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the current state of feral


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#41 phowlxoxo

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:15 AM

Anyone else pick up Glyph of Thorns? I feel like Melee can't do anything against me now, and even before I picked it up I was owning. Woot!
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#42 korkut

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:16 AM

I was killing every1 in duels before patch too.. problem was/is 3vs3 and 5vs5 arena. Sadly 2vs2 or duels not giving anything.
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:rolleyes:


#43 Lortho

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:23 AM

you didnt kill 2.8 unholy dks, 2.7 resto druids 1.8 holy pal in <15sec before. Ferals are op atm or maybe I just became fucking awesome over night.
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s3,s5,s6glad. Rocking feral atm

#44 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:27 AM

you didnt kill 2.8 unholy dks, 2.7 resto druids 1.8 holy pal in <15sec before. Ferals are op atm or maybe I just became fucking awesome over night.


Damage is definitely too high relative to health pools but that's not really the question. The question is whether damage is too high relative to everyone else's. If it isn't, then a blanket resilience buff until Cata ships will take care of the issue. If it is, then it needs to be lowered again to some midpoint.

I mean, sure, you didn't kill 2.8k death knights in 15 seconds before, but you also couldn't die to a mage in a deep freeze from 100% before by having them press ice lance 4 times. =p
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feral always

#45 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:30 AM

Anyone else pick up Glyph of Thorns? I feel like Melee can't do anything against me now, and even before I picked it up I was owning. Woot!


Yeah I got it right away but I haven't been using thorns in duels ever because it seems like cheating, rogues etc are easy enough to beat even without using thorns.
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feral always

#46 Lortho

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:33 AM

Yea, not arguing about that. :) Our utility is pretty much the same as before. We dont have new op abilities or talents, it's just that our dmg currently is out of control but that will be tweaked in one way or another.

One can only pray for ferals to be as desireable as other melees in arena!

edit: Same about thorns, will just make me lazy and bad in the end
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s3,s5,s6glad. Rocking feral atm

#47 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:37 AM

edit: Same about thorns, will just make me lazy and bad in the end


Especially considering it's already been nerfed hard on beta, so it definitely will not be live in such an overpowered state for long.
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feral always

#48 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 01:43 AM

Yea, not arguing about that. :) Our utility is pretty much the same as before. We dont have new op abilities or talents, it's just that our dmg currently is out of control but that will be tweaked in one way or another.


Yeah, besides Kick the only actual positive changes we really have on live are in terms of damage mechanics (longer Rakes, free Ravages - really nice for getting a 5cp Rip in a pounce, but basically just a damage change - and not relying on SR). Meanwhile we basically lost Innervate (which obviously does not matter with healer mana on live, although it will matter at 85).

Although also, ferals and ret paladins both seem to heal tons better than pre-patch too on live. Not sure how that translates to 85, pretty sure we'll have major mana issues then.

One thing that's really annoying me: Wasn't Barkskin supposed to be undispellable in this patch? It's not and I still have to cancelaura it against mages right after the shatter. :(
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feral always

#49 Lortho

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 02:09 AM

Hopefully the lesser importance of ms and a minor dmg upgrade + kick will be enough. Food for thought, remove kick and ms from a rogue and you'd have a really bad feral.

And yea, it should be undispellable afaik.:confused:
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s3,s5,s6glad. Rocking feral atm

#50 Zybak

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 03:16 AM

Although also, ferals and ret paladins both seem to heal tons better than pre-patch too on live. Not sure how that translates to 85, pretty sure we'll have major mana issues then.


I really noticed this since I'm a big BG nerd


hopefully it will bring back old school feral/rogue
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#51 Erch

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 04:13 AM

I'm thinking our healing now is only relative to current healthpools. That said, I hope it stays as effective.
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Feral makes every comp better.

