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Stop Blaming Gear! How to get your 1800 weapons.


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#1 Defector

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 05:45 AM

Hello to start this is not a bashing thread but one to help out people who like me were struggling to get their 1800 weapons and don't want to resort to pve. Until recently I played resto shaman / mut/prep rogue and was stuck in the 1600-1700s. After lots of games we used to get fed up and blame my gear, their gear or it being a counter comp. We felt like in 90% of the games we outplayed our opponents yet lost for some reason we could not explain. We had played a few hundred games and it felt like we had hit a brick wall. After taking a short break my shaman playing some 3s (he got an 1800 weapon) and me trying out some double dps comps where I couldn't find a partner I felt like I wasn't held back by or was comfortable playing with we decided to give it one last chance. I picked up one of them boe brewfest mugs and tried out combat. We swiftly went 1-8 and I changed back to my sweet ilevel 200 daggers. We then played that night to 1888 *needed that for my pr to catch up to 1800* and did it without needing to play overly many games. One week later I got my 1800 main hand and we played up to 2027 so I could get my 2k achievement where we have decided to sit until I get my offhand.

Rogues Gear: 4/5 Deadly, Full Relentless Off piece, Darkmoon Death, Battlemasters, WG legs and 2x ilevel200 daggers (Same gear now just an 1800 mh).

Shaman Gear: A mix of deadly, hateful, furious and the 1800 weapon. He also had a few easily obtained pve pieces


So how did we do it?


1. Lower Ping: I went from a 400->220 ping. My shaman still plays with a 400 ping but as a rogue the change was incredible. I could open players easier, gouge iceblocks faster, sap other rogues more of the time and even kicked my first fel dom on purpose.

2. Communication: I am talking a lot. Most of the match we are discussing what we are going to do and trinket before it happens, how we are going. Do you need a peel? That priest is running towards you etc. Getting Skype also cut down on the vent lag we experienced and was also a noticeable change. Lots of our victories come from communicating to help set up purges, hexing, shock / kick rotations etc.

3. Taking Advantage of Half Chances:
Soo many games did I hold my trinket just incase, hold off on my cooldown usage incase I need them defensively. Not use cold blood eviscerate or blind because hex was on cd. Once I started taking advantage of each opportunity as I saw it we put out more pressure and got some wotf I just gibbed that guy without meaning to moments.

4. Find out what strategys work for you:
Being the first time we have ever arenad seriously we promptly checked out the guide forum where we found a hfb rogue / shaman one. It was all we had to base off and honestly we did not have the gear for it. Me sitting on anyone all match is going to result in a loss vs a lot of comps (priest and warlock teams are an exception). These strats revolved lots around playing a boring style of out manaing a bunch of other hero classes in terms of mana regen healers while pulling off pve rotations. It is not a play style that I enjoy and did not work for us. Since we have made our own strats we have beat the two warrior druids over 2k rating that we have played. Lol wuts a hard counter? (I know 2k is not srs business for lots of the players here but getting wins against this supposed hard counter is a good feeling)

5. Don't get frustrated: Some teams you have to play really well to beat or they have to make lots of dumb mistakes to lose. We lost last night to a warrior / prot pally where the warrior lagged out for a good minute twice and we could not get a gib on anything lol prot pally 2 on 1. The warrior came back to hit bladestorm twice and collect points as the pally emoted on us. Yes I wish we could of had that back and played it different when he was gone (got too relaxed thinking it was free points and had a brain snap) but when our strategy involves manipulating the warrior into going where you want him to at the right times having him stand still made the match impossible. You will not have a 100% win rate and if you do wtf are you reading this for?

6. Positioning: Playing 3s helped my shaman to improve on this lots. If you do not understand what people mean by good positioning you want to have a place to heal where the enemy can not cc you. Eg vs ret rogue you want to open the ret out of blind / repentance range of your healer. This is the most important thing by a long way. If your partner is standing in a bad spot let them know they may be distracted with something else.

