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#1 Xessi

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 09:30 PM

A lot of people have been saying that blizzard should add a rating decay system to make the ladders more active.
I doubt they will ever implement it because there will be a lot whining (due to losing rating without losing games etc)

So what about a bonus pool system like in sc2?
Lets say the team gains an amount of points (bonus pool) every hour and it caps at 200 for example.
Every time you win a ladder game you'll gain extra rating from your bonus pool and this will make it a lot easier to catch up with the campers.
Ratings will skyrocket to like 4k+ though but that shouldn't really matter

The cap on the amount of personal rating gained every win should be removed too, otherwise it will take forever for your PR to catch up to the team rating that can be 3.8k for example.

This is just an idea me & a friend had, we didn't really work it out yet.
It would fuck up rating based rewards though, don't know a solution for that
( http://i.imgur.com/Ym3mB.jpg maybe? )

& Also, you should be able to join 2 or 3 teams in every bracket and only make the highest rated team count for pts every week and titles at the end of the season


Do you think something like that could work? Any problems that could arise that we missed?
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#2 Ctuhlu

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:17 AM

I don't think rating decay would help at all. People would just wait till the last two weeks of the season to play games, since their "work" would be "a waste of time" if they grind rating early on. Essentially it would create the exact same stagnation that currently plagues the ladder.

The problem with the arena system is that you don't have to play consistently. Right now you can grind games at the start of the season and sit, or you can play all the time, or you just play in the last two weeks. Of course this is in regards to attaining the gladiator title.

It's basically like the New York Rangers playing six games at the start of the season and winning them all, and then going "yeah guys we're just gonna stay undefeated and stop playing for the rest of the season, gl guys". And then after 82 games for the other teams the NHL looks at the Rangers's record and goes "well they're undefeated and nobody else is so we'll give them 1st place". That's basically what the ladder system encourages (or the opposite, where the Los Angeles Kings win the last 5 games of the season and they somehow get first). Of course there are going to be shenanigans.

I don't know what the solution is. Maybe it's to require a certain amount of games played over the course of a season. Say, 200 games. But of course that creates the problem of being unable to teamhop at all. But it also combats wintrading and other faggery since it would take a hell of a lot more time to accomplish. Personally I think there should be a minimum requirement of games played, along with the ability to have multiple 3v3 teams.

Fourreur said:

we have to switch to them making the decision to pop reck or not to pop reck

#3 Seu

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:24 AM

i think bonus pool would be sick, as well as just having one ladder. I dont think the game is active enough for 9 bgs or however many we have, if it was just 1 bg with daily bonus pool it would probably be competitive again.

#4 jaredd

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:24 AM

View PostCtuhlu, on 18 July 2012 - 02:17 AM, said:

I don't think rating decay would help at all. People would just wait till the last two weeks of the season to play games, since their "work" would be "a waste of time" if they grind rating early on. Essentially it would create the exact same stagnation that currently plagues the ladder.

The problem with the arena system is that you don't have to play consistently. Right now you can grind games at the start of the season and sit, or you can play all the time, or you just play in the last two weeks. Of course this is in regards to attaining the gladiator title.

It's basically like the New York Rangers playing six games at the start of the season and winning them all, and then going "yeah guys we're just gonna stay undefeated and stop playing for the rest of the season, gl guys". And then after 82 games for the other teams the NHL looks at the Rangers's record and goes "well they're undefeated and nobody else is so we'll give them 1st place". That's basically what the ladder system encourages (or the opposite, where the Los Angeles Kings win the last 5 games of the season and they somehow get first). Of course there are going to be shenanigans.