#52 scorpious

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 04:55 AM

I friggin' looooooooooove the new SI, our increased mobility, not beeing forced to have SR up at all times, free ravage for huge openers and the perfectly balanced healing output <3

Gonna hate losing the healing again later though, like I guess is gonna happen. Will mess around with the beta some later today to find out.
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#53 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 05:14 AM

1.8 holy pal in <15sec before.


btw, what are paladins doing that lets you kill them? Might be that I have 0 PvE gear but dueling random paladins they can sit around tanking everything without moving just with instants, easily, they might drop below 50% during zerk with a 5pt Maim (or a Bash) + full bleeds + SR + shred spam but that's pretty much it. =p
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feral always

#54 Tarukimo

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 05:26 AM

The way I kill (all) healers atm, is to set up a fresh mangle, rake/shred to 5 cp, allow energy to full regen...5 point sr, rake/shred to 5 cps, let energy regen to about 85, rake, shred shred tigers fury shred rip (5 cp) zerker shred shred back away, kitty charge, ferocious bite+ravage, in that order. If they dont have bubble or pain sup, they will die, or the 4-5 shreds you can easily land after the ravage will do the job.
Yes, this means you cant just spam dps, you need to regen energy and look stupid auto attacking...but full duration bleeds on top of full energy zerker into 5 pt ferocious bite+ravage...sick damage. If they cast, kick it, and it will make them die before you can get the ravage off.
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#55 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 05:32 AM

Yes, this means you cant just spam dps, you need to regen energy and look stupid auto attacking...but full duration bleeds on top of full energy zerker into 5 pt ferocious bite+ravage...sick damage. If they cast, kick it, and it will make them die before you can get the ravage off.


It's never been possible to kill decent healers (or to kill anything against decent teams in 2s, in the last season or so) without pooling right (meaning looking stupid and autoattacking, getting full duration SRs at full energy and actually coordinating burst correctly), and I always do that. I honestly have no clue how what you describe will kill a decent paladin considering that I can do exactly the same thing and barely threaten them, unless you're wearing much more aggressive gear or something. =p

Any chance of posting a video or something?

And I agree, casting is pretty much always a mistake on their side, a kick may actually let me kill them. =p

(obviously priests are easy to beat, haven't dueled a decent shaman since the first day of the patch, paladins though don't appear killable at all to me if they're decent in good gear)

Maybe I'm using Maim too much, but I've also attempted avoiding it and doing what you describe, honestly does not seem to do anything if they have a clue what they are doing.

(now of course i'm not talking about 1800 paladins so maybe the initial question was misplaced!)
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feral always

#56 scorpious

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 05:36 AM

The way I kill (all) healers atm, is to set up a fresh mangle, rake/shred to 5 cp, allow energy to full regen...5 point sr, rake/shred to 5 cps, let energy regen to about 85, rake, shred shred tigers fury shred rip (5 cp) zerker shred shred back away, kitty charge, ferocious bite+ravage, in that order. If they dont have bubble or pain sup, they will die, or the 4-5 shreds you can easily land after the ravage will do the job.
Yes, this means you cant just spam dps, you need to regen energy and look stupid auto attacking...but full duration bleeds on top of full energy zerker into 5 pt ferocious bite+ravage...sick damage. If they cast, kick it, and it will make them die before you can get the ravage off.

I assume you don't prioritize maim before the bite because the healer has trinket up due to little to no pressure earlier? It might be because I lack a bit in the gear department right now, but sometimes I have to do force a trinket/cooldowns without zerk up first, by doing the same rotation as you with the getting mangle/sr/rake and rip up, then finishing with a maim. Then just do it all over again with berserker up to ensure a kill :)
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#57 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 05:58 AM

Actually it seems like the problem was just that I was dueling the most resilience-stacking paladins ever, killing people who are wearing less seems fine. =p
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feral always

#58 Belden

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 06:05 AM

Actually it seems like the problem was just that I was dueling the most resilience-stacking paladins ever, killing people who are wearing less seems fine. =p


They recently(today) buffed feral damage so it could be that.
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#59 Datah

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 06:09 AM

They recently(today) buffed feral damage so it could be that.


Nah I know, all of this is about today (they also buffed res though).
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feral always

#60 animal161

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Posted 15 October 2010 - 06:10 AM

actually i play moonkin.. full wrathfull with t2... 1350 resi.. 35k hp..
now vs ferals.. they open on me and after the first stun i have 50% hp + rip and the other fucking bleeding dot up wich ticks for 5k.. somthing went wrong with the hotfix..
i dont lose the 1v1 because of thorns + starfall.. but feral dmg is atm ... i dont know op.. like moonkin dmg..
if nothing changes i would say you will find 1337 threads in each WoW forum... "Nerf Druids"..
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