Muti speccs

[Azgal]

Hello, I have mostly been playing with the regular 41/20/0 muti spec. But recently I have seen some rogues who play 53/0/8. And when I think about it seems really nice. But what do you guys think would be the best when my 2v2 partner is a resto druid?

For me the most natural answer would be 41/20 for the extra dmg, but can anyone confirm that the 53/0/8 spec would be great?

Xom goes with 53/0/8 and he is a bloody good rogue.
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Al%27Akir&n=Xom

The biggest advatage I see with 53/0/8 spec is that you can get all the good poison talents and still keep all the rest. Tho it sucks with no imp. sprint and no DW spec.

Please post your thoughts on the matter.

[JayRath]

It might work for Xom, but that is his personal choice. Just because he has 2x1 rated teams doesn't mean that his spec is the best one, just spec something that suits your playstyle. I personally will be playing 42/12/7 next season because it suits my playstyle.

-http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0ebREMoidVohbV0bZVM

-jay

[herreth]

There is personal preference, and then theres just plain poor specs.

What it all comes down to is that Xom took 2/3 eviscerate, 2/2 master poisoner, 5/5 imp poison along with 5/5 vile poison. these are all decent talents.

He also took some subtlety talents which are also decent that increase mutilate damage.

However his build sorely lacks 5/5 dual wield. Its what makes combat so great and it is not comparable to anything what he has taken in my oppinion.

The trade off of 2/3 eviscerate 5/5 imp poison and 5/5 opportunity vs Deep combat with dual wield is hugely in favor of dual wield.

41/20 is plain better in my oppinion.

It might vary a bit with team setup but thats the general outline id say

[buena]

As mutilate with no secondary tree, your total overall damage split would be 66% MH, 33% OH (unless you use ambush). DW spec therefore increases your damage by 33*.5 = 16.5%. That is more than a 3% DPS increase per talent point. Far and away the best DPS talent rogues have in any tree.

As much as I like the subtlety and assassination utility talents, and as much of a blah as I get from the top of the combat tree, it is hard to argue with 16.5% more damage overall.

[herreth]

I agree with buena. The top of the combat tree is definitely utterly bland. heck the only part other than Imp. sprint i really care about is dual wield, but that part is really good

[xomcof]

firstly ppl who are saying there is no right spec are correct, 41 20 is stronger in fair few cases.
however since 90% of my arena fights last no longer than 1 minute those 5 points spent in DW spec just dont cut it. i found as 41 20 keeping 5 wound up was a pain and having to constantly shiv crippling on ended up being a drain on my energy. ppl underestimate the power of junk poison procs and yellow dmg.

to those ignorant ppl claiming 41 20 is plain better i am 100% sure u havent even tried the spec and just read ming / neilyos posts on us forums and agree with everything they say without question. a number of rogues have copied my spec on my bg and have immediately picked up 100 or more rating. this isnt to say my spec is better than 41 20 but depending on the meta game within ur bg one spec may be more sutiable than another.

[Fallen]

Feels like you think fairly high of yourself Xom and I guess you have the RATINGS to show for it, but some questions:

If you play Mutilate in 2v2, you must get raped by Warrior/Druids, Mage/Rogue, Druid/Warlock.

In 3v3, you play the same setup as I do, how do you manage teams which has warriors ? I suppose you do like us and just nuke down warriors, but how can you nuke down a warrior if your warlock is sl/sl and your Mutilate standing toe to toe with a warrior who´s in defensive with 1h and shield disarming you ?

in 5v5, do you actually run rogue, holy/disc priest, warlock, resto shaman, mage ? Really strange combo. No doubt you can keep up poisons with that specc of yours, but your dmg is based on yellow attacks mostly and your gear is in words.. squishy as fuck.

Sorry, but people who plays in Blackout can just keep on playing in their shit battlegroup, hopefully Blackout people will realise that their Battlegroup is probably one of the worst in EU.

You got some great ratings, but the Blackout battlegroup is known for it´s strange setups which magically is on high ratings, mostly Al`Akir people in top 20 in each of the three brackets.

