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#21 WildeHilde

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 06:39 PM

Gear everyone has is as cosmetic as anything else. Loot is pixels as is transmog gear. The difference is if someone cannot have something it creates the desire to get it. It doesn't too much what it is. It simply needs to separate.

#22 FTRouslan

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 01:47 AM

Well if cosmetic gear still creates desire (which I don't see happening), then what is stopping anything from changing at all regarding carries and pilots for money?

Gear progression, pieces at x rating, seem like a better choice imo. Don't forget, I'm pretty sure everyone starts at an equal footing every expansion regarding PvP gear. And PvP gear won't stop a decent player from performing well enough to obtain decent gear, so he can truly be competitive.

I'm just stuck in a Wrath paradigm though.

And I'm not a person who even does transmog much. I mean, I just have my s9 T2 transmogged to annoy the crap out of people I fight in arenas, for obvious reasons. Then again, I don't do any PvE whatsoever. The only bosses I've killed this entire xpac were the last two fights in the Deathwing raid or something, because my guild's second raiding group needed another dps when I happened to be on.

I just don't see cosmetic rewards as a force more powerful than wanting to develop and increase your character's strength.

Edited by FTRouslan, 19 June 2012 - 01:48 AM.


#23 Nicetrylawl

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 02:28 AM

I agree with what you are saying, but instead of everybody instantly getting gear once they hit 90, I think it would work out better if you actually have to grind for the set once, and then it becomes free for all other characters/offspecs.

Just a thought.

#24 FTRouslan

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 04:31 AM

View PostNicetrylawl, on 19 June 2012 - 02:28 AM, said:

I agree with what you are saying, but instead of everybody instantly getting gear once they hit 90, I think it would work out better if you actually have to grind for the set once, and then it becomes free for all other characters/offspecs.

Just a thought.

That's actually a good idea.  But would they need to make an equivalent for PvE, before they cry "unfair"?

#25 WildeHilde

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:46 AM

Sounds like a decent idea with the one time grind. Regarding cosmetic: Gladiator mounts and titles are also only cosmetic, but people seem to spend an awful lot of time and cash for it. The point about pvp rewards is: They should not persist, they should only be active if games were played and rating is active.

#26 ardnut

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 09:01 AM

View PostVulcon, on 18 June 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

  When it was 1800 for T1, 1950 helm and 2k for shoulders with T2 at 2200 any player(s) trying to improve would hit a brickwall around 1750-1800 due to gear and you would loose countless games simply because you were not able to deal the same amount of dmg or take the same amount of dmg as these other players.


"any player(s) trying to improve would hit a brickwall around 1750-1800"  This is the bit I take issue with.  I played in season 3 and 4 and made it to 1850 as rogue/warrior in 2v2 (which was not a good comp)  S4 was my first real season.  It can be done if you try hard.

I do agree with you on the point of gear should not be an issue.  It's only the "brick wall" statement I disagree with.  It's still possible to hit 2.2k if you are willing to put the time in and really really try to improve as a player and as a team.  I'm still trying and have reach 2150+ 3 times with different teams but never managed to get over 2.2k :(  I'm not giving up until I get there ... and get there legitimately!
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#27 WildeHilde

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 09:31 AM

We will hit 2,2k soon enough. Amiza and me started with specific points to improve (I for example need to stop mis-using WotF as Escape Artist :( also I never rarely want to eat a casted CC if it isn't a follow up).

#28 ardnut

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 09:40 AM

yeah we will get there mate...just going to take a lot of time :)
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#29 Vulcon

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 03:01 PM

I wish you good luck on your 2.2k Ardnutt.  I know im currently working on the same thing but I keep getting stuck around 2k....done this on multiple toons/classes....its gets frustrating but i'll get there.  I should really focus on one toon :(

fyi the "brickwall" was to signify that it was not impossible but just more difficult. A barrier of sorts that needed a little more effort to break thru.   My bad if my choice of words were not the best.

#30 WildeHilde

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 03:29 PM

I think currently the most fun thing in WoW is breaking 2,2k on your own.

#31 YndigoDS

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 04:17 PM

View PostWildeHilde, on 19 June 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

I think currently the most fun thing in WoW is breaking 2,2k on your own.

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#32 FTRouslan

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 04:29 PM

View PostWildeHilde, on 19 June 2012 - 06:46 AM, said:

Sounds like a decent idea with the one time grind. Regarding cosmetic: Gladiator mounts and titles are also only cosmetic, but people seem to spend an awful lot of time and cash for it. The point about pvp rewards is: They should not persist, they should only be active if games were played and rating is active.

The mounts are persistent, the titles aren't.


But there we have a problem. Who cares about challenger/rival/duelist? What can arena offer to the average pvper? If it isn't better gear, then what can the average pvper look forward to?

Remember, even challenger is only rewarded to the top 30% of teams. What about those teams that aren't even in the challenger range?


This is going to kill participation the way I see it.

#33 Nicetrylawl

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 05:54 PM

Just an addition, I think that they should add the rating requirements for gear back. This'll keep people playing and they will try to improve, there won't be anymore "He outgears me by a lot, that's why we lost". Not exactly sure how to explain this, but I'll do my best.

Instead of everybody needing for example, 17 pieces of gear, and spending a total of 17000 conquest (just an example, each piece costs 1000 conquest).

You will be able to get 8 pieces that have no rating requirement, while the other have some sort of rating requirement. Therefore, at 1500 rating, you'll be playing against people who have 8 pieces of gear for the most part, therefore, if you are gearing a new alt, at 1500 ratings, people will have advantage over you, with them having 8 pieces of gear rather then 17.

I tried to explain this as best as I could hah.

#34 YndigoDS

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:24 PM

blaming the other team having slightly better gear is a poor excuse to get around to actual problem, which most of the time is yourself. giving everyone the same gear would probably make a lot of players realize that they are the problem not gear. They should really just have perma arena realm, would solve all issues really.
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#35 WildeHilde

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 09:06 PM

Yes, the reason is really the effect on the community. If someone realizes "I play on this rating not because of RMP/RLS/Vanguards/LSD2/JungleCleave/ThugCleave" but because of their own play, then respect would be a lot bigger for each other. Regarding the titles: Even the lower titles are pretty well accepted among more casual players. The typical AJ is that everyone sucks, the list of players called bad on this forums is probably the same as an all time best of pvp players in WoW. People care, they are just afraid to admit it, because caring doesn't look as badass.

I am usually impressed with people that can admit their fails, that can compliment good plays by others. It shows self-respect if you don't have to look down on others. I remember when I talked to Khuna just before the Yaspresents tournament started and we were joking about me trying to get 2k and them winning the tournament. He was not arrogant at all and wished me best luck, as did I for his team. Turned out they won the tournament and my RMP broke 2k for the first time.

#36 TheRealStevenBonnel

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 03:28 AM

dumb fucking idea

#37 ardnut

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 07:46 AM

View PostWildeHilde, on 19 June 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

I think currently the most fun thing in WoW is breaking 2,2k on your own.

QFT... completely agree.
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