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Sudden Death talent.. Has togo.


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#61 Dante

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 01:51 AM

Arp wasn't fine, it scaled exponentially as in the closer to 100% you'd get the more of a dmg boost you received.

To solve this the class or rather spec needs a complete revamp as it's perfectly balanced for PVE but it's dmg is ridiculous in PVP so meh =/
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#62 Powerslave

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 05:45 AM

as i mentioned before, removing collosus smash and giving back arp would balance both pve and pvp.
we wouldn´t have dps issues and we wouldn´t do too much burst.

i haven´t hear a single argument which can give a reason to not do it.

and yes considering everything what was in s9 i do think arp was fine (shadowmourne however wasn´t).


arp scales better than other stats ,here's a reason for not bringing it back

also,arp was a better version of strength,as it didn't really do more the higher armored your target was,as it cappped at effectiveness against hunters
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#63 Yayyuh

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 10:26 AM

as i mentioned before, removing collosus smash and giving back arp would balance both pve and pvp.
we wouldn´t have dps issues and we wouldn´t do too much burst.

i haven´t hear a single argument which can give a reason to not do it.

and yes considering everything what was in s9 i do think arp was fine (shadowmourne however wasn´t).


make warriors dependent on pve gear again. amazing idea.
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Mages is based on using Deep freeze and Procc FoF if it doesnt in the right moment they are cake to stay away from
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#64 Guest_Sumbar_*

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 10:34 AM

Yeah it is.

I rather burst for 6 seconds controlled then do more damage over a long time.


Hello, please stop queing 2s.
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#65 Alysana

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 10:39 AM

Arp wasn't fine, it scaled exponentially as in the closer to 100% you'd get the more of a dmg boost you received.

To solve this the class or rather spec needs a complete revamp as it's perfectly balanced for PVE but it's dmg is ridiculous in PVP so meh =/


Damage really isn't THAT insane outside of BGs where people run with PvE gear or at least next to no resi and where you're allowed to freely sit on a target. In a setting like 3v3 where people already got 2k+ resi, and where pretty much every class got stuns or at least peels to completely screw up your damage, caster burst/dk/feral damage seems way worse.
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#66 Grisham

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 10:50 AM

The PvE argument is just so hyprocritical. Like really people here care about warrior dragonslayers that want to play with one big stick but not two... disgusting to be that biased. At least some players have the courage to be straight about the class they play.

Arms has been a PvP specs for like forever and people were OK with that - the distinction was clear: Fury=PvE, Arms=PvP. Blizzard in their fantasies want everything viable everywhere so they buffed Arms damage using a silly proc mechanic while keeping the mobility, tools and actually adding a FULL STUN on top of it. Warrior stunlock better than a rogue...srsly?

It's the exact same story as with Frost mages btw - damage being buffed with PvE ortientation (Ice Lance spam for DPS while moving) plus adding another completely OP skill (Ring of Frost) aside of the already great arsenal they had.

Like REALLY mages were complaining that they could bolt with fire OR arcane shit but unable to DPS with icecicles :)...Poor dragonslayers having only 2 out of 3 specs to choose from...

Those shitty changes weren't ever asked by players, this is a fallacy, this is Blizzard's stupid design goals. It's the same story as with prot specs in PvP happening again, we all know we had to eat dirt for a full season because some stupid dev wanted them to be PvP viable...even if it meant implementing horribly OP mechanics.

This time it's about two of the most prominent DPS specs. Nerf it to the ground or in two months 95% of all 2k+ arena will be dominated by the two mentionned spec.

(anticipating the ad hominem instead if discussing the arguments)
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#67 Yayyuh

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:06 AM

The PvE argument is just so hyprocritical. Like really people here care about warrior dragonslayers that want to play with one big stick but not two... disgusting to be that biased. At least some players have the courage to be straight about the class they play.

Arms has been a PvP specs for like forever and people were OK with that - the distinction was clear: Fury=PvE, Arms=PvP. Blizzard in their fantasies want everything viable everywhere so they buffed Arms damage using a silly proc mechanic WHILE keeping the mobility, tools and actually adding a full stun on top of it.

It's the exact same story as with Frost mages btw - damage being buffed with PvE ortientation (Ice Lance spam for DPS while moving) plus adding another completely OP skill (Ring of Frost) aside of the already great arsenal they had.