I don't know what the solution is. Maybe it's to require a certain amount of games played over the course of a season. Say, 200 games. But of course that creates the problem of being unable to teamhop at all. But it also combats wintrading and other faggery since it would take a hell of a lot more time to accomplish. Personally I think there should be a minimum requirement of games played, along with the ability to have multiple 3v3 teams.

ctrl+f gw2, guild wars... no results. what the fuck man, youre slacking off

#5 Ctuhlu

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:48 AM

View Postjaredd, on 18 July 2012 - 02:24 AM, said:

ctrl+f gw2, guild wars... no results. what the fuck man, youre slacking off

:duckers:

Fourreur said:

we have to switch to them making the decision to pop reck or not to pop reck

#6 Azorex

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:57 AM

this is something that has annoyed me for the last 2 seasons tbh...i hate that the top 30 or so teams are either 1 person teams camping, or are inactive teams camping with the option of replaying to top off that rating in the last few weeks. IMO i dont mind the latter half as much.

I think that the best way to combat the way this works is have some sort of cut off, like with the TR, at which people would have to start playing for the ladder for the end "prizes". This way people can do all the gear up and team hopping they like, practising what they want, finding out what is viable and what isnt...and then when it comes to, lets say the last 2months, everyone has that 2 month period where they can get a team to go for what they want at the end. This would keep the ladder fairly active throughout the season as the gear-up period will be around 2months? and then 2months as the end of season period....and the hope is that the middle part isnt too long/too inactive.

I dont think theres actually anyone in those top ratings that cant do the same thing in the last 2months as they do the first 2 weeks, so why not make it so they have to do it while everyone has the same opportunity? ie...all fully geared, all have team mates ready for a push, etc etc....

INB4 "but maybe people cant play at the last 2months so miss out"....same goes for the first 2 weeks, yet the same people seem to be able to play 2-3+ teams to the top 50 of ladders....therefore encouraging more boosts/ more win trading as a result to combat the boosts, and also higher chances of abusers of mmr (just like from s10 transition with s9 mmr).

Edited by Azorex, 18 July 2012 - 03:01 AM.


#7 Chromix

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 03:08 AM

That would be a big enough change that it would probably make even more sense to just revamp the entire ladder system that they currently have, which is already kind of out of date.

#8 mullieman003

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 06:25 AM

Remove Battlegroups,
Strip 5v5 Titles.

Game just became 500x better.
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#9 Justwoo

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 06:35 AM

ye cats be thirsty
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#10 Domesauce

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 06:54 AM

It doesn't need to be any more complicated than having a system where rating inflates over time. I guess if they need to add a bonus to counteract the way their penalty fucks the ladders then it'd be fine.

#11 cubas

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 07:44 AM

Merge BGs

Give some sort of reward (pet, mount, armor tier for transmog etc.) for every 200 rating all the way up to 3k so majority of players (not the top few percent of AJ) has a reason to play and to aim for something. Give tabards back. Make more arena achievements.

This should imo make the ladder more active and make way more people play arena, therefore blizzard will focus more on it.
:rogue: kidz

#12 WildeHilde

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 08:05 AM

Merging BGs and removing 5v5 titles is the best idea in my opinion. A slow rating decay sounds good, too.

#13 Filovirus

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:02 AM

View PostWildeHilde, on 18 July 2012 - 08:05 AM, said:

Merging BGs and removing 5v5 titles is the best idea in my opinion. A slow rating decay sounds good, too.

What good would it be to remove titles from 5v5? If anything, I think it would be awesome if that bracket was more active!

Edit: I think there are what, 3-5 glad titles per battlegroup from 5v5 right now? I really don't think removing titles from 5v5 would result in a more active 3v3 bracket.

Edited by Filovirus, 18 July 2012 - 11:03 AM.


