they have questing set up now, there really is very little reason to go back out into the regular world other than to gather mats for crafting.

There is a gear grind. But it's small, and more horizontal rather than vertical. Exotic gear is the best gear in the game stats wise. You have legendary gear, which are incredibly rare and can only be obtained from the mystic forge, but that has the stats of exotic gear. Exotic gear can be obtained from crafting, dungeons, mystic forge, and one more thing. So you do have to work a little bit to get the best gear in the game, with the stat distribution you want.

People don't need a constantly increasing gear progression to drive them. Their own self interests can drive them. There is a lot to do in GW2, and a little bit there for everyone from the completionists to the explorers(especially the explorers) to the hardcore PvPers. You have no idea the lengths people will go to get a look and stat distribution they want. And with GW2 and transmutation stones, you actually CAN do that.

Increasing power gear progression won't be in GW2 competitive PvP. sPvP is meant to be based around skill, with very little factoring into it -- how you build your character is part of that skill. And games such as LoL have shown that there is a market for people who want to jump into PvP and not feel like they are gimped because they haven't played since the expansion was released. The best part about GW2 PvP (except for WvW), you can jump in without playing PvE. If you aren't interested in PvE, you don't have to play it. PvP does have gear unlocks, which are cosmetic in nature.

#6 downedlolidiot

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 09:06 AM

View PostShrouds, on 11 August 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

I think it's going to suck because they focus on cosmetic rewards which basically don't drive players to do anything. It's just like why WoW sucks now.

Ye they should make it so people can get items like Shadowmourne, H ICC trinkets, glaives, 4pc/4pc

#7 idevpro

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 09:18 AM

I have had my settings on high, some on ultra.. but it didn't matter much if i increase/decrease it.

Yea, maybe because its a stress test, some people in the game told me they are not activating the VGA of game while stress testing, dunno whats the mean tbh.

But yea i can't wait to see the game in the first few days, i am really liking it and i like the way things are done, it so fun.

what i mean you can't do the cool stuff while fighting, you can't move around with the camera and character as fast as you did in wow, for example, in wow people used to dodge Gouge, avoid dmging from behind, just because the game gives you that flexibility to pretty much do anything you like anytime you want, without losing penalty or drawback.

Dunno.. i will just wait and see.
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#8 Lazarast

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 09:28 AM

Just wanted to leave my two cents...

Game feels clunky and diferent, specially after so many years of wow. But when you play a couple of days, you start feeling you understand everything is happening in the battle field. If you play a little with all profesions it starts to feel rewarding and not confusing.

By the way, dodge is the best PvP mechanic I've ever played. Once you gain control of dodge it's so awesome. Then, you try other games and you try to dodge but you can't... so sad.

If you bought the game, don't worry. You won't have to buy anything else untill 2 or 3 years. So you have plenty of time to play it and for free. You can play other games too at the same time.

For myself, I'll only play gw2 for now.

Cheers.

#9 Sycthrex

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 11:15 AM

You might of played during the stress test that lowered everyone's GFX settings and had to 'auto detect' to improve them again.

#10 SaiRee

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 01:13 PM

View PostShrouds, on 11 August 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

I think it's going to suck because they focus on cosmetic rewards which basically don't drive players to do anything. It's just like why WoW sucks now.

This is the arenajunkies forum - it's about sPvP. Why do you complain that you have to grind for pve/cosmetics? In WoW you have to grind to get your gear on par else you're dead before you can even start, and you're always behind on anyone that plays longer than you. In GW2 everyone starts sPvP with the same gear. All that matters is skill.

#11 ValorLotD

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 01:41 PM

So many people have not started playing a SUCCESSFUL new game in so long that we have all forgotten that MMO's tend to start out new and different.  The playstyle to excel feels awkward at first and that is uncomfortable.  What those who have played the game more will come to realize is that it is just takes a few weeks to REALLY acclimate to the new game/mechanics/settings.

You may think it feels clumsy compared to WOW (And it may be, but blizzard has had 8 years of polish), but more than likely you are just unaccustomed to this particular game.
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#12 rokablaster

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 01:59 PM

Don't fall in to despair yet ;)
I felt the same  "clunkiness" coming from WoW, where you can jump around and spam abilitys like a mad man. But after a day or two i got used to it and didn't even notice the difference. Now i can't imagine playing without dodge.