7. Responsibility: In healer / melee teams it is very easy for the healer to be stuck doing everything while the melee facerolls on their keyboard. I am in charge of calling out the strats, hex targets, staying in los of heals, etc. It is my responsibility to know when I am going to need to hit defensive cds and let my partner know if he should hold off on his trinket before he needs to make that decision. Playing a rogue does not require all my concentration so I attempt to help out my partner as much as I can through communicating and taking some of the responsibility off his shoulders so he isn't trying to think about trying to ground something, shock someone, heal me, heal himself, get in a better position, hex, purge and drink bug all while I'm mashing a to mutilate followed by z to eviscerate and complaining he isn't doing enough (This is an exaggeration of how simple my role is but his job is much less forgiving and imperative to getting a victory).

8. Post Match Discussion: If you stuff up admit it to yourself and your partner, explain what you did wrong and how you are going to attempt to fix it next time. We discuss after every match win or loss and know why we lose. This is normally from either bad positioning, playing too defensive, playing too aggressive, getting sapped vs double dps, trinketing something wrong, failing to cloak that hoj, failing to juke, failing to drink or failing to peel.

9. Have Fun: If someone does something awesome point it out. When you hit a good milestone enjoy it. Set goals and achieve them hitting 1800 for me was the equivalent of downing vael in vanilla. Yes anyone can do it if they stick some time and effort into learning to play better but doing it in a non cheese comp without pveing other than brewfest dagger was a large aim of mine and I was pleased with the results. Set your goals 1 week at a time last week we wanted 1800 this week we wanted 2k and achieving them has been lots of fun. Make sure your goal is achievable though even if it means ending your week with more wins than losses even if your rating goes down thanks to mmr.

PRO TIP: After you beat a team against someone with gladiator or arena master make sure you rock your challenger title as you finish them off for extra lolz on vent.

10. UI / Keybinds: Bind everything, unbind backpedal so you don't look stupid, get a clean ui that doesn't have excessive information and start to turn with a mouse especially if you play a melee class. Personally I have lots of throttle control on my combat text and have it a very small size as for the most part its useless information after you find out if your hitting like a truck or not much at all.

Posted Image 2k PR with Shanker Screeny.

TLDR: Play Better.
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#2 Gnomvid

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 07:41 AM

though, as a rogue, what weapons u have does a huge difference.
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#3 Poxx

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 09:19 AM

though, as a rogue, what weapons u have does a huge difference.


lol
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#4 Lamenub

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 02:03 PM

cool guide
not sure how applicable this is for rogues needing it tho
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#5 Kineyo

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 07:22 PM

i lold at the screenshot
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#6 Apathie

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 09:49 PM

I went from Titansteel Shanker and Rofsens Ripper to dual T1 relentless weapons, and my arena rating has subsequently dropped by 70 points. It doesn't matter much.
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#7 Prigity

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 10:16 PM

not that hard to get a decent rating without gear my gear sucked lot more a week ago only 730 resilience and got to 1900 but then again my battlegroup probably sucks compared to bloodlust
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#8 flo8464

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 10:37 PM

Facerolled to 1950 on my rogue with a destro lock.
No real challenge imo, got it with Titansteel + that crappy 1.4 Dagger from AH (iLevel 200)
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#9 Buggy

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 06:12 PM

All common sense. Yet some people still need to be told.
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#10 Draekin

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 06:15 PM

you got 1800 as a :rogue: in 2v2.
grats?
Quick tips: Rogues are the strongest class in 2v2. 2v2 is broken and completely imbalanced.

How about this: you take Resto Shaman + Warrior (all ilvl200 gear) into 2v2 and see if you can do the same thing.
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Seems like dos equis mis-casted the most interesting man in the world after encountering this fine specimen known as 'Draekin'

Draekin is like the best thing that ever happened to this forum

I like this Draeken dude a lot.


#11 Altairin

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:21 PM

Why the anger? It's a good guide, and I strongly doubt that rogues are the strongest class in 2v2 (paladin, druid, warrior are probably better contenders).
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#12 Bearissues

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:26 PM

you got 1800 as a :rogue: in 2v2.
grats?
Quick tips: Rogues are the strongest class in 2v2. 2v2 is broken and completely imbalanced.