Hopefully your bracket dosen´t have people who boost their main team with an alt team like there are some in Misery doing :(

[xomcof]

how can you 'feel' that from one post? im not sure how you've come to conclude that blackout is the worst in eu, i wouldnt be suprised if it is but id like to see what basis you are saying this on. do you judge the strength of a bg on the amount of cookie cutter setups you see dominating the top 10s? lets point to misery being topped by a 4 dps team easily countered by 3 dps gib setups or a rogue-warr team doing very well in 5v5. nice job id say!

ua lock/mut rogue beats warr/druid and lock/druid. first matchup more dependant on DC not getting resisted on the second intercept.

right now my 3 'main' 3v3s hold the top 3 spots in the 3v3 ladder. so i guess u could say the ladder is weak. no one afaik in the top echelons of 3v3 use alternate teams to boost their own. thats pretty dumb lol, its a shame ur bg has resorted to that - they must really care about their ratings. although there are a few teams who are pushing hard for merc glad i hear late season on BO.

"disarming"??how about swapping to your chained offhand?! ur question is too general as well. right now there are scrubby 2 healer 1 warr setups, which you play outlast against ccing the warr inbetween dw/brage cds and draining their healers. or theres warrior druid dps (norm mage/lock) wherein you CAN nuke the warr and u 5-8 kite in between ks cds and keep rupture up, lock drains druid/dps and uses NF procs on the warr.

@5v5: yes, although i swap in paladin against drain teams.

Really strange combo. No doubt you can keep up poisons with that specc of yours, but your dmg is based on yellow attacks mostly and your gear is in words.. squishy as fuck.

Okay so you think my dmg is based on yellow attacks. what might my setup be based around given this information you have uncovered. maybe my setup is based around coordinated gib in select moments? how is this strange compared to nitions rogue-WEmage-APfrmage-restosham-discpriest which placed very well in the official blizzard tournement in the US, this takes the 'style' one step further by introducing cc which doesnt so easily overlap.

we have so many escape options in the short game (which is 90% of my games) that stacking stam gems is not making efficient use of gem slots imo.

Sorry, but people who plays in Blackout can just keep on playing in their shit battlegroup, hopefully Blackout people will realise that their Battlegroup is probably one of the worst in EU.

You got some great ratings, but the Blackout battlegroup is known for it´s strange setups which magically is on high ratings, mostly Al`Akir people in top 20 in each of the three brackets.

seems like uve got ur own agenda here against BO big boy. most of the top players here widely acknowledge that alakir is the dominant server with a rich history of competitive pvp as well as having the advantage of being a launch server. as a result we dominate arena among an unusually large BG with like 3+ pve servers :(.

peace bro

[Fallen]

FUCKING HELL ! NOW I LOST ALL THAT I HAD WRITTEN :(

But to keep it short:

Warrior rapes UA lock while you wait on druid to come out, burns sprint to get druid, warrior intercept, trinket, caught in howl spam, spamstring back on again, gg

start on warlock, druid comes up, abusing los so he don't get feared, you run over to gouge so warlock can hit a fear followed by a blind, but the warlock just coils and fears you :( gg, ua lock is taking heavy dmg from dots and sl warlock still got full hp because ns and swiftmend is king.

weapon chain oh is ofc an option to help against disarm, but there like 1 of 100 warriors that actually disarms. and about thw warrior kiting, if the warrior has cleanser on his team, you wont be able to 5-8 kite him while your warlock "owns" the other warlock and druid together with priest.

Sorry, but you seem to base a lot of this on that other team is just bad and not knowing what to do. You seem to think that you wont get countered on what you do, all in your favor :/

But I must say, if you actually manage to gib someone with the setup you have in 5v5, you got my biggest applauds :>

GL with future s3 in blackout

PS: My information about blackout being is based on people transfering from one of the realms in blackout over to Kazzak to play in Misery, since they think that the competition and skill lvl of people in Blackout was just shit.
PSS: Top players known world wide, /shrug. Maybe the Feel The Pain team, one of the few less original setups for 5v5 which qualified for blizz tournament in germany, but didn't play.