#14 Smiercx

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:04 AM

It's not necessary to merge all BGs into 1 big BG, Blizzard can remove the inactive ones ( e.g. Vindication, Vengeance ) and merge these to the more active, i.e. Misery / Cyclone.
Removing 5v5 titles would definitely help cus it's just as ( if not more ) retarded as 2v2 atm -> 5s glads / r1's can't even reach 2.4k in 3s which is pretty hilarious ; spellcleaves dominating 5v5 so it makes it futile for melee classes to play it.
Rating decay is not any good solution ( imo ).
Providing (more ) rewards for rating would make the ladder more active for sure

#15 Jokerplex

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:06 AM

Needs titles from 2v2 :}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

#16 Itsnel

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:10 AM

5v5 titles are just worthless thats why many ppl want it to be removed... its dominated by range classes just like rbg
merge more bgs would be nice > you would get more and faster invites at high ratings anything other like rating decay is bullshit...

#17 Korzul

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:50 AM

The issue is with the system itself and unless blizz release the values they use (which makes it even more open to abuse) we can't really suggest ways to fix it.

A minimum number of games per season "might" work untill someone queue snipes low rated teams in the early hours.
You could implement it so you had to play N number of games against people within a certain MMR range to be eligable and code a way to track it but new alts starting at low mmr would cap this value easier.

The big issue is the MMR abuse and the carrying MMR over to new seasons, then when they DO reset the system it gives more reward playing in the early weeks as the distribution finds its "boundaries".

You could possibly introduce a system where each season you reset MMR, and until a certain number of games are played on the ladder (5,000 - 10,000) then after a certain rating (2.2-2.4k) your point gain seriously drops off. It's controlable using the 3 level k-factor (the k value determines how quickly/slowly you gain rating/mmr).

So the season starts - You can grind to say 2.4k as easilly as you can now but then your kinda screwed gaining rating past then until 5k-10k total games on your ladder have been played. On the plus side whilst you may be only gain 1-2 points a win you get to test comps/mess about without the worry of feeding people too much rating trying random stuff.

Once 5000 games have been played the k value used for teams above 2.4k increases slightly making rating gain less painful.

Once 10000 games have been played and the system is stable the k value for 2.4k+ increase again to match the current one used (under 2.4k) and the rush to glad/R1 can commence.

Means no more 2.9k mmr in the 1st week when the systems screwed and means no more carrying MMR over and riding the MMR train to glad every season.

All the number are hypothetical, i have no idea how many games are needed for the system to stop being as erratic as it is in the early weeks after an MMR reset.


Oh then merge as many BG's as possible and even potentially change the matchmaking system to make wintrading infinately harder.

Edited by Korzul, 18 July 2012 - 12:03 PM.


#18 Synkz

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 04:26 PM

merge bgs into 1-3 super bgs

#19 brosearch

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 05:00 PM

-merge all bgs into 1 or 2 to bring about fast ques and more competetion
-give rewards of some kind each month to the top xx teams such as, pets, mounts, titles, tabards, or anything people will work for.
-Im not getting into any balance discussion here but everyone can agree that there are 2 main types of comps that NOBODY enjoys facing: 3 dps and 2x healer should not be allowed in arena.
-reward gold for each arena game won outside of 2v2
-fix the dc bugs or any other bug that greatly affects arena (fix within one day just like they do pve bugs)
-bring back the old armory system that allows us to view all the stats for each and every game any team plays.
-bring back skirmishes.
-I would go so far as to say remove pve gear from arena, but that absolutely will never happen.
-o and 5v5 titles should go as well. sure there are some players who legitmently are rank1 players or gladiators, but a vast majority of titles from 5s could not at all earn them outside of that bracket.

Edited by brosearch, 18 July 2012 - 05:07 PM.


#20 Yesjuicex

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 05:55 PM

View PostItsnel, on 18 July 2012 - 11:10 AM, said:

5v5 titles are just worthless thats why many ppl want it to be removed... its dominated by range classes just like rbg
merge more bgs would be nice > you would get more and faster invites at high ratings anything other like rating decay is bullshit...
I strongly disagree I find 5v5 pretty fun and any class can be viable in the right comp. Although merging bgs would help alot blizzard needs to do something to promote arena and give out some kind of reward to people wining games/playing during the season.




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