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#1 Eleshaman

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 11:52 PM

This has been posted many times in this forum im sure. but still, i have been testing on live/TR some stats on my mage. mastery seems to be superior compared to haste atleast? i have been playing with 10%~ haste and the difference i see is so low, but when i go to full mastery gear, my damage goes up SO MUCH!

with haste gear i can ofc dpellsteal ''alot'' faster, get faster GCD on ice lances etc, wich sometimes makes difference. but mastery DMG increase seems to be too much to skip atm in my opinion.

damage increase on single frostbolt+ice lance wich is HUGE seems to the best atm. so the question is, why do mages go haste?

also im playing with rogue in 2s and 3s so crit% is not an issue for me. thats why im asking mages that go for haste, i just dont see the 10% cast speed as useful as i see the DMG increse from mastery.
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#2 Nycto

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 12:04 AM

after playing with a crit gearsetup, then full int and then full haste. I can say mastery is by far the best. Getting off absolutely insane shatters in arena on my mage.
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#3 kannetixx

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 12:19 AM

what you can ultimately gain from this discussion cane from the conflicting arguments is this ..


you will find that when you get comfortable the stat you feel is more beneficial to you personally is what you will run with .. get on the tournament realm make like 3-4 sets and see what you like if you feel you cant get burst off and when you hard cast like that is your time to burst then i say go with crit .. for me i like haste / mastery setups because of the faster globals / getting a few more casts in than lets say the other mage who doesnt have as much haste as i might have or mastery which turns into some big shatters

on any given night i will run either my 10%+ mastery setup or my 13% haste setup depending on whats queuing - if i feel my dmg is lack luster or if i feel i couldve gotten out another cast with a little more haste behind it i can reliably run about 20% crit with either setup since i do play RMP - with power torrent / back enchant procced for the extra int which turns into crit i can run 3-4% more crit on burst attempts with haste or mastery behind it for an extra kick







^^ what i posted in two threads below this one
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#4 Blue_Sphere

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 12:24 AM

Haste provides more control and increases the skill-cap of the class.

It also allows you to carry people easier. Dont forget that haste also scales multiplicatively with veins.
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#5 ph10m

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:19 AM

Mastery sure is a great stat, but I would never go below 50% crit (shatter), so frankly I prefer crit.

Haste provides more control and increases the skill-cap of the class.

It also allows you to carry people easier. Dont forget that haste also scales multiplicatively with veins.


'ok'
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#6 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:55 AM

Haste provides more control and increases the skill-cap of the class.


it gives you the ability to perform more actions in the same amount of time, whether or not that increases the skill cap of the class is debatable

haste promotes frostbolt usage, mastery promotes icelance spam. i dont think theres any debate currently about which mage playstyle is more skill intensive

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 16 June 2011 - 11:55 AM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#7 Pierdevara

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 06:21 PM

haste doesnt only promote frostbolt usage, promotes all ur casting skils, whatever u use in arena, poly/evo/frostbolt or w/e. i tested crit was pretty cool, haste i didnt liked it, even with 13% haste a rog/dk/hunter on u, u might cast 2-3 frostbolt's in 1 minute, mastery seems perfect for me, i love it.
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#8 Oliaxz

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 08:55 PM

haste doesnt only promote frostbolt usage, promotes all ur casting skils, whatever u use in arena, poly/evo/frostbolt or w/e. i tested crit was pretty cool, haste i didnt liked it, even with 13% haste a rog/dk/hunter on u, u might cast 2-3 frostbolt's in 1 minute, mastery seems perfect for me, i love it.


yeah haste is crap, but i still go for it because im a wotlk hero and this seasons a joke.
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#9 Tyumbra

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 07:43 AM

haste doesnt only promote frostbolt usage, promotes all ur casting skils, whatever u use in arena, poly/evo/frostbolt or w/e. i tested crit was pretty cool, haste i didnt liked it, even with 13% haste a rog/dk/hunter on u, u might cast 2-3 frostbolt's in 1 minute, mastery seems perfect for me, i love it.


Haste is great. It also depends entirely on what setup you're running.

If you're doing PMR, you can reforge everything to Haste, stacking Int/Haste gems, and sit at near 20% passive Haste + 18% crit (+5% crit on Frostbolt for 23% crit on FB) and do well.

You can also do the same for Mastery instead of Haste - the damage benefit would indeed promote Icelance spamming, since you'll be wanting to land as many attacks that you can safely cast - which happens to be your IV/EF Frostbolt, or against teams that have no ranged interrupts and aren't attacking you.