[xomcof]

FUCKING HELL ! NOW I LOST ALL THAT I HAD WRITTEN :(

But to keep it short:

Warrior rapes UA lock while you wait on druid to come out, burns sprint to get druid, warrior intercept, trinket, caught in howl spam, spamstring back on again, gg

start on warlock, druid comes up, abusing los so he don't get feared, you run over to gouge so warlock can hit a fear followed by a blind, but the warlock just coils and fears you :( gg, ua lock is taking heavy dmg from dots and sl warlock still got full hp because ns and swiftmend is king.

weapon chain oh is ofc an option to help against disarm, but there like 1 of 100 warriors that actually disarms. and about thw warrior kiting, if the warrior has cleanser on his team, you wont be able to 5-8 kite him while your warlock "owns" the other warlock and druid together with priest.

Sorry, but you seem to base a lot of this on that other team is just bad and not knowing what to do. You seem to think that you wont get countered on what you do, all in your favor :/

But I must say, if you actually manage to gib someone with the setup you have in 5v5, you got my biggest applauds :>

GL with future s3 in blackout

PS: My information about blackout being is based on people transfering from one of the realms in blackout over to Kazzak to play in Misery, since they think that the competition and skill lvl of people in Blackout was just shit.
PSS: Top players known world wide, /shrug. Maybe the Feel The Pain team, one of the few less original setups for 5v5 which qualified for blizz tournament in germany, but didn't play.

Wrong. Here's what you do as UA lock/Mut rogue vs warrior/druid

1) get warrior in combat with pet attack+devour
2) warrior has to intercept to reach warlock
3) wait at 5 yards in front of warlock and cs to ks the warr; force him to trinket
4) warlock gets max range
5) dps warrior, save lock for cyclone.
6) on second intercept, sprint vanish cs -> ks the warr, warlock gains distance again
7) if hes not dead by now, on the third intercept dc it.

You're so painfully underestimating UA dps. You actually think a druid can outheal UA + mutilate rogue; ever thought outside the box? OH deadly on sprint, swap to crip on cyclone slocks.

3v3; Warrior has cleanser on his team. Dispel abo, tank his 1hOPs while 5-8ing, force the druid into LOS. Max poison talents help here, whoda thought! KS the warr on an intercept, make sure abo is dispelled blind druid and DC the warr after KS. Even if they recover, you've won due to pressure on the warr to intervene and forgets about damage.

defensive with 1h and shield disarming you ?
Hey guy, you're the one who used disarm as a reason for your failure to beat warrior teams who tank you.

Sorry, but you also seem to base a lot of this on you yourself not knowing what to do.

@5v5; once again, have you not heard of Nition's 5v5 in s1? They pulled off 3 dps 2 healer with aplomb (regardless of how they qualified) in the US regionals. Heck, want me to list rogues off geekboys.org (some arent even listed) who have pulled 3 dps 2 healer gib setup to full effect? Or would you rather cling onto those misconceptions you have about what a rogue 5v5 is limited to.

@People transferring; got some names? Everyone significant who played in S1 remains on blackout, even though competition has withered in the closing weeks (as it has even on Cyclone), most of the top players here remain. Do you just blindly take whatever people say to you as unbiased truth; not even maybe considering that they might be trying to justify failing to make an impact on BO by blaming poor competition (which wasn't the case in s1, and for about 70% of s2 hasn't been the case) and 'skill'.

@your PSS, I don't see anywhere in my posts talking about top players worldwide. If you take a look at the 5v5s which qualified for the EU regionals you'll see that FTP's warlock Shagaire failed to turn up for personal reasons, while Team Deoi's Paladin [?] didn't own his original account name and Finger of Death also had players who weren't eligible.

[Fallen]

lets agree on one thing then: you can't theorycraft an arena game ?

Because many things can happen which will fuck up the CC chain or dmg itself :>

Sorry, never heard of nition :( Checked him out now, not really high rated teams but maybe he dosen't play much anymore :O

Derfel and Alifie, those are two people who have played in Blackout before and feel that the competition on Blackout is kinda low compared to Misery.

[vexo]

I this my mutilate spec is pretty cookie-cutter, I like it out of all other specs though.