The whole so called clunkiness has a valid reason to be in the game tho. You are not staring at enemys cast bars to know how to react, you are looking at the animations. When a big ass hammer is starting to swing, you know it's better to dodge. If the abilitys wouldn't have that delay and were instant, dodge would be obsolete.
Also skill queueing encourages you to NOT spam abilitys and be more carefull with timing and awereness of the range.

I think Ctuhlu said it the best in some other thread. You won't see rangers running around doing 180 jumps with instant abilitys and kiting you for all eternity. There is a clear difference between fleeing and kiting, wich i find to be very nice concept.

Play the game, not the UI ;)
That's why the abilitys are animation based.

#13 Sternzy

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 02:42 PM

View Postidevpro, on 11 August 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

what i mean you can't do the cool stuff while fighting, you can't move around with the camera and character as fast as you did in wow, for example, in wow people used to dodge Gouge, avoid dmging from behind, just because the game gives you that flexibility to pretty much do anything you like anytime you want, without losing penalty or drawback.

Sounds like you need to enable "free looking", if I remember correctly that was also a setting in world of warcraft under "camera". I imagine GW2 probably has that as well, though I haven't looked for it yet.

Aside from that, as you mentioned a "stress test" is not where you should be forming any sort of opinion about a game.

There was aslo horrible rubber-banding during the last stress test for a majority of the players. This was later associated with bad network interferance somewhere between the effected users and the game servers.

#14 Hyrmine

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 02:52 PM

When I first started playing the GW2 beta I also had to change cam settings and then it was PERFCT just like it is in WoW. Check options instead of whining about camera.

#15 Ascleph

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 03:30 PM

View Postidevpro, on 11 August 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

what i mean you can't do the cool stuff while fighting, you can't move around with the camera and character as fast as you did in wow, for example, in wow people used to dodge Gouge, avoid dmging from behind, just because the game gives you that flexibility to pretty much do anything you like anytime you want, without losing penalty or drawback.

Dunno.. i will just wait and see.
Theres a camera movement slider and theres stuff to dodge like the ranger great sword stun from behind.

#16 Lufi

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 03:47 PM

View PostHyrmine, on 11 August 2012 - 02:52 PM, said:

When I first started playing the GW2 beta I also had to change cam settings and then it was PERFCT just like it is in WoW. Check options instead of whining about camera.

Same. Just changed some settings and it was instant rotating like in WoW. Tested 2 days ago during stress test.

Regarding jumping, I think it's acctually one of the best things in this game, it's very precise and feels more realistic. Thats why there is so many jumping puzzles and mini-jumping puzzles.

#17 Seacod

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 04:40 PM

Lol, thanks guys... I didn't know you could make the camera more responsive. Was looking for something like this.

#18 Shrouds

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 06:05 PM

View PostSaiRee, on 11 August 2012 - 01:13 PM, said:

This is the arenajunkies forum - it's about sPvP. Why do you complain that you have to grind for pve/cosmetics? In WoW you have to grind to get your gear on par else you're dead before you can even start, and you're always behind on anyone that plays longer than you. In GW2 everyone starts sPvP with the same gear. All that matters is skill.
because in WoW, all that matter is skill now right? And it's boring as HELL. That's what people don't get. You can never 100% balance it and it's fine. However, if there's something that's WORTH getting and hard to reach, then that's what'll keep you playing.

#19 Hyrmine

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 08:23 PM

Good to see my thread made someone buy GW2 :)

#20 Unimpressive

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 08:34 PM

View PostShrouds, on 11 August 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

because in WoW, all that matter is skill now right? And it's boring as HELL. That's what people don't get. You can never 100% balance it and it's fine. However, if there's something that's WORTH getting and hard to reach, then that's what'll keep you playing.

Uh... no. Gear in WoW is just as important (probably even more so) as it ever was. It is just easier to obtain. That argument that people need to become more powerful by obtaining items is baseless. Have you ever heard of the FPS Genre? RTS? MOBA?

I agree with you that there needs to be something to strive for, however tournament wins/rank/bragging rights fill that role better than slightly increased numbers on gear ever would.




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