I'm running MLD - I like stacking haste for the faster casts.
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#10 Pierdevara

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 08:17 AM

idc.. maybe u play what u get used to, and i never enjoyed haste to much.. wotlk was different, now i rather go with mastery/crit, i like big numbers :D
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#11 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 09:15 AM

If you're doing PMR, you can reforge everything to Haste, stacking Int/Haste gems, and sit at near 20% passive Haste + 18% crit (+5% crit on Frostbolt for 23% crit on FB) and do well.

its more like 10% haste rather then 20%, but yea
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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#12 Tempestlol

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 09:23 AM

Haste has a very nice feel to it, but you give up too many other stats to get it to a decent level.

If you wanna stack something other than crit mastery is the way to go for the guaranteed extra damage.
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#13 Pierdevara

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 06:04 PM

agree, crit is by far the best stat for frost mages atm. but mastery aint bad at all, i played crit was perfect, and im playing mastery now and i love the bigger numbers im getting :)
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#14 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 06:23 PM

agree, crit is by far the best stat for frost mages atm. but mastery aint bad at all, i played crit was perfect, and im playing mastery now and i love the bigger numbers im getting :)

10% haste 14% crit, play with a rogue, u can keep ur scrub mastery xd

haste i didnt liked it, even with 13% haste a rog/dk/hunter on u, u might cast 2-3 frostbolt's in 1 minute, mastery seems perfect for me, i love it.

yes mastery does seem perfect for u lol

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 20 June 2011 - 06:25 PM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#15 Calx

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 12:00 AM

10% haste 14% crit, play with a rogue, u can keep ur scrub mastery xd


yes mastery does seem perfect for u lol


Yep, if you don't make use of the extra globals haste gives you, well, haste isn't very good then. Every second you don't make an extra gcd count that you wouldn't have had otherwise, diminishes haste's value.

Haste has always scaled with player skill. If you aren't using your globals that carefully and end up mashing ice lance more often than not, there's no reason not to go crit and/or mastery. Or if your comp doesn't like haste, although I can't think of too many that wouldn't..
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#16 Tyumbra

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 01:53 AM

its more like 10% haste rather then 20%, but yea


http://chardev.org/?profile=149744

That's a spec useful for PMR. If you're feeling too squishy, you can swap pants:

http://chardev.org/?profile=149747


That gives you double proc + on-use gloves. If you're non-Human, obviously swap the PvP proc trinket out - you lose some extra burst, but that's the cost of being non-Human.
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#17 Dizzeeyo

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 09:34 AM

http://chardev.org/?profile=149744

That's a spec useful for PMR. If you're feeling too squishy, you can swap pants:

http://chardev.org/?profile=149747


That gives you double proc + on-use gloves. If you're non-Human, obviously swap the PvP proc trinket out - you lose some extra burst, but that's the cost of being non-Human.

2/8/31 is better then 7/3/31, and, as usual, thanks for linking chardevs of mages in 3k-3.2k resilience with heroic trinkets, wtb ur battlegroup where no1 trains mages and everyone gets heroic gear, etc etc

Edited by Dizzeeyo, 21 June 2011 - 09:42 AM.

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No because the difference is when I play a comp i play it close to skill cap

if anyone needs to be banned, it's you. You do nothing but sit on AJ being a passive aggressive idiot that nobody likes, sorry you stink of washing up liquid.

Feel free to call me an idiot because I'm a hunter or some stupid ass remark but I've actually written all this down on paper

I actually made an appearance at DH2014 and I met up with people from twitch who were involved with the dota 2 / cs tournies that where there, I talked about the game from my perspective as a professional player and we actually shared a lot of opinions. All I'm saying is a lot of people will be VERY surprised about the future of this game in the esport world :)


#18 Maticzor

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 10:55 AM

Haste = faster casts/gcds
Mastery = moar dmg
Crit is a must and depends on what setup u play.

Pretty much your choice, for me I balance it sort of, playing with 8% haste and I find it enough to provide the control needed and the rest goes for mastery for more burst. Both stats are awesome and with next season gear season its going up.

In short..

Haste to carry
Mastery to faceroll

:D
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#19 Charred

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 05:30 PM

For some reason some americans have been saying pmr since day 1 the combo existed.
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#20 Tyumbra

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Posted 22 June 2011 - 04:17 AM

It's PMR. Get it right.
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