Like REALLY mages were complaining that they could bolt with fire OR arcane shit but unable to DPS with icecicles :)...Poor dragonslayers having only 2 out of 3 specs to choose from...

Those shitty changes weren't ever asked by players, this is a fallacy, this is Blizzard's stupid design goals. It's the same story as with prot specs in PvP happening again, we all know we had to eat dirt for a full season because some stupid dev wanted them to be PvP viable...even if it meant implementing horribly OP mechanics.

This time it's about two of the most prominent DPS specs. Nerf it to the ground or in two months 95% of all 2k+ arena will be dominated by the two mentionned spec.

(anticipating the ad hominem instead if discussing the arguments)

I actually agree with you, but the problem isn't that blizzard wants all specs to be viable. It's damage output, and the fact that they keep handing out a bunch of new spells to every class instead of taking them away.
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Mages is based on using Deep freeze and Procc FoF if it doesnt in the right moment they are cake to stay away from
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#68 Grisham

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:17 AM

Agree

It's not damage per se. It's the ways of dealing damage (procs) plus the heritage of years of PvP orientation that gave specs like Frost or Arms tons of imba-tools.

A while ago it was clear: some specs had great PvP utility and meh damage and burst (yesterdays arms of forst mage). Others were kinda clunky to use but had the advantage of having great DPS output (assasination rogue from WotLK was a great example). Arms and frost now gained pure PvE DPS spec traits without any removal of PvP utility whatsoever. Hell, they even gained some silly stuff like a full stun (Who can tell me with a straight face that Arms warriors needed a fuckin HoJ?).

Basically they have the cake and ate it at the same time.
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#69 Spirit

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:23 AM

Arms tons of imba-tools.


What?
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#70 Baksteen

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:27 AM

Make CS so that it ignores 75% armor and procc rate remain the same, beside that include a talent in the arms tree that reduces disarm time.
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#71

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:37 AM

You 100-20"ed me in trinketed throwdown far too much:(
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#72 Dante

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:40 AM

The PvE argument is just so hyprocritical. Like really people here care about warrior dragonslayers that want to play with one big stick but not two...


I am saying that arms for pvp IS overpowered, but guess who cares if arms is viable in PVE, the very makers of this game.

Blizzard does not balance this game around PVP, you had 8 damn seasons of proof that they do not. So all I am saying unless arms starts topping meters in PVE bit too much you will not see any nerfs in the future.
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#73 Grisham

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 11:44 AM

What?


http://www.wowhead.c...85388/throwdown

Trust me, I'm a Ret, I know the value of a 5 seconds stun

Blizzard does not balance this game around PVP, you had 8 damn seasons of proof that they do not. So all I am saying unless arms starts topping meters in PVE bit too much you will not see any nerfs in the future.


That or when the forums will be overflooded with whining. They will overnerf it without even looking at PvE consequences, just to calm down the angry mob.

Trust me, I'm a Ret, my spec holds the record of knee-jerk hotfixes being applied to calm down people.

In your very own interest you should start threads with constructive ways how to nerf CS/Sudden Death and Throwdown because Blizzard has this tendency to ruin a skill/talent when they decide to "balance" it.
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#74 Spirit

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 12:13 PM

http://www.wowhead.c...85388/throwdown

Trust me, I'm a Ret, I know the value of a 5 seconds stun


I wasn't aware the term "tons" equalled 1.
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#75 Grisham

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 02:20 PM

A ton is not a count but a weight mesure.

A 5s stun is HEAVY
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#76 Ragious

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 03:01 PM

Sudden Death talent.. Has togo.


Who actually types like this?

IT HAS TOGOOOOOOO
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#77 Alysana

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 03:02 PM

I actually read it as tango in the start.
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#78 cyrfer

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 03:20 PM

leave arms alone :(

hate them mages!!!
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I have never trolled in my life.


#79 Bleikfeiten

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 03:26 PM

Who actually types like this?

IT HAS TOGOOOOOOO


who calls themself "ragious".
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#80 Zong

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 06:40 PM

Both fury and arms are doing terrible in PvE. As in second last on most bosses, third last on a couple. Only rivalled by ret for bad DPS.

If anything warrior damage will be buffed, maybe spread out more.

One thing they could do without hurting PvE is put HS on GCD, other than that idk.(edit: although this would hurt tanking a bit).
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