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Envenom demystification


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#41 Danje

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 02:56 AM

I was on 947 resilience.

hope it was fun getting raped on lordaeron.

hf with new wotf

:cool:


I got kited by a Warrior while my Mage got 1shot from Torik.

Fun :(
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P.S. If you see a hunter in the street try not to make eye contact. If you accidentally meet his gaze, try standing still, if my theories are correct and hunters in fact share 68.4% of their DNA with the T-rex, he won't be able to see you and you may avoid attack.

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#42 qedqed

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:05 AM

Scourge Strike never hit for 10k, ever. Even back in s5. My Scourge strike crit, on average, about 4-5k prenerf.


That's a big lie or an half truth. Pre-nerf EACH part of SS was able to crit 4k-6k (physical + shadow) on cloth.

My SS now (post nerf) crits for about 4k with my crap gear... Lafu don't think that everyone is dumb and clueless...
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#43 Danje

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:07 AM

Lafu don't think that everyone is dumb and clueless...


Very easy mistake to make, cut some slack.
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P.S. If you see a hunter in the street try not to make eye contact. If you accidentally meet his gaze, try standing still, if my theories are correct and hunters in fact share 68.4% of their DNA with the T-rex, he won't be able to see you and you may avoid attack.

Spoiler

#44 Chaospwn

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:09 AM

That's a big lie or an half truth. Pre-nerf EACH part of SS was able to crit 4k-6k (physical + shadow) on cloth.

My SS now (post nerf) crits for about 4k with my crap gear... Lafu don't think that everyone is dumb and clueless...


Just to clarify something there, I'm sure Lafu was NOT talking about the scourge strike we had for around 6 hours before getting hotfixed. Thanks.
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#45 tafu

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:22 AM

That's a big lie or an half truth. Pre-nerf EACH part of SS was able to crit 4k-6k (physical + shadow) on cloth.

My SS now (post nerf) crits for about 4k with my crap gear... Lafu don't think that everyone is dumb and clueless..



Yes for about 4 days scourge strike *could* crit for retarded amounts on the lowest armored targets in the game. The context of his post, I thought, was referring to s5 scourge strike when it was largely considered to be overpowered by just about everyone, and he was bloating even those numbers with "10k" quotes.

Furthermore, to achieve those number, Scourge Strike would have to "double crit," which was about a 8% chance on full resil cloth targets.

Blizzard hotfixed Scourge Strike almost immediately, fixing this "bug" and leaving the current abomination that is the current Scourge Strike.

So, if you want to take 4 days of anecdotal evidence which was able to happen 8% of the time on the lowest armored targets in the game, while hitting for laughable amounts on plate to make a point, that's fine, but I think it's pretty retarded myself.
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#46 Sethx

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:35 AM

so ure complaining about envenom hitting for 8k rarely but 9.3k lava bursts/11k chaos bolts all the time are ok right?oh what about TSG charge,brostorm,ghoul stun,silence priest dead?and mm hunters doing unhealable dmg are also k right?

envenom shouldn't get the 13% from curse of elements tho
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#47 Chron1296682249

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:35 AM

All classes should take less damage while stunned. Good rogues will do good, bad rogues that rely on their enemy to do nothing but die will understand how bad they really are.
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#48 Nazhjin

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 03:36 AM

only flaw i see is your rogue with a lot of pve gear.

the rogue i do 3v3 with doesnt have a TON of pve gear, 880 resil and 5k AP.
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#49 CadaverousDK

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 04:03 AM

only flaw i see is your rogue with a lot of pve gear.

the rogue i do 3v3 with doesnt have a TON of pve gear, 880 resil and 5k AP.


plez link.
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#50 Cryzz

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 04:29 AM

First of, good post, ty.
From what i've seen so far, it seems CoE might be a big factor to the "unfair" amount of damage to envenom. +% dmg is too much and should not work with the envenom mechanics.

This might be a sweet fix actually. Keep up the good work

Cryzz
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#51 Rensy

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:01 AM

this one time, i had all my shit procced all at once, and i did a lot of damage.

just like every other single class in the game. :)


i was pointing out that there were some things op didnt consider

lol ur banned kekeke
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#52 Fierss

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:16 AM

when wound/wound first went super common, it did 18-20% of your damage.

after 3.3, wound is about 14% of my dmg and deadly is 17-18%.

the damage has been buffed sizably. but large envenom crits aren't one of the top arena issues atm.
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#53

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:22 AM

The problem is not envenom its that you get undispellable powerful dot, what makes your slow and snare also indispellable by simply auto attacking your target and then having on demand 7k-8k crit on top of mutilate damage.

However, i play my hunter now and find rogues very easy to manage unless they play with shadowpriests, warriors however are just ridiculous:)
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#54 Ckmaster

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:23 AM

Doesn't COE or something increase it's damage?
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#55 Craton

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:26 AM

Probably. It is nature damage.
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#56 betruger

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:28 AM

Add 9% from imp kidney and 13% from CoE and you can start to see these numbers that people are talking about.

However.. i could give a rats ass about rogues and envenom when compared to:

100% passive arp warriors.

Prot warriors that stunlock for 15 seconds every DR

Mages who have such insane survivability that nobody questions them using 4p t10.
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#57 Nazhjin

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 06:31 AM

plez link.


http://www.wowarmory...?r=Arygos&n=Ash

not in pvp gear atm.
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#58 Mysteriouz

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 07:03 AM

Add 9% from imp kidney and 13% from CoE and you can start to see these numbers that people are talking about.

However.. i could give a rats ass about rogues and envenom when compared to:

100% passive arp warriors.

Prot warriors that stunlock for 15 seconds every DR

Mages who have such insane survivability that nobody questions them using 4p t10.


Besides, 1 out of 10 rogues speccs Improved Kidney. ;)
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#59 Tammyaway

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 09:11 AM

Rogues can do 10k envenoms with various combinations of trinket proc/imp kidney/CoE, but so can many other classes.

There is nothing to whine about really with the amount of damage wotlk brings.
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#60 Tankz

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 09:18 AM

so ure complaining about envenom hitting for 8k rarely but 9.3k lava bursts/11k chaos bolts all the time are ok right?oh what about TSG charge,brostorm,ghoul stun,silence priest dead?and mm hunters doing unhealable dmg are also k right?

envenom shouldn't get the 13% from curse of elements tho


Well, ele shamans n locks can't lock me down for 15 seconds while they kill me, so i'm not complaining there.

The fact that rogues got so high damage compared with the ability to lock people down for long plus a MS on top of it all is a bit over the top.

Sure, they're squishy like every other class in the game - but the lockdown combined with high damage = no thanks from one class.

look at it this way, if they removed UA from warriors n gave them CS/KS - that'd be cool eh.

please, don't come with the usual "lolz ur worriorz" arguments, they're silly n such - my class is over the top, i know, but so are rogues and they clearly need a nerf in the damage point.
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