How about this: you take Resto Shaman + Warrior (all ilvl200 gear) into 2v2 and see if you can do the same thing.


Would gladly. Any class can easily hit 2200 in 2s tbh - its a retardedly easy bracket.
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#13 Draekin

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:27 PM

Why the anger? It's a good guide, and I strongly doubt that rogues are the strongest class in 2v2 (paladin, druid, warrior are probably better contenders).


no. look at the diversity of comps rogues have compared to those classes you listed. rogues can pair with:

:druid: resto or feral
:mage:
:paladin: ret or prot
:priest: disc or shadow
:rogue:
:shaman: enhance or resto
:warlock:
:deathknight:

Those 2v2 comps are all pretty darn viable, and when I say "viable" I mean better than your average comp. Warriors pretty much have to play with healers...and not just any healer because shaman/warrior sucks now. Paladins as prot are overpowered and difficult to really measure in true viability. Druids are good healers, but honestly nowhere near what they used to be and can't go pairing with just 'anyone' like rogues can.

Rogues are the top 2v2 class in the game.
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Seems like dos equis mis-casted the most interesting man in the world after encountering this fine specimen known as 'Draekin'

Draekin is like the best thing that ever happened to this forum

I like this Draeken dude a lot.


#14 Draekin

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:30 PM

Would gladly. Any class can easily hit 2200 in 2s tbh - its a retardedly easy bracket.


lol no.

resto shaman in full ilvl200 gear gets absolutely blown up by double dps...and the whopping ZERO peels that a warrior has to offer means you're insta-dead. warrior with titansteel destroyer MIGHT make it with a prot pally or resto druid but thats doubtful too -- especially considering you'd be going up against your mirror match around 1600-1700 MMR that would have relentless weapons, etc. Sure, anyone can get 1800 in 2s if they play 1000 games. But thats stupid.

We're talking about getting to 1800 in a respectable 200 games or so. Sorry, not going to happen chief.
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Seems like dos equis mis-casted the most interesting man in the world after encountering this fine specimen known as 'Draekin'

Draekin is like the best thing that ever happened to this forum

I like this Draeken dude a lot.


#15 Cheesié

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:40 PM

Hey challenger
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#16 Draekin

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:45 PM

Hey challenger


Hellosir.

Love how people do that. Hows about I level a brand new character, play him for 2 weeks in 1 season with terrible gear and if I don't get 2400+ then I suck?

People are idiots.

I have NEVER played a character with decent gear in any arena season since WoW's inception. I have 6 different 80s, of which I constantly bounce around during different seasons. Each time having to farm the "latest welfare" gear in order to make them competitive. I suffer from indecisiveness...that has nothing to do with my skill as a player. Learn to think please.
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Seems like dos equis mis-casted the most interesting man in the world after encountering this fine specimen known as 'Draekin'

Draekin is like the best thing that ever happened to this forum

I like this Draeken dude a lot.


#17 Kesk

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:51 PM

This whole "weapons = everything" myth for rogues is totally bogus and out of date. It's bizarre to see so many supposedly good players advocating it.

Mutilate scales really really badly with weapon damage. Like going from s6 to s7 daggers your mutilates might hit 1-2% harder if that. Wound/Evis/Envenom don't scale at all with weap damage. The only thing that scales is your melee swing and since a lot of rogues are running 44/2/25 now, you lose a lot of white damage too.

Basically using crap daggers with high AP is better than using good daggers with low AP.
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#18 Kesk

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 07:56 PM

Rogues are the top 2v2 class in the game.


On what basis? Because rogues have a lot of comps that are 2200 viable? Very few of those comps are actually top-tier, and most rogue comps require quite an advanced level of skill (with the exception of ret/rogue for example).

Warriors have fewer comps but the comps they do have are much more potent, same with DK's, mages and hunters imo.
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#19 Primaris

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 08:10 PM

Human rogues are op.
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#20 Apathie

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 08:34 PM

Human rogues are op.


Undead racial is by far and away the only and most game breaking racial in the